Teams & Riders Tom Dumoulin discussion thread

[Red Rick]

Tom Dumoulin requires way less of a transformation than Bradley Wiggins, and the main reason I think he can do it is because he's doesn't have a big build. Altitude camps and shaving off the 1kg or 2 may be all the improvement he needs. He'll work with the bacon slicer, rather than the meat cleaver.

 

[CTQ]

@pastronef

The power of the "hair" and the "eyes". This is going to be OK with some fans.

 

[jsem94]

I want him to challenge GTs in a good way though. Not become super defensive like Wiggins was and become boring. Tom is exciting and I don't want him to lose that.

 

[Red Rick]

Re:

I want him to challenge GTs in a good way though. Not become super defensive like Wiggins was and become boring. Tom is exciting and I don't want him to lose that.

Dumoulin, contrary to Wiggins, is pretty explosive and manages shorter climbs better than the latter did. He's attacked more in GTs than Wiggins ever did.

 

[pastronef]

Re:

@pastronef

The power of the "hair" and the "eyes". This is going to be OK with some fans.

if he can beat Sky using marginalgains-altidude-diet (see link), that´s going to be OK with all the fans.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/features/how-to-turn-tom-dumoulin-into-a-grand-tour-contender/

 

[May0maniac]

Re: Re:

I want him to challenge GTs in a good way though. Not become super defensive like Wiggins was and become boring. Tom is exciting and I don't want him to lose that.

Dumoulin, contrary to Wiggins, is pretty explosive and manages shorter climbs better than the latter did. He's attacked more in GTs than Wiggins ever did.

He's a bit like a Dutch Mauri Melchior.

 

[HelloDolly]

Re: Re:

I want him to challenge GTs in a good way though. Not become super defensive like Wiggins was and become boring. Tom is exciting and I don't want him to lose that.

Dumoulin, contrary to Wiggins, is pretty explosive and manages shorter climbs better than the latter did. He's attacked more in GTs than Wiggins ever did.

Dumoulin did welll in the Vuelta with most rdiers passed their season best

And he didnt attack ....he went off the front to counter when the others would attack

I am not sure what is the obsession with every rider in wining a GT ....

Dumoulin for me is not a climber and never will be and he has to be to win a GT (unless one with rolling parcours appears)

He can lose weight and yes he will be as boring as Wiggins ....because like Wiggins he will have to ride withinh himself on the climbs ove 3 weeks and get enough of an advantages in the TTs (which he wont get on Froome)

So everyone on here thinks Wiggins was boring but its ok for Tom to do it !!!

Dumoulin should use his strenght to win a few monuments...

 

[May0maniac]

I actually hope that he does well, at least that would force the climbers to attack earlier on the hard mountain stages.
I don't see why he couldn't win a Vuelta, he's really strong on the muritos, beating Froome and Purito on the Cumbre del Sol stage was super impressive, with a bit of lack and a stronger team he has a chance.

 

[Gigs_98]

I definitely won't complain about a gc rider who is very strong in TT's but not in a good team. Maybe he won't attack anymore, but considering that he will probably never climb as well as mountain goats like Quintana, he will be attacked a lot and that could make gc's very interesting.

 

[Red Rick]

Re: Re:

I want him to challenge GTs in a good way though. Not become super defensive like Wiggins was and become boring. Tom is exciting and I don't want him to lose that.

Dumoulin, contrary to Wiggins, is pretty explosive and manages shorter climbs better than the latter did. He's attacked more in GTs than Wiggins ever did.

Dumoulin did welll in the Vuelta with most rdiers passed their season best

And he didnt attack ....he went off the front to counter when the others would attack

I am not sure what is the obsession with every rider in wining a GT ....

Dumoulin for me is not a climber and never will be and he has to be to win a GT (unless one with rolling parcours appears)

He can lose weight and yes he will be as boring as Wiggins ....because like Wiggins he will have to ride withinh himself on the climbs ove 3 weeks and get enough of an advantages in the TTs (which he wont get on Froome)

So everyone on here thinks Wiggins was boring but its ok for Tom to do it !!!

Dumoulin should use his strenght to win a few monuments...

Dumoulin attacked the GC men on 4 different occasions uphill in that Vuelta. And he attacked in the Giro last year, whilst in the pink jersey. All whilse basically without a team.

And what monuments would he win? He's not guaranteed to win them anyway, as he doesn't have a great sprint, he's not big enough to win on cobbles, so he's left with climbing classics anyway.

It's totally not unfeasable for Dumoulin to peak for a Giro or Tour and then gain a bit of weight back before a Worlds TT or something.

And yeah, Wiggins + Sky 2012 is boring as *** and I'd rather watch the 2010 WC final again then any stage in that Tour. Wiggins without that team would've made for a better Tour, as that situation has always lead to good GT's.

 

[Red Rick]

What Dumoulin definitely needs to win is circumstances to be on his side. A relatively even field and no dominant team that wrecks the peloton all over the place. That would be a start.

It will be very interesting anyway though. Dumoulin is crazy good on his good days.

 

[Alexandre B.]

And yeah, Wiggins + Sky 2012 is boring as **** and I'd rather watch the 2010 WC final again then any stage in that Tour.

La Toussuire stage was fine despite the outrageous domination.

On the topic, Dumoulin will have to step up his game in multiple climbs stages. At his best, could he have stayed with the GC guys at the Tour besides Froome? There was great homogeneity in climbing level between those guys (Bardet, Quintana, Yates, Porte, Aru, Meintjes, Purito, Valverde, Dan Martin, Mollema).

 

[Kwibus]

2017 will feature a big field of GT riders that are just below Quintana/Froome. This could lead to 2012-like situations. Where the field is so equal that the time differences stay small. Dumoulin possibly going for GT in this Giro would completely shake the race.

Well I hope he goes for the Giro this year. The line up for this Giro allready looks great imo and I really don't care if the big 3 are not racing.

We still got Nibali ofcourse, but if he's like last year then he's good, but certainly not unbeatable.

 

[Red Rick]

Yeah if Nibali doesn't mess around, Dumoulin won't be in for the win unless he radically improves. Then there's a few stages where he you can lose the whole GC just by being bad on the wrong climb. That said, I expect him to go for the Giro, even though the mountains are higher. There's nothing to win for him at the Tour de France.

 

[18-Valve. (pithy)]

Re:

And yeah, Wiggins + Sky 2012 is boring as **** and I'd rather watch the 2010 WC final again then any stage in that Tour.

La Toussuire stage was fine despite the outrageous domination.

On the topic, Dumoulin will have to step up his game in multiple climbs stages. At his best, could he have stayed with the GC guys at the Tour besides Froome? There was great homogeneity in climbing level between those guys (Bardet, Quintana, Yates, Porte, Aru, Meintjes, Purito, Valverde, Dan Martin, Mollema).

You and HelloDolly are on target.

He has to improve relatively much more than Armstrong when he came in 4th at the Vuelta to even think of contesting the Tour. Certainly this TDF with its second Jura stage. The first or second HC climb and he can start thinking about stage wins instead. Which wouldn't be too bad, really, as who wouldn't want to add to his TDF stage win total?

Giro - much of same thing. Relatively weak field compared to the Tour, but not nearly as weak as usual, but way too much climbing at the end. Some here may need to take another look at the race profiles. Dumoulin will lose loads of time even if he doesn't crack per se.

The Vuelta is seemingly beneath him already, but that's the one he should really be focusing on to see if he can repeat a top-5 performance there when he's not fresh as a daisy vs. a tired field ..and this time on a harder course.

 

[Red Rick]

Vuelta ain't happening. Not with the parcours as they are, not with the fields as they are.

 

[18-Valve. (pithy)]

Re:

Vuelta ain't happening. Not with the parcours as they are, not with the fields as they are.

The same applies to the other GTs, except more so, as they traditionally have more actual multiple mountain stages and don't have a tired and largely unmotivated field (Tour and Grio), or have the best field of the year (Tour).

 

[yaco]

Dumoulin should ride the Giro to show his mettle as a GC - Mountains will be a test but this balanced by over 60km of ITT km's - TDF may be a more appealing proposition with fewer TT kms, but is balanced with a far from mountainous route.

 

[Red Rick]

Right now the situation is that much of the Tour field, including the podium, keeps doubling up in the Vuelta. Dumoulin won't be gifted a minute and he won't hold on if it's a healthy Quintana or Froome attacking from more than 2km out. The Vuelta has had a stronger climbing field than the Giro in recent years.

At the Giro d'Italia he's got more chance of climbing with the best. If that's the case, the amount of mountains matters much less. The Giro also is likely to have the most ITT kms next year, and has for some years.. Dumoulin is quite good at MTT's so unless they're monster MTTs like Monte Grappa, they shouldn't be a major problem.

I can also imagine that if organizers believe that Dumoulin can compete for the win, they might balance their parcours to that.

 

[Kwibus]

Re: Re:

And yeah, Wiggins + Sky 2012 is boring as **** and I'd rather watch the 2010 WC final again then any stage in that Tour.

La Toussuire stage was fine despite the outrageous domination.

On the topic, Dumoulin will have to step up his game in multiple climbs stages. At his best, could he have stayed with the GC guys at the Tour besides Froome? There was great homogeneity in climbing level between those guys (Bardet, Quintana, Yates, Porte, Aru, Meintjes, Purito, Valverde, Dan Martin, Mollema).

You and HelloDolly are on target.

He has to improve relatively much more than Armstrong when he came in 4th at the Vuelta to even think of contesting the Tour. Certainly this TDF with its second Jura stage. The first or second HC climb and he can start thinking about stage wins instead. Which wouldn't be too bad, really, as who wouldn't want to add to his TDF stage win total?

Giro - much of same thing. Relatively weak field compared to the Tour, but not nearly as weak as usual, but way too much climbing at the end. Some here may need to take another look at the race profiles. Dumoulin will lose loads of time even if he doesn't crack per se.

The Vuelta is seemingly beneath him already, but that's the one he should really be focusing on to see if he can repeat a top-5 performance there when he's not fresh as a daisy vs. a tired field ..and this time on a harder course.

Giro is excellent at testing his GT ability. There are TT's to win time, allthough not enough but more than the TdF. The high mountains will be a big test.
I don't think he can do it, but it's a very good test.

Yet the Giro is never like the TdF which a lot less chaotic.

 

[rick james]

Re:

I want him to challenge GTs in a good way though. Not become super defensive like Wiggins was and become boring. Tom is exciting and I don't want him to lose that.

LOL

 

[Kwibus]

Re: Re:

I want him to challenge GTs in a good way though. Not become super defensive like Wiggins was and become boring. Tom is exciting and I don't want him to lose that.

LOL

Excellent post!

 

[rick james]

it was as exciting as big Tom D

 

[Kwibus]

Re:

it was as exciting as big Tom D

Each to their own, but Tom certainly isn't "I sit in the bunch all day" material.

I wonder what do you consider exciting about a cyclist?

 

[18-Valve. (pithy)]

Re: Re:

Giro is excellent at testing his GT ability. There are TT's to win time, allthough not enough but more than the TdF. The high mountains will be a big test.
I don't think he can do it, but it's a very good test.

Yet the Giro is never like the TdF which a lot less chaotic.

A very good test of what most here seem to think is an ideal GT, but in actuality the Tour is likely to keep the amount of ITT kms low to very low for years to come. It also hasn't seen a very hard mountain stage since 2011, another key difference. As it stands, and seeing how the two GTs are raced differently and have different fields, the 2017 Giro is likely to be a good test for future Giros and the 2017 Tour one for future Tours.