Teams & Riders Tom Dumoulin discussion thread

[portugal11]

Noooooo. why tom? now quintana and nibali have a fairly chance of winning the tour

 

[HelloDolly]

Shame Dumoulin is losing out on a big chance to win the Tour ..I dont understand ....must have gotten a big payout from RSC

He has a Giro already ....go to the Tour ...without Froome & Contador ...the Tour is for the taking Tom

 

[movingtarget]

Re: Re:

Doubt Kelderman will ride the TDF - Expect Oomen could go for a soft GC, while most pressure will be on Matthews in a route that suits his characteristics.

I would do the reverse with Kelderman and Oomen. Kelderman has proven he's good enough for a Tour GC, and they don't really need to fight for the win. Sam Oomen is a good prospect, but he has not finished a GT yet, so I wouldn't send him to ride the Tour for GC. If he improves he could be a great dom for Dumoulin.

I love me some Kelderman bashing but he definitely deserves to be ahead of Oomen in the pecking order as of 2017

He did well in the Vuelta.

 

[jflemaire]

Re:

Shame Dumoulin is losing out on a big chance to win the Tour ..I dont understand ....must have gotten a big payout from RSC

He has a Giro already ....go to the Tour ...without Froome & Contador ...the Tour is for the taking Tom

Contador stopped being a threat at the Tour a long time before his retirement.

 

[wheresmybrakes]

Re: Re:

Shame Dumoulin is losing out on a big chance to win the Tour ..I dont understand ....must have gotten a big payout from RSC

He has a Giro already ....go to the Tour ...without Froome & Contador ...the Tour is for the taking Tom

Contador stopped being a threat at the Tour a long time before his retirement.

You my friend are going to forum jail for that remark! Don't ever speak of the great man in that manner! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[Kwibus]

Re:

Noooooo. why tom? now quintana and nibali have a fairly chance of winning the tour

Whatever, this tdf course is anti dumoulin. He made the right choice.

Dumoulin has to take time in the first tdf week which is not garanteed, its likely, but also a big unknown.
Besides that he only has a tt that suits climbers most, he will take time there, but enough to overcome the losses in the mountains?

Giro he has a bigger chance of winning and he allready said before he'd rather win the giro than finish 3rd in the tdf.

 

[bambino]

Re: Re:

Noooooo. why tom? now quintana and nibali have a fairly chance of winning the tour

Whatever, this tdf course is anti dumoulin. He made the right choice.

Dumoulin has to take time in the first tdf week which is not garanteed, its likely, but also a big unknown.
Besides that he only has a tt that suits climbers most, he will take time there, but enough to overcome the losses in the mountains?

Giro he has a bigger chance of winning and he allready said before he'd rather win the giro than finish 3rd in the tdf.

And as a proud Dutch he propably makes careful calculations that it is way more propable atm that Froome rides tdf but not Giro.

 

[portugal11]

Re: Re:

Noooooo. why tom? now quintana and nibali have a fairly chance of winning the tour

Whatever, this tdf course is anti dumoulin. He made the right choice.

Dumoulin has to take time in the first tdf week which is not garanteed, its likely, but also a big unknown.
Besides that he only has a tt that suits climbers most, he will take time there, but enough to overcome the losses in the mountains?

Giro he has a bigger chance of winning and he allready said before he'd rather win the giro than finish 3rd in the tdf.

he has the TTT and the ITT to gain a 1.30 minutes

 

[Salvarani]

Re: Re:

Noooooo. why tom? now quintana and nibali have a fairly chance of winning the tour

Whatever, this tdf course is anti dumoulin. He made the right choice.

Dumoulin has to take time in the first tdf week which is not garanteed, its likely, but also a big unknown.
Besides that he only has a tt that suits climbers most, he will take time there, but enough to overcome the losses in the mountains?

Giro he has a bigger chance of winning and he allready said before he'd rather win the giro than finish 3rd in the tdf.

Exactly, "big unknown" with the first week.

Im glad he staying away from the spectacle that is the Tour next year.

 

[Escarabajo]

Ok. Dumoulin won the Giro last year. But for Froome not going to the Tour was a given that Dumoulin had a walk in the park to win the Tour?

I don't think so. Am I missing something or fans are giving him too much credit at this time?

 

[Red Rick]

Re:

Ok. Dumoulin won the Giro last year. But for Froome not going to the Tour was a given that Dumoulin had a walk in the park to win the Tour?

I don't think so. Am I missing something or fans are giving him too much credit at this time?

Yeah fans are taking Dumoulin for granted as a GC rider. He has 2 GT top 10s, one win, and he's not that much of a factor in the other mountainious stage races, so it's not like we have a big indication of how consistent he is across GCs.

One thing that may play a role is that Dumoulin has said he had a really though time after the Giro. I don't know if he couldn't deal with all the media attention or something, but that might make him more hesitant to go for the Tour.

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

Re:

Ok. Dumoulin won the Giro last year. But for Froome not going to the Tour was a given that Dumoulin had a walk in the park to win the Tour?

I don't think so. Am I missing something or fans are giving him too much credit at this time?

Yeah they are. It's just natural though. People want someone to challenge Froome. The climbers ala Quintana and Bardet and Aru can challenge him uphill but are slaughtered in a time trial. So they see Dumoulin win the Giro (a TT heavy Giro) and thus he should challenge Froome.

But the relative 'ease' where Froome beated the same competitors in tour/vuelta last year makes it clear. Dumoulin vs others would be really really close and I'm not even remotely sure who the best would be on a course with only 1 ITT (and a TTT) without Froome and with Nibali, Quintana, Bardet in top form against Dum. I think it's more probably he'd lose..

It's interesting what the Giro will bring. Dumoulin vs a good Aru and a good Chaves on, what seems, a balanced course, but what is still a climbers course for me (40tt km is too little to call it really balanced). If Froome can participate it makes it even more interesting

 

[Red Rick]

Re: Re:

Ok. Dumoulin won the Giro last year. But for Froome not going to the Tour was a given that Dumoulin had a walk in the park to win the Tour?

I don't think so. Am I missing something or fans are giving him too much credit at this time?

Yeah they are. It's just natural though. People want someone to challenge Froome. The climbers ala Quintana and Bardet and Aru can challenge him uphill but are slaughtered in a time trial. So they see Dumoulin win the Giro (a TT heavy Giro) and thus he should challenge Froome.

But the relative 'ease' where Froome beated the same competitors in tour/vuelta last year makes it clear. Dumoulin vs others would be really really close and I'm not even remotely sure who the best would be on a course with only 1 ITT (and a TTT) without Froome and with Nibali, Quintana, Bardet in top form against Dum. I think it's more probably he'd lose..

It's interesting what the Giro will bring. Dumoulin vs a good Aru and a good Chaves on, what seems, a balanced course, but what is still a climbers course for me (40tt km is too little to call it really balanced). If Froome can participate it makes it even more interesting

I wouldn't call the way Froome won relative ease. He had all the team in the world and couldn't drop Bardet or Uran if his life depended on it and he was inconsistent in the big mountains of the Vuelta as well.

I don't think anyone but maybe Aru will be close to Dumoulin or Froome in the Giro.

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

Dude, Froome doesn't need to drop others. He stayed with thim or led relatively little damage. And then blast them away, even if it's only 30km TT in total.

Dumoulin cannot stay that close over multiple mountain stages as Froome does.

 

[Robert5091]

Re:

Dude, Froome doesn't need to drop others. He stayed with thim or led relatively little damage. And then blast them away, even if it's only 30km TT in total.

Dumoulin cannot stay that close over multiple mountain stages as Froome does.

Agree - TommyD to beat Froome needs to climb better as they're about the same TTing.

 

[portugal11]

Re:

Dude, Froome doesn't need to drop others. He stayed with thim or led relatively little damage. And then blast them away, even if it's only 30km TT in total.

Dumoulin cannot stay that close over multiple mountain stages as Froome does.

dumoulin can climb as good as 2017 froome, he was super tired in the final of the giro because he didn't have any teammates to help him in the last 10 km

 

[Red Rick]

Bardet and Uran are hardly the likes of Quintana. He tried to get rid of them repeatedly, and couldn't. That's not quite the dude who put the field at about 1 minute + on a uniclimb stage a few years ago.

I fail to see how it was more impressive than controlling Quintana and Nibali on your own for 50km + on a big mountain stage.

 

[movingtarget]

Re:

Bardet and Uran are hardly the likes of Quintana. He tried to get rid of them repeatedly, and couldn't. That's not quite the dude who put the field at about 1 minute + on a uniclimb stage a few years ago.

I fail to see how it was more impressive than controlling Quintana and Nibali on your own for 50km + on a big mountain stage.

No doubt Dumoulin rode a smart race and didn't waste energy apart from his chase on Poopgate and when he got dropped on one descent but he was definitely helped by Nibali and Quintana not being close to their best. Dumoulin rode like he was waiting for the TT and never seemed too bothered to have Quintana and Nibali up the road at reasonable time gaps and then on the stage that suited him with a longer flatter finish he put the power down and left the others behind. Froome depends on his team more and more and his climbing isn't what it used to be but when you win a double I suppose the criticism doesn't matter much. You could also say that Froome is riding smart as well by using up his talented team on every stage. And the team never seems to weaken in the third week like others often do when they have worked hard.

 

[yaco]

Re: Re:

Doubt Kelderman will ride the TDF - Expect Oomen could go for a soft GC, while most pressure will be on Matthews in a route that suits his characteristics.

I would do the reverse with Kelderman and Oomen. Kelderman has proven he's good enough for a Tour GC, and they don't really need to fight for the win. Sam Oomen is a good prospect, but he has not finished a GT yet, so I wouldn't send him to ride the Tour for GC. If he improves he could be a great dom for Dumoulin.

I love me some Kelderman bashing but he definitely deserves to be ahead of Oomen in the pecking order as of 2017

The point of my post is it's hard for kelderman to do a good GC at the TDF, if he is a super domestique at the Giro - You want Kelderman to help Dumoulin at the Giro, then he focuses on GC at the Vuelta, like he did 2017 - Oomen comes into the picture because it seems Sunweb will throw their resources into Matthews for the TDF, which then allows Oomen to ride a soft GC.

 

[portugal11]

froome would have lost a minute on peyragudes if it wasn't sky the super killer machine who controls everybody

 

[Tonton]

Re:

Ok. Dumoulin won the Giro last year. But for Froome not going to the Tour was a given that Dumoulin had a walk in the park to win the Tour?

I don't think so. Am I missing something or fans are giving him too much credit at this time?

Possibly. Having said that, if it wasn't for poopgate, his Giro win would have been much more impressive, larger time gaps on two big champions like Quintana and particularly Nibali.

Not racing Le Tour would be a mistake IMO. '18 seems like a transition year like '87-'88 or '11, too big of an opportunity to pass on, I think. Sunweb can TTT with the bests, mountains-wise Le Tour '18 is not too scary, the ITT on stage 20...go Cuddles !

 

[Red Rick]

According to recent interviews Dumoulin was super overwhelmed by all the attention he got after winning the Giro. Doesn't really seem to be into all the attention, and he may want to avoid the biggest circus for now.

 

[Salvarani]

Re:

According to recent interviews Dumoulin was super overwhelmed by all the attention he got after winning the Giro. Doesn't really seem to be into all the attention, and he may want to avoid the biggest circus for now.

Yup.

Giro and maybe Vuelta sounds good to me this year.

Getting another win or a podium will be a big achievement and prove that he gonna be around for the next few years in the GT:s.

 

[rick james]

Re:

froome would have lost a minute on peyragudes if it wasn't sky the super killer machine who controls everybody

Tom D thread

 

[Bot. Sky_Bot]

Re:

According to recent interviews Dumoulin was super overwhelmed by all the attention he got after winning the Giro. Doesn't really seem to be into all the attention, and he may want to avoid the biggest circus for now.

If he was really overwhelmed by all the attention, that's really astonishing. All the greatest riders/sportsmen should be able to face such attention. If it is true he will have real problem.
Coming back to his chances (I assume CF is out of the 2018 competition): in Giro'18 neither Pinot/Valverde/Kruijswijk/Lopez nor Aru in his 2017'shape will be able to compete with TD. Crucial rival might be Landa but we all know the whole mess concerning his plans..
TdF'2018? - I hope TD after his Giro'18 will fight for The Double, but Nairo is becoming the biggest favourite.

But - the Real Question Mark in 2018 is.. Porte, Richie Porte. If he is able to fight with all his GT curse he would be to challenge all of them - TD in Giro'2018, NQ/TD/Landa/Nibali in TdF.