Tour de France Tour de France 2022 route rumors thread.

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Considering French geography i don't think it's possible to put cobbles after mountains unless you'll do unless you'll do some really weird ish with big transfers. Or you start from like Basue country and do the opposite of next year's route but i give exactly 0% chance of ASO ever doing this.
Perfectly possible to fit cobbles in the second week in the general template of the 2013 route. Much easier to have Pyrenean stages on the second weekend, spend the second week heading north for cobbles on the third weekend with plenty of time remaining to get to the Alps for the final stages, the fact that ASO are unlikely to do so is a good sign of why the Tour routes tend to be stale. Easier still to have a decently selective Vosges stage on Stage 5 or 6, then have Ardennes on Stage 8 and cobbles on Stage 9 before transferring to the Alps like in 2018. The majority of Grand Départs fit with at least one of those, although it's easiest with a southern start (of which you still have about 2 every decade, including the year after next, they could easily have delayed the cobbles by a year if necessary...)
 
The Tour continues with the trend of having an ITT after the Pyrenees. I take it that it is still not logistical possible for them to have stage 20 as a MTF there?
A big mountain stage around Grenoble or Lourdes would be possible, with the final stage being during the evening the riders could even take the TGV on the next morning.
Grenoble - Paris via the TGV is a 3 hour train ride, having a special train for the riders and staff members shouldn't be impossible.
 
A big mountain stage around Grenoble or Lourdes would be possible, with the final stage being during the evening the riders could even take the TGV on the next morning.
Grenoble - Paris via the TGV is a 3 hour train ride, having a special train for the riders and staff members shouldn't be impossible.
In the Alps we have the example of 2015, where they finished in Alpe d'Huez on the last saturday of the race. They even went further east in 2019 when finished in Val Thorens. Both of them are relatively close to Grenoble.
 
In the Alps we have the example of 2015, where they finished in Alpe d'Huez on the last saturday of the race. They even went further east in 2019 when finished in Val Thorens. Both of them are relatively close to Grenoble.
Yeah, the infrastructure in the Alpes seems to be good enough for this kind of transfers. It has to be said that the distance between the Pyrenees and Paris is longer, but with the final stage starting and ending a few hours later in recent years it should be possible.
 
One thing generally missing in Grand Tours, and especially in the Tour, is the willingness to design medium mountain stages ending in a different way than a steep last climb like Mende or Belles Filles. One way could be a Tirreino-ish stage like Van der Poel won this year (and Fuglsang in 2019). Or a long medium mountain stage in Vosges or Massif Central with as many as 8-10 categorized climbs. These type of stages are completely absent from the Tour.
 
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I think that they are trying more and more to put medium stages. The problem is that, because this is the Tour de France, every team has their best riders and almost everything is controlled. People continuously gets frustrated with the Tour because of the level of control by some teams. But because it is the main target for all sponsors it is understandable.

I'd say put several long (~200-260 km) mountain stages and test the limits of human recovery like they used to in the 80's. Even with the strong teams it becomes a problem. Yes doping is a problem as well, like ASO usually claims, but I have not seen anything to prove me that without those strong stages things are different.
 
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I think that they are trying more and more to put medium stages. The problem is that, because this is the Tour de France, every team has their best riders and almost everything is controlled. People continuously gets frustrated with the Tour because of the level of control by some teams. But because it is the main target for all sponsors it is understandable.
When did they last try a Tirreno-ish hilly stage or a 220-230 km long medium mountain stage with a bunch of categorized climbs?
 
When did they last try a Tirreno-ish hilly stage or a 220-230 km long medium mountain stage with a bunch of categorized climbs?
Not like that Tirreno stage. You are right. But medium stages there has been several.
I asked a question about that Tirreno profile at the beginning of the year because it seems hard to find that type of stage anywhere else. It is very hard if you ask me. Maybe harder than a mountain stage. But I want to see something like that as well.
 
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Not like that Tirreno stage. You are right. But medium stages there has been several.
I asked a question about that Tirreno profile at the beginning of the year because it seems hard to find that type of stage anywhere else. It is very hard if you ask me. Maybe harder than a mountain stage. But I want to see something like that as well.
Yep, the possibility for a stage like that is more limited than in Tirreno, but it is possible. I mapped a stage like that the other day with a finish in bigger town like Clermont Ferrand. So it isn't impossible. And the medium mountain stages in Vosges or Massif Central is definitely possible. Perhaps not in every version, but every 2 or 3 years or something like that. The problem now is that they almost solely base themselves on stages where the last 5 km are the hardest, so everybody waits until then to attack.
 
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I think Bordeaux and Montpelier are the current ends of the TGV, so it makes sense they like to come up from the Pyrenees to Bordeaux for the final transfer as that's more direct than changes or stopping trains down the southwest coast, and since there are pretty much no options for a decisive stage around there unless the weather plays ball (and I'm not sure ASO are likely to rely too heavily on stage 20 being echelon madness with their current love of a final competitive stage showdown, even if, if the weather did play ball, it might be far more interesting than most stage 20 mountain stages, particularly recalling ones like Ventoux '09 and Zoncolan '14 where the best climber clearly already had the jersey and no interest in the stage win.

There are direct trains from the Côte Basque, though, so something like 2018 would be your best hope for a final mountain stage, but they probably would have to go as far west as possible within Iparralde to be close to Bayonne, Biarritz, Hendaye or Saint-Jean-de-Luz where those stations are (plus the airport at Bayonne), and that of course takes the majority of the biggest mountains in the area out of the equation (at least those that are logistically possible, so not the Elhursaros and Arnosteguis of this world). If the short descent bit from Bagordi to the main road got some new tarmac, a stage going over Izpegi into Navarra, then over Bagordi and Otxondo and finishing somewhere just back over the French border, say Ainhoa or Col de Saint-Ignace (these have tourist attractions so are not unreasonable hosts) but I'm not sure ASO would be keen to have some of their last decisive climbs in Spain.

Oloron-Sainte-Marie to La Train de la Rhune via Soudet (HC), Bostmendieta (1), Bagargui (1) in the first half of the stage, then Izpegi (2), Bagordi (2? Maybe borderline 1), Otxondo (2) and finishing at Saint-Ignace (4) would be 200-210km which might be considered too long for a penultimate day. Take the possibly over-optimistic use of Bostmendieta out, beefs up Bagargui by including all of it, and drops the distance to 180-190km. But it does mean that the big climbs are a long, long way out. Bagordi would be about 40km from home. But again: unless Mas turns into a world beater, or one of the young Spaniards like Romo, Arrieta, Rodríguez or Ayuso emerge to be elite at the same kind of speed as Pog or Bernal, I can't see ASO wanting their final GC-settling stage to have so much of its crucial mileage in Spain.
 
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According to "La Voix du Nord" the circus will arrive in Lille on monday the 4th. The race will then go on from Dunkirk with stage 4 ending in Calais. The direct distance is only about forty kilometers. The newspaper therefore speculates on the Heuvelland (Cassel, Mont Noir, Rodeberg - without mentioning these hills specifically). Another possibility is the Cap Blanc-Nez. Stages of the Four Days of Dunkirk also ended there from time to time.

Moreover, they "confirm" the sixth stage from Lille to Wallers-Arenberg. A stage with several sectors of cobbles. Which sectors these are is not mentioned.
 
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This year’s edition mixed it up with a long stage. Think they should do more of it to soften the legs.

When properly used the massif central and voges are effective for this. sadly the Voges stages have generally been misused since they became obsessed with planche des belle filles.

still pining for a decent undulating tt in the mould of the 42km tt in 200.

Be nice to see the Alps go to high altitude again if the rumours come to fruition.
 
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According to "La Voix du Nord" the circus will arrive in Lille on monday the 4th. The race will then go on from Dunkirk with stage 4 ending in Calais. The direct distance is only about forty kilometers. The newspaper therefore speculates on the Heuvelland (Cassel, Mont Noir, Rodeberg - without mentioning these hills specifically). Another possibility is the Cap Blanc-Nez. Stages of the Four Days of Dunkirk also ended there from time to time.

Moreover, they "confirm" the sixth stage from Lille to Wallers-Arenberg. A stage with several sectors of cobbles. Which sectors these are is not mentioned.
Why not a 40 km TT then?
 

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