Tour de France Tour de France 2023, stage 11: Clermont-Ferrand - Moulins, 179.8k

[Sciatic]

Some different studies done throughout the years.

Longitudinal evidence that fatherhood decreases testosterone in human males - PMC

In species in which males care for young, testosterone (T) is often high during mating periods but then declines to allow for caregiving of resulting offspring. This model may apply to human males, but past human studies of T and fatherhood have ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0306453019301271

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1090513801001015

Testosterone Levels Are Negatively Associated with Childlessness in Males, but Positively Related to Offspring Count in Fathers

Variation in testosterone (T) is thought to affect the allocation of effort between reproductive and parenting strategies. Here, using a large sample of elderly American men (n = 754) and women (n = 669) we examined the relationship between T and self-reported parenthood, as well as the...

journals.plos.org

Thank you, this is great to read! This study (the first one) still doesn’t control for obvious variables re: what fatherhood could be doing physiologically. For example, men who are relatively new fathers skew toward these things: sleep deprived, decrease in sexual activity, and increased stress in managing multiple jobs (work, childcare, partner care, and others). And since a pro cyclist who is a father riding the Tour is not having to deal with these things (except for having less sex) than an average working Joe, That raises the question of whether it’s applicable.

I mean, if there’s just something about being a father (i.e., producing an offspring) that drops testosterone enough to effect performance (not part of these studies), a blunt take from this would be that teams should discourage male riders from having kids. Which of course they won’t.

I still haven’t ld that Rasmussen’s take is bull. But obviously I can’t substantiate that any farther, so I’ll leave it at that,

 

[Wyndbrook]

But he isn't safer at the front inside the 3 km, the risk of crashes is higher because we have a lot more touches and fights for positions than in the middle. Stage 4 is a perfect example of that, sprinters and leadout sprinters are crazy and sometimes reckless.

Top three all gain two seconds on their rivals.

Correction, results now changed to all at 7 seconds.

 

[Elos Anjos]

It's the second time I see a flag from Turkey draping around in the finish line and to my knowledge there is no Turkish rider in the Tour de France.

 

[Netserk]

It's the second time I see a flag from Turkey draping around in the finish line and to my knowledge there is no Turkish rider in the Tour de France.

Maybe it's waved by a Swede.

 

[Pantani_lives]

Albert Einstein: "The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results."

The other sprinters' teams should think about this.

 

[bob.a.feet]

Convinced that if quickstep came here with a different squad they would get more out of this tour than what they've got.

-Merlier
-Van Lebeghe
-Senechal
-Remco
-Schmidt
-Bagioli
-Knox
-cerny

I mean duh they would do better than zero stage wins and zero GC presence if Remco was here.

 

[Berflamand]

I haven't analyzed every sprint in detail so correct me if I'm wrong but I think QuickStep's main problem in the sprints is Jakobsen himself not able to (or not willing to fight enough to) hold the wheel of his train which makes his lead out riders having to drop back constantly to pick him up and losing each other in the process.

I just can't imagine a lead-out consisting of Loulou - Asgreen - Lampaert - Morkov not being able to deliver their sprinter in a good position (even though Morkov has also lost a lot of his touch this year).

I agree that Merlier was probably the better choice and that the selection of Devenyns is completely incomprehensible.

 

[DNP-Old]

Alpecin could win every jersey and every stage and Roodhooft would still give interviews like someone just killed his pet hamster.

 

[Eyeballs Out]

I know there's the crash but Merlier is faster than Jakobsen anyway imo. Should have been brought. Then tbh as good as he is at what he does, Declercq isn't really needed here and Devenys isn't good enough anyway. Could have brought a Scmid and Hirt instead just for attempted stages wins

Merlier looked in pole position to make the Tour team ahead of Jakobsen early on in the season but his form went badly downhill in May and June. Jakobsen, on the other hand, appeared to be on the rise with the 2 wins in Tour of Belgium including one over Phillipsen. It didn't look a difficult decision in the end

 

[TourOfSardinia]

GC (edited highlights)

 

[FrontHeadlock]

I haven't analyzed every sprint in detail so correct me if I'm wrong but I think QuickStep's main problem in the sprints is Jakobsen himself not able to (or not willing to fight enough to) hold the wheel of his train which makes his lead out riders having to drop back constantly to pick him up and losing each other in the process.

I just can't imagine a lead-out consisting of Loulou - Asgreen - Lampaert - Morkov not being able to deliver their sprinter in a good position (even though Morkov has also lost a lot of his touch this year).

I agree that Merlier was probably the better choice and that the selection of Devenyns is completely incomprehensible.

I am not nearly as much of a cycling expert as most on here, but to my untrained eye, I agree with you. Jakobsen seems underwhelming, even before his crash. Same thing last year. He was lucky that he got a stage win early on in 2022.

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

I think we can put to rest the theory that Philipsen only wins because he has MvP as a leadout.

 

[Boehmand]

I haven't analyzed every sprint in detail so correct me if I'm wrong but I think QuickStep's main problem in the sprints is Jakobsen himself not able to (or not willing to fight enough to) hold the wheel of his train which makes his lead out riders having to drop back constantly to pick him up and losing each other in the process.

I just can't imagine a lead-out consisting of Loulou - Asgreen - Lampaert - Morkov not being able to deliver their sprinter in a good position (even though Morkov has also lost a lot of his touch this year).

I agree that Merlier was probably the better choice and that the selection of Devenyns is completely incomprehensible.

I agree with most of that, except for two things:

Alaphilippe is just a terrible rider to put in the train.
He's got the strength and speed for it, bu he always swerves all over the road, making it close to impossible to confidently follow his wheel.
They should use Cavagna instead.

I don't think Moerkoev has lost touch (yet), I think he is severely handicapped by Jakobsen's poor positioning, and - as you say - constantly having to drop out of position to pick Jakobsen back up.

 

[IndurainsTdF1994]

I haven't analyzed every sprint in detail so correct me if I'm wrong but I think QuickStep's main problem in the sprints is Jakobsen himself not able to (or not willing to fight enough to) hold the wheel of his train which makes his lead out riders having to drop back constantly to pick him up and losing each other in the process.

I just can't imagine a lead-out consisting of Loulou - Asgreen - Lampaert - Morkov not being able to deliver their sprinter in a good position (even though Morkov has also lost a lot of his touch this year).

I agree that Merlier was probably the better choice and that the selection of Devenyns is completely incomprehensible.

Striking that signing with dsm has such an early effect. They really know how to work their magic with sprinters that are about to leave them...

 

[Sciatic]

I see no reason to not consider it legit.

https://www.science.org/content/article/fatherhood-decreases-testosterone

Kudos for sharing this. I will get back to you when I can read the study, beyond just this summary. As I mentioned, the main takeaway available from the study is that agreeing (procreating) is the biggest thing connected to the decrease, with a lesser association with time providing childcare. And as pro cyclist riding the Tour, Vingegaard is freed from the most demanding childcare responsibilities compared to an average working dad. The study seems legit (although it’s only one study), but the connection Rasmussen’s making between that and Rasmussen’s post race family time is ludicrous.

 

[Skijumper Roglic fan]

Hugely disappointing stage… I hoped the times when we see one sprinter winning four to six flat sprints would be over.

I cannot understand why they put in that many flat sprint stages, anyways, even in current GTs… People want to see hilly and mountainuous stages, because flat stages are boring.

They should put in three flat sprint stages during the whole TdF: one in week 1, one in week 2, and the last one to Paris.

Hills and mountains make pro road cycling interesting. Sprints are rather for track cycling fans, I‘d say.

 

[titan31]

Should just make flat stages shorter. It's very rare anything happens in them in a GT and maybe with shorter flat stages, we could get a few long hilly stages.

 

[jono]

Hills and mountains make pro road cycling interesting. Sprints are rather for track cycling fans, I‘d say.

If you have 15 or 16 stages of a GT that are "hard" stages, prepare for most of those hard stages to be raced conservatively (ie: boringly).

 

[Salvarani]

Should just make flat stages shorter. It's very rare anything happens in them in a GT and maybe with shorter flat stages, we could get a few long hilly stages.

You are taking away the most fundamental thing about bike racing, if you shorten stages.

It is a test of endurance!

These miles in the flat stages at +40 km/h counts at the end of a race, especially in a GT.

 

[Lequack]

Can't believe Philipsen is going to win every sprint stage and other teams will just let him.

 

[Peyroteo94]

Need my gardecchia stages again. Put 4 HC in a stage and give me +200km to have those epic 6 hours racing in the mountains.

 

[danielovichdk2]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1679173280597676033

View: https://twitter.com/ranidaerain/status/1679173280597676033?s=20


Some world class tactics 🤣🤣🤣

 

[frisenfruitig]

But I was talking about Vinge and Ala, in this case.

Not in general.

Pointless quote.

Lol I have no idea why you are reacting so snarky but I hope you can find it in your heart to forgive me for quoting you. I just wanted to point out that Alaphilippe fighting for positions with no one in his wheel was particularly pointless whereas at least Vingegaard had a reason to be there. I wasn't going for a "gotcha" or anything.

Anyway, another great win for Philipsen, another lost chance for Van Aert. Hopefully the chips fall in his favour at least once this TDF. If he doesn't deserve a stage win I don't know who does.

 

[Danskebjerge]

Hugely disappointing stage… I hoped the times when we see one sprinter winning four to six flat sprints would be over.

I cannot understand why they put in that many flat sprint stages, anyways, even in current GTs… People want to see hilly and mountainuous stages, because flat stages are boring.

They should put in three flat sprint stages during the whole TdF: one in week 1, one in week 2, and the last one to Paris.

Hills and mountains make pro road cycling interesting. Sprints are rather for track cycling fans, I‘d say.

Some years ago, I would have agreed, but with the supermen emerging, I often find hilly races just as boring as sprinter stages because Evenepoel, Pogacar or van Aert attack with 50 kilometers to go and stay out in front until the finish line.

But you could ask what the purpose of the 200 kilometers is - they might just as well shorten the sprinter stage to 100, maybe even make two sprinter stages on one day.

 

[Oldermanish]

Hugely disappointing stage… I hoped the times when we see one sprinter winning four to six flat sprints would be over.

I cannot understand why they put in that many flat sprint stages, anyways, even in current GTs… People want to see hilly and mountainuous stages, because flat stages are boring.

They should put in three flat sprint stages during the whole TdF: one in week 1, one in week 2, and the last one to Paris.

Hills and mountains make pro road cycling interesting. Sprints are rather for track cycling fans, I‘d say.

It is a Tour of France. The scenery is incredible and racers can follow any crazy strategy the wish. It may be boring to watch 5 hours of controlled pacing so I'd suggest you just watch the last 10km of a recorded event. Rewind to any "good parts" based on what you want to see.
The reality is each stage adds stress that impacts another and thats what makes it a Grand Tour. Video games they are not.