Tour de France Tour de France 2023, stage 15: Les Gets - Saint-Gervais Mont Blanc, 179.0k

[tobydawq]

I think it's more common than you think. At least over here in Germany it is quite common. If you listen to the broadcast of ARD, it mainly revolves around Bora-Hansgrohe, so the main focus was mainly on Hindley really. They do mention the German riders for other teams, but at a lesser focus, even though there are currently only 7 of them in the tour and Zimmermann and Bauhaus have actually done quite well.

I think that is very common to the CSC situation back in the 00's. What I meant is that you don't see that many fans of cycling who are fans of a team - but for some reason media tend to act as if that's not the case and really focus on a team from their country if there is just one (I wouldn't think that Belgian media only talk about Quickstep, Lotto, Alpecin and Intermarché for example).

 

[D. Pecher]

I think that is very common to the CSC situation back in the 00's. What I meant is that you don't see that many fans of cycling who are fans of a team - but for some reason media tend to act as if that's not the case and really focus on a team from their country if there is just one (I wouldn't think that Belgian media only talk about Quickstep, Lotto, Alpecin and Intermarché for example).

I observed that it usually depends on how many teams a country has. Back in the dark days when Germany had several high-profile teams (Telekom, Gerolsteiner, Bianchi, later Milram) the focus on teams instead of riders was much lower than now when there is only one.

 

[dobrien]

Don't call her out on such things, then she will just complain that you take her seriously when she is just having some fun.

Oh, I know what's going on here. I get to read it during the winter too; just substitute 'Jessie Diggins' for 'Sepp Kuss'. ;-)

 

[Red Rick]

Im actually surprised people say this stage had good racing.

This was like much of the Giro when pitchforks were out

 

[tobydawq]

Im actually surprised people say this stage had good racing.

This was like much of the Giro when pitchforks were out

No it wasn't.

 

[D. Pecher]

Im actually surprised people say this stage had good racing.

This was like much of the Giro when pitchforks were out

It was a bit of a damp squib, but then that happens when you have two guys almost comically far ahead of everyone else, but being almost exactly on the same level to each other. I wouldn't be surprised if this is entirely decided by the ITT.

 

[Zoetemelk-fan]

I think it's more common than you think. At least over here in Germany it is quite common. If you listen to the broadcast of ARD, it mainly revolves around Bora-Hansgrohe, so the main focus was mainly on Hindley really. They do mention the German riders for other teams, but at a lesser focus, even though there are currently only 7 of them in the tour and Zimmermann and Bauhaus have actually done quite well.

Agreed.
I remember the days of Team Home-Jack&Jones entering Le Tour as first Danish team. Ofcourse it helps with mainly Danish riders, but Dutch rider became 'member of the club to cheer for'. As well as later with CSC of which many of my countrymen regarded Jaja and Basso 'almost Danish'.
And remember several occasions being on location in Le Tour during late 90ies and early 00's huge crowds of Dutch fans colored in Rabobank jerseys.
And then the non-national cheerings of Astana, of which at first personalized by Vino but quite rapidly tended to be a fan club from a variety of nationalities.
Oh and digging my memory, same phenomenon when I entered France in the 80ies and early 90ies with teams like La Vie Claire, Systeme U, Carrera Jeans-Vagabond, ONCE, Panasonic and the like. It was a mix of solely team support and rider support by a variegated crowd.

 

[RedheadDane]

You were not Le Gac. You are a Danish woman, he is a French man. He wears yellow glasses, you don't (and Pinot doesn't either, it was poor that all three commentators saw that wrong).

Thank you for clearing that out! I was starting to have an identity crisis.
The only explanation I can think of is that they honestly hadn't realised Le Gac was in the group as well, so when they saw an FDJ rider drop, they just assumed it was Pinot. And they probably don't keep track of what colour glasses random riders wear.

A television screen is 2D, so you can't do that. Unless you were standing on the roadside.

I know... sometimes, I just forget! What can I say? I'm not a very clever person.

 

[EddyMazzoleni]

No it wasn't.

It wasn't great racing, at least not from the GC guys. The fact is, in comparison to the Giro, that stages are not raced in vacuum but in the context of 3 week stage race. The contender in this race tested themselves multiple times, and the cautious racing of yesterday mainly came from the equilibrium of strengh showed in the previous stages and the small gap. In the Giro there were no testing attack until the last week, even if the terrain was there.

 

[staubsauger]

No. Being only 49, I can't claim 40 years, but I'm definitely not new to it. But what I do know is that I've never seen anyone ride so passively who after 2 weeks had only a 10 seconds gap. Not that that we've seen that often, especially in the dark days.

I fully understand people have already forgotten the 2023 Giro d'Italia apart from Lussari, but: Geraint Thomas did just that apart from one slight move on Monte Bondone. He obviously couldn't do more tho.

 

[topcat]

I fully understand people have already forgotten the 2023 Giro d'Italia apart from Lussari, but: Geraint Thomas did just that apart from one slight move on Monte Bondone. He obviously couldn't do more tho.

It’s not obvious to me. Pog and Vinnie have given us great racing but now they’re afraid to risk going all in with the tt looming. G and Rog didn’t either. I believe there would have been separation with an all in attack in both races. But even yesterday was better than most of the giro stages-there was suspense and the prospect of someone gaining some time. In the giro, it was wait until the tt. I watched all the giro stages and skipped the tt because frankly they didn’t deserve my viewership.

 

[tobydawq]

Thank you for clearing that out! I was starting to have an identity crisis.
The only explanation I can think of is that they honestly hadn't realised Le Gac was in the group as well, so when they saw an FDJ rider drop, they just assumed it was Pinot. And they probably don't keep track of what colour glasses random riders wear.



I know... sometimes, I just forget! What can I say? I'm not a very clever person.

Colour of glasses is a good thing to notice to distinguish different riders. I noticed his glasses were yellow in the spring classics last year where he was quite visible.

Colour of shoes is even better but sadly these days, Hugo Houle is the only rider who doesn't have white or black shoes. Maybe Madouas too, but he is now quite distinguishable in a different way.

 

[Valv.Piti]

There were still pretty massive gaps considering how relatively easy the last climb was and they were only 3 left in the group pretty early as well. That alone makes it better than any of the Giro mountain stages outside of Bondone by quite a margin already.

I think this was about expected though, but I do wonder what would have happened without the incident.

 

[D. Pecher]

There were still pretty massive gaps considering how relatively easy the last climb was and they were only 3 left in the group pretty early as well. That alone makes it better than any of the Giro mountain stages outside of Bondone by quite a margin already.

I think this was about expected though, but I do wonder what would have happened without the incident.

I always found it a bit futile to try and compare the Grand Tours, due to the fact that they are in such different phases of a season. At the Giro most are still relatively fresh and some not quite yet match-fit. The Tour is where most of the peloton are at peak form and during the Vuelta especially some of the hard-working doms are probably already running on fumes. And unless I'm completely mistaken by what I remember from recent seasons, the Giro and Vuelta have not made the ITTs an afterthought like this year's tour, so time triallers have much better chances there.

 

[DNP-Old]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1680896815569223681

View: https://twitter.com/cronoescalada/status/1680896815569223681

 

[Boehmand]

Im actually surprised people say this stage had good racing.

This was like much of the Giro when pitchforks were out

True - but it has to be viewed in context.

The exitement most of us feel, relates to the race constantly balancing on a knife's edge, where even a single second takes on a great importance.

The same stage with either Pogacar or Vingegaard already having a 1 minute gap on GC, would have all of us up in arms for being "boring".

 

[Boehmand]

Colour of glasses is a good thing to notice to distinguish different riders. I noticed his glasses were yellow in the spring classics last year where he was quite visible.

Colour of shoes is even better but sadly these days, Hugo Houle is the only rider who doesn't have white or black shoes. Maybe Madouas too, but he is now quite distinguishable in a different way.

I've thought for a long time, that it would be cool if the 8 riders in each team all had different colour helmets.

It would make it so easy to distinguish them from each other, especially for casual fans who can't recognise riders by riding style and/or body shape.

I would actually go as far as saying it should be a rule requirement.

 

[Earns1985]

It’s not obvious to me. Pog and Vinnie have given us great racing but now they’re afraid to risk going all in with the tt looming. G and Rog didn’t either. I believe there would have been separation with an all in attack in both races. But even yesterday was better than most of the giro stages-there was suspense and the prospect of someone gaining some time. In the giro, it was wait until the tt. I watched all the giro stages and skipped the tt because frankly they didn’t deserve my viewership.

For this reason it´s important, that a TT is not the last GC stage!
At the tour we will have the TT now with two GC stages still to come and we know, that the rider who is in second at this time will try everything at stage 17 and stage 20. After the giro TT would have been the same, but there wasn´t a GC stage left, so no action at all...

 

[D. Pecher]

I've thought for a long time, that it would be cool if the 8 riders in each team all had different colour helmets.

It would make it so easy to distinguish them from each other, especially for casual fans who can't recognise riders by riding style and/or body shape.

I would actually go as far as saying it should be a rule requirement.

They do something like that in Formula one where the two drivers in the team often have differently coloured side mirrors or nose cone tips. But since the helmet is often part of the sponsor design, I'd say differently coloured bike frames would probably be the better bet.

 

[Boehmand]

They do something like that in Formula one where the two drivers in the team often have differently coloured side mirrors or nose cone tips. But since the helmet is often part of the sponsor design, I'd say differently coloured bike frames would probably be the better bet.

If it's a rule, there is nothing sponsors can do about it

The frame is mostly visible in side shots, so that would have very limited effect.

 

[RedheadDane]

I've thought for a long time, that it would be cool if the 8 riders in each team all had different colour helmets.

I like occasionally feeling clever by being able to identify riders before the commentators do!

 

[Boehmand]

I like occasionally feeling clever by being able to identify riders before the commentators do!

Same - and here's to us and those like us - DAMN FEW LEFT

 

[RobertCrawley]

On this rest day, I'm reading a few articles and watching some videos. I may even watch a couple of irritating Christian VdV nutrition commercials. I won't want to lose any of my tv viewing fitness for the final week.

 

[Boehmand]

In the absence of the stage 16 thread:

I just learned today, that the TT route is most of the World Championships circuit in 1980, when Hinault won on home ground (they rode it 20 times).

 

[zlev11]

Im actually surprised people say this stage had good racing.

This was like much of the Giro when pitchforks were out

yeah I dont get it. I rewatched it and I'm just as disappointed as I was watching it live. even the Giro had about 3 stages better than this one.