Tour de France Tour de France 2025 Stage 11: Toulouse – Toulouse (156.8k)

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KoopaCycling

KoopaCycling

Jul 31, 2024
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theyoungest said:
He didn't go at the foot of the climb... are you being serious? Of course he didn't. Even Pogacar usually attacks over the top.

He's not a "let the chips fall where they may fall" kind of rider, but he has been the guy causing the most trouble for Pogi in terms of having to respond, so far.
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In other words he is riding tactically. And whilst that usually helps him get good results. It also cost him dauphine 24.
Had he been less cautious he would have won that one.

i would not say he has given Pogacar much trouble.
 
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theyoungest

Jan 11, 2010
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KoopaCycling said:
In other words he is riding tactically.
Also i would not say he has given Pogacar much trouble.
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If by tactically you mean "not incredibly stupid", then yes.

It's all relative as no one has caused Pogacar much trouble... but Jorgenson has at least tried.
 
KoopaCycling

KoopaCycling

Jul 31, 2024
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theyoungest said:
If by tactically you mean "not incredibly stupid", then yes.

It's all relative as no one has caused Pogacar much trouble... but Jorgenson has at least tried.
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So my point was that even tho i'm always bashing riders who do dumb stuff, i tend to like them more. Being fans of riders who every now and then just go all out and put all their chips down. I say i'm not a big fan of Jorgenson cause he rides tactically most of the time. And i say he only attacked in tactical moments where he had little to lose and much to gain without putting his chips down.

You seem to agree. What's the argument? You can like Jorgenson. I'm just not a fan. We all have our own favourites.
 
R

Rou

Mar 20, 2024
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theyoungest said:
Then you should know that this year isn't anything crazy in terms of crashes or injuries. Now that it happens to UAE maybe you're paying more attention.
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It happens to one of the top two guys.
If Jonas crashed I would react in a similar way because I wanted an all out battle.
 
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theyoungest

Jan 11, 2010
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KoopaCycling said:
So my point was that even tho i'm always bashing riders who do dumb stuff, i tend to like them more. Being fans of riders who every now and then just go all out and put all their chips down. I say i'm not a big fan of Jorgenson cause he rides tactically most of the time. And i say he only attacked in tactical moments where he had little to lose and much to gain without putting his chips down.

You seem to agree. What's the argument? You can like Jorgenson. I'm just not a fan. We all have our own favourites.
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But who attacks at the bottom of a climb like that? Which serious contender, I mean?

If anything you're apparently the Jorgenson fan, as you're maybe expecting a bit too much from the guy.
 
Andre

Andre

Feb 1, 2020
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they could pick 10 or 15 riders at the start of the Tour and give them special arm-bands. the arm-bands would represent that should they fall, the rider in yellow and the main group have to wait for him...just kidding
 
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theyoungest

Jan 11, 2010
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Rou said:
It happens to one of the top two guys.
If Jonas crashed I would react in a similar way because I wanted an all out battle.
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Jonas has crashed multiple times in the last few Tours. Hasn't really seemed to change his level at all. But you also probably haven't really noticed.
 
KoopaCycling

KoopaCycling

Jul 31, 2024
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theyoungest said:
But who attacks at the bottom of a climb like that? Which serious contender, I mean?

If anything you're apparently the Jorgenson fan, as you're maybe expecting a bit too much from the guy.
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Quite a few contenders have done that. I would not recommend it on this stage. But it has been done plenty.
I've even seen Roglic do it a few times (and he's a tactical rider as well).
I don't see Jorgenson attacking from the foot of a mountain any time soon. Unless Visma tells him to do so.
Sure it don't always work out, but every now and then i want the rider i'm rooting for to have the courage to just say. Stuff it, i'm going.
 
Gigs_98

Gigs_98

Feb 18, 2015
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Red Rick said:
It's not about circumstance, it's about who he is. Plenty other riders go down, not due to their own fault, and they lose time because nobody waits.

But riders today are more concenred with pleasing the tiktok crowd and pleasing King Joffrey himself than actually racing.
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You are acting as if waiting for major gc players was a new thing. Exactly the same thing would have happened if Vingegaard had crashed and very likely if Remco or Roglic had crashed as well. Of course there are cases where people keep racing but when does this ever happen if the break has already won the stage, all gc riders are in one group and there is no obstacle until the finish line?

I remember in the 2017 Vuelta Froome crashing on a descent twice, solely due to his own fault and with Contador who was riding for gc in front of the peloton and the peloton still waited. Today is like the tamest example of the peloton waiting you could possibly come up with.
 
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Unchained

Sep 5, 2016
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It's a crash, Pogacar is being coddled a bit, riders feeling natural guilt, survivors guilt.. Nobody wants to be the athlete that ends the career of Messi level athletes.. If you are famous for taking out Pogacar or Cristiano Ronaldo, Tom Brady, going to get some hate. Pogacar knows the game, he will not make to much of affection with the asphalt.. Move on.. Plus he has his own private unpaid motivational speaker in MJ.. Nobody is at fault, schit happens.
** in American football drastic rule changes, cultural changes to protect the quarterback!! Someone posted about an armband!! In practice quarterback wears a colored helmet and uniform so nobody hurts the guy!! Plenty of rules so you can't be too rough on him..in the 1950s,60s, 70s they picked them up and like wrestling drove their head into the turf!! Videos of Eddy Merckx era, before race radio.. Riders would go down hard, down and out hard and nobody knew until the finish line.. Today's bike racing has some kinder and more gentle aspects.. Like the hand holding the other day!!
 
KoopaCycling

KoopaCycling

Jul 31, 2024
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I remember Jonas being in a minor crash with Tiesj Benoot in a town centre, I think it was Pogacar that crashed in a descent in 22 as well, and Jonas waited. (Jonas was wearing yellow already i think, and Pogacar had an attack countered right before).
 
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E_F_

E_F_

Jul 16, 2024
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I honestly hate myself for still caring about this lame non-competitive clown parade. Seeing as Visma and Jonas don't care, why do I still have to? Why can't I just stop caring?
 
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