Tyson Gay tests positive

[Briant_Gumble]

It was a wave of talent who had excellent training methods. There's plenty to be said about the way British middle distance running went into decline.
I'll sum it up for you....they stopped running as quickly in training.

Plus the women's track records from the 70's and 80's are all legit too, those innovative East Germans and their novel training methods (this isn't about Cram now).

 

[FoxxyBrown1111]

So who do you guys think is the best clean sprinter?

Calvin Smith? I know, somebody will come up with something against him now...

Anyway, he never was seen with braces, wasn´t smelling wealth (back in his time prize money was low, if any was given...). Couldn´t afford to "invest" into expensive drugs... So he might be the choosen one.

 

[armchairclimber]

Plus the women's track records from the 70's and 80's are all legit too, those innovative East Germans and their novel training methods (this isn't about Cram now).

Womens 800 metres times then and now. Yeah, we all know what went on. If you want to discuss track and field with me, you'd better go and brush up on your detailed knowledge.

 

[roundabout]

It was a wave of talent who had excellent training methods. There's plenty to be said about the way British middle distance running went into decline.
I'll sum it up for you....they stopped running as quickly in training.

they forgot how to train

They produced 3 people in a short space of time, but nobody that I can recall in the last 15 years

 

[slowspoke]

Womens 800 metres times then and now. Yeah, we all know what went on. If you want to discuss track and field with me, you'd better go and brush up on your detailed knowledge.

I saw a fascinating picture showing percentages away from WR in T&F. The womens were all in the 80's. Pre EPO. Does that mean that steroids > EPO? even in the longer distances? Thought it was odd or does it show the power of an untested doping regime? I'll look for the table now.

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

And here I thought only cyclist dope.

 

[Bala Verde]

OMG Jamaican runners using doping?

What has the world come to?

 

[Briant_Gumble]

greene has a positive to his name

Victor Conte just tweeted that Usain Bolts part time nutritionist Angel "Memo" Heredia testified under oath that Maurice Greene wired him $40,000 for Ped's.

 

[thrawn]

So how many of last years 100m final haven't tested positive?

 

[Benotti69]

So how many of last years 100m final haven't tested positive?

How many of the 100m sprinters of the last 30years did not dope?

 

[The Hitch]

Where is Martin V. He said Tyson Gay was one of the athletes one could believe was clean

In fact iirc he said he believed Bolt was possible because he believed Tyson Gay's best was done clean, so why not a guy who is taller running faster.

 

[The Hitch]

Victor Conte just tweeted that Usain Bolts part time nutritionist Angel "Memo" Heredia testified under oath that Maurice Greene wired him $40,000 for Ped's.

Wasnt that 10 years ago.

 

[the sceptic]

Where is Martin V. He said Tyson Gay was one of the athletes one could believe was clean

In fact iirc he said he believed Bolt was possible because he believed Tyson Gay's best was done clean, so why not a guy who is taller running faster.

Gatlin is an unrepentant serial offender, only still in the sport on a technicallity - he denied a runner broadly accepted as clean, and a credit to the sport, Tyson Gay, an olympic medal. F*** Gatlin.

I can understand a dislike for hypocrisy - but I will not countenance enjoying a cheating b*stard win sh!t, just to laugh at other people who may or may not cheat, or even people who just commentate. Sorry, but that's my 2c.

One exceptional run, at a moment of peak tapered performance, does not evidence of doping make. On one day, on a fast track, everything comes together. It's unusual, but it's not unheard of. not least because it was not, in fact, strictly exceptional -a wind assisted 9.68 the year before showed what was there.

Gay may have doped; anybody MAY have doped; but there is no evidence of it - he had a long, impressive career, progressing broadly as he oughta; his rep in the sport is as close to rock solid as you can get both in terms of humility and anti-doping credentials; he fits neither the temprement or physicality of doped ; he has voluntarily undertaken far more rigourous doping controls than most of his competitors, and hasn't, broadly speaking, tried to gain much PR out of it.

one has to be careful of simply suggesting ALL exceptional performances = doping - frankly, if you DO think that, why do you bother with any sport at all?

and thus, the dream is dead

 

[The Hitch]

i trust cram

radcliffe farah and some more of these british jokers .....hell no

cram is the piece of **** who publicly accused Talik Makhloufi of doping in the 1500 because he found his transformation suspicious, but then called Bolt the Greatest of all time and fawned over Farah as well

The bbc lost all credibility by not apologizing and sanctioning him.

If you say you dont accuse people without proof you dont accuse people without proof. Not - its not ok if the guy is sponsored by nike and virgin but is ok if hes from some african country and wont get sponsors.

 

[blackcat]

they forgot how to train

They produced 3 people in a short space of time, but nobody that I can recall in the last 15 years

errr, see in brisbane australia. they produce the jamaican sprinter equivalent in womens swimming, sprint distances. there are a couple of coaches come preparatores.

 

[Benotti69]

and thus, the dream is dead

and what will happen to Vickers dreams about Wiggins and Froome now that Gay has popped? It doesn't bear thinking about!

 

[Pulpstar]

Roids work far better in female middle distance athletes than male ones (And I'd guess female athletes in general) because they push the user to a more 'male' body type (Higher muscle mass, lower body fat %))

For men it increases muscle mass but its just not going to be as effective as say EPO once you go past aerobic threshold events (800m). Ofc it still is a useful drug in the anaerobic events ( <400m)

Oh and you could always use it with EPO for max gains ! (See Lance )

 

[More Strides than Rides]

and thus, the dream is dead

I had a lot of faith in him, but I realize now I only bought into the hype. If I had bothered to dig, I would have found that his training group in Florida, not to mention his coach, were unrepentant dopers.

 

[Briant_Gumble]

Wasnt that 10 years ago.

It was a while back, not sure exactly, it was relevant up thread where there was discussion of how many of the fastest 100m times in history are clean.

 

[Briant_Gumble]

cram is the piece of **** who publicly accused Talik Makhloufi of doping in the 1500 because he found his transformation suspicious, but then called Bolt the Greatest of all time and fawned over Farah as well

The bbc lost all credibility by not apologizing and sanctioning him.

If you say you dont accuse people without proof you dont accuse people without proof. Not - its not ok if the guy is sponsored by nike and virgin but is ok if hes from some african country and wont get sponsors.

This is my beef with Cram. I wasn't born when he was competing so have no idea whether he was doping.

Never once did I hear on the BBC broadcast "Well Pharmacy is very sophisticated now and we have to temper out excitement but have an innocent until proven guilty attitude". It was all hyperbole and BS.

 

[Hawkwood]

This is my beef with Cram. I wasn't born when he was competing so have no idea whether he was doping.

Never once did I hear on the BBC broadcast "Well Pharmacy is very sophisticated now and we have to temper out excitement but have an innocent until proven guilty attitude". It was all hyperbole and BS.

I watched a British documentary on doping back in about 1981. A doctor was interviewed who was close to the UK Olympics team,when asked about doping he claimed that many top UK athletes were. Cram, Coe and Ovett were active at that time, though of course there is no evidence that they took anything.

 

[slowspoke]

Roids work far better in female middle distance athletes than male ones (And I'd guess female athletes in general) because they push the user to a more 'male' body type (Higher muscle mass, lower body fat %))

For men it increases muscle mass but its just not going to be as effective as say EPO once you go past aerobic threshold events (800m). Ofc it still is a useful drug in the anaerobic events ( <400m)

Oh and you could always use it with EPO for max gains ! (See Lance )

Thanks. It's funny how women haven't even got close to the old records. I cant find the graphic but it was something like 4% off. Incredible.

 

[martinvickers]

I should have added Montgomery (9.78), Johnson (9.79) and Mullings (9.80) to the all time list, all of whom failed tests. Maurice Greene is the only 'clean' runner apart from Bolt to run below 9.84.

Maurice isn't Green - Ato Boldon, allegedly, called him out, privately, years ago - there was a minor furore about it - a letter from Boldon calling out their mutual coach, Smith I think.

Have to say, deeply disappointed in the Gay positive. As much as any posititve can surprise me (and that's not much), Gay was one - he's always talked the talk, and to some extent walked the walk. I had him in my small list of possibly clean athletes.

Still, it is what it is. Shame on him.

Don't know if this is deliberate cheating, or foolishness with bl**dy supplements (he's making some noises that aren't entirely 'doping standard', seems to be taking some responsiblity, so we;ll see), but a positive is a positive - unless he can prove his moral innocence, it ought to be a lifetime ban (i know it won't be, sadly.)

 

[martinvickers]

http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=5286286


says there's more positives on the way tomorrow

the bosses on letsruns says he's a well connected insider

Tour de France 2nd rest day curse gets stronger - now striking other sports!!

 

[martinvickers]

1500 .

GB middle distance 'greats' overlap and interfere with each other's career.

Cram was 1500m World Champ (first one i think, in 83) but never won olympic gold, rather like Colin Jackson. I believe he might have one olympic 1500 silver in 84, but i'm not sure.

Ovette won 800gold, 1500bronze in moscow, collapses in LA84

Coe won 800 silver, 1500 gold in both 80, and 84.

The last of the crew, and least remembered, was Peter Elliot, who suffered from, among other things, selection shenanigans.

Tom McKean came a little later, was capable. of one of fast times, but not in those guys league

They've produced nobody worth discussing since in the men's side.