- Jun 3, 2012
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Red Rick said:Treadmill **** up everything that makes cycling more than a watt/kg dragrace.
That pretty much describes every record in the field of athletic endeavour...kingjr said:What's the point of a record that's influenced by weather, air resistance and altitude and the like.
I take it that includes gravitykingjr said:Red Rick said:Treadmill **** up everything that makes cycling more than a watt/kg dragrace.
What's the point of a record that's influenced by weather, air resistance and altitude and the like.
Now that you mention it, maybe they should do it on a treadmill on a space station :idea:Netserk said:I take it that includes gravitykingjr said:Red Rick said:Treadmill **** up everything that makes cycling more than a watt/kg dragrace.
What's the point of a record that's influenced by weather, air resistance and altitude and the like.![]()
Which ones do you care for?kingjr said:Now that you mention it, maybe they should do it on a treadmill on a space station :idea:Netserk said:I take it that includes gravitykingjr said:Red Rick said:Treadmill **** up everything that makes cycling more than a watt/kg dragrace.
What's the point of a record that's influenced by weather, air resistance and altitude and the like.![]()
@Alex Simmons that's why I don't care much for records in many of such athletic endeavours
Off the top of my head 100m, 400m, Alpe d'Huez, all for sentimental reasons.Alex Simmons/RST said:Which ones do you care for?
OK, well athletics sprint times are significantly influenced by environmental conditions, as are climbing times up Alpe d'Huez (wind affects climbing speed quite a bit).kingjr said:Off the top of my head 100m, 400m, Alpe d'Huez, all for sentimental reasons.Alex Simmons/RST said:Which ones do you care for?
It's probably the least affected although the force exerted by gravity varies by about 0.5% depending on where in the world you are. IOW a 100kg mass in one location will weigh 500grams more than in some other locations.Netserk said:I would've guessed weightlifting. Afaik (perhaps showing an extreme degree of ignorance), technology (not counting PEDs) and favorable conditions don't make much of a difference, and it is a clear measure of strength.
e.g. for top climbers up ADH, a difference of only 0.5m/s (1.8km/h) in net wind speed is worth about 30 seconds on one's ascent time.Alex Simmons/RST said:as are climbing times up Alpe d'Huez (wind affects climbing speed quite a bit).kingjr said:Off the top of my head 100m, 400m, Alpe d'Huez, all for sentimental reasons.Alex Simmons/RST said:Which ones do you care for?
No trap, just wanted to understand your thinking.kingjr said:@Alex Simmons I know that you only asked me in the 1st place to then demonstrate how those I would name are also affected by conditions such as wind etc. etc.
So please read the 2nd part of that post again, if you don't understand it I'll elaborate (tomorrow)![]()
Alex Simmons/RST said:Despite the manner in which it distorts performance, I think the issue of environmental variation is part of the "charm" of such records, however for the topic at hand, if people want a climbing record it'd make more sense to simply have an MTT on fixed courses. Conditions on the day are part of the luck of the draw*.
Besides the issue of suitable locations to get a full hour, accurate measurement of vertical metres gained for a set duration would be problematic. The hour record is recorded at and can be set in increments of ~0.002%. For a vertical ascent that would require nailing down altitude to the nearest 3cm, which would not be feasible. No one is going to survey the precise altitude of a random bit of road. Even the nearest metre would be difficult to nail down precisely, GPS is not overly accurate for altitude measurements. You'd probably have confidence in something like nearest +/- 5-10m. That would be like a regular hour record rounding to the nearest number of full laps.
* The UCI used to have different categories for hour records for indoor and outdoor tracks and for above and below a certain altitude (I think it was 600m IIRC). So, e.g. you could hold the amateur indoor record above 600m.
They also used to have a pro and amateur distinction, which has sort of been replaced by those who are in the bio-passport program and masters age category records.
Thanks for the link. I'm not familiar with the practical application of that technique, seems they suggest it is expensive.ice&fire said:Alex Simmons/RST said:Despite the manner in which it distorts performance, I think the issue of environmental variation is part of the "charm" of such records, however for the topic at hand, if people want a climbing record it'd make more sense to simply have an MTT on fixed courses. Conditions on the day are part of the luck of the draw*.
Besides the issue of suitable locations to get a full hour, accurate measurement of vertical metres gained for a set duration would be problematic. The hour record is recorded at and can be set in increments of ~0.002%. For a vertical ascent that would require nailing down altitude to the nearest 3cm, which would not be feasible. No one is going to survey the precise altitude of a random bit of road. Even the nearest metre would be difficult to nail down precisely, GPS is not overly accurate for altitude measurements. You'd probably have confidence in something like nearest +/- 5-10m. That would be like a regular hour record rounding to the nearest number of full laps.
* The UCI used to have different categories for hour records for indoor and outdoor tracks and for above and below a certain altitude (I think it was 600m IIRC). So, e.g. you could hold the amateur indoor record above 600m.
They also used to have a pro and amateur distinction, which has sort of been replaced by those who are in the bio-passport program and masters age category records.
Differential GPS measurements can give elevation accuracies of 0.1 m.
http://www.academia.edu/2505374/Direct_acquistion_of_elevation_data_using_dGPS
Excellent suggestion.Max Rockatansky said:Okay. Another idea could be Pic Maïdo on the island of La Réunion.
Linkinito already wrote about it -> viewtopic.php?f=6&t=20813&p=1274845&hilit=Ma%C3%AFdo#p1274845
Maïdo is a volcanic peak, that starts from sea level. 26,5 kms @ 8,2%. There is an elevation gain 2.170 meters and the road is completely asphalted. The road conditions seem to be very good.