USADA - Armstrong

[Irish2009]

Coup d'etat at the UCI? Perhaps the UCI is now seeing sense.

 

[Kender]

there's something else to concider too

The evidence will come out in some form or another anyway regardless of what happens.

The Hog is going to arbitration (is it public or private?)

Even if both his and Armstrongs are closed arbitration, USADA still have to sanction all the witnesses that also doped or aided in doping

 

[MarkvW]

I'm putting the 'stinging' criticism down to his niavety on how corrupt an international sporting organisation can actually be....from the outside it might lok like a witchunt..even to the learned judge...

however as we all know....

Okay. I can't hold out any more.

The language wasn't mine! It was Judge Sparks' language (footnote 36, if I recall). It was so funny when Hoggy took the bait into his gullible mouth!!

Is Sparks naive? You be the judge!

 

[hrotha]

“For us, the most important thing is that we are not fighting for Lance Armstrong. We are just fighting from the beginning to defend our interpretation of the rules and of the WADA code”

It's not about slavery, it's about state rights!

 

[MarkvW]

It's not about slavery, it's about state rights!

That argument worked for about 100 years. Doesn't instill a lot of hope.

 

[thehog]

Coup d'etat at the UCI? Perhaps the UCI is now seeing sense.

Don't worry. I'm sure they're doing something completely different from the statement just released.

Just wait.

 

[ChewbaccaD]

One more thing about that little snipped quote from the press release by USADA:

I'm actually sort of surprised that they would say "where the . . . witness testimony will be . . . . subject to cross examination."

Why is that surprising? Because under the USADA Protocols and the WADA Code, there is no right to actually cross-examine witness testimony if that testimony is given in the form of a written statement (a declaration under penalty of perjury) without the witness being present at the arbitration proceeding. I view this statement as very encouraging because it seems to suggest that USADA got the message Judge Sparks was sending and that they heard him loud and clear, and as such, they are going to conduct the hearings in a manner which would satisfy any judge in any court in the U.S. that the defendant/accused's rights to confront witnesses (i.e., his accusers) and thus his "due process" rights, will be protected and not violated.

I'm actually surprised that you would suggest that there was ever going be testimony by written statement when the USADA has clearly said the witness would testify in the proceeding. Your suggestion that they hadn't indicated that before Sparks' ruling, and that somehow he forced their hand on this is a creation on your part. You are making things up to support your previous incorrect contentions.

 

[Benotti69]

The witnesses will have information about different years. CAS may not agree that the statute of limitations can be overcome, so the only witnessse that end up being relevant are those that have info from 2004 to the present. If the SOL can be breached then it may require evidence of recent doping to extend the conspiracy backward. How many witness are there from 2009 - 2011? Maybe just Leipheimer. How many from 2004 and 2005? Maybe just Hincapie and Landis. Perhaps if it cannot be established that Armstrong did anything within the limitation period then evidence beyond the SOL becomes irrelevant. Ten witnesses could end up being two or three.

USADA say they have more than 10 witnesses. Could they have 11, 15 or 20?

I think Armstrong knows the USADA case is strong. We are not talking about 1guy doping, USADA are taling about a huge organised program here and multiple enablers of that program. I think anyone interested in anti-doping will want to go back to the beginning.

If they have evidence/testimoney of Armstrong doping from 98-05 then 1 witness will corroborate that nothing changed for comeback2.0. Why would a guy dope his tit$ off and win everything, then comeback and ride clean?

 

[the big ring]

http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/1...never-fighting-to-defend-Lance-Armstrong.aspx

Who is this traitor? McQuaid? Send him down!

-

Either the editor of that particular page is drunk, they mis-transcribed the press conference, or the spokesman is afflicted with the same inability to speak English as Phat McQaid.

“As is our right, we wanted just defend our interpretation of the rules and to defend the role of the international federation. We accept the decision of the judge.”

WTF did I just read

The UCI should start up a new cycling sport stream: backpedaling. The UCI themselves would gold medal in it.

 

[Benotti69]

WTF did I just read

The UCI should start up a new cycling sport stream: backpedaling. The UCI themselves would gold medal in it.

I bet Armstrong will have words with Tweedledee and Tweedledum when he reads that

 

[WinterRider]

USADA say they have more than 10 witnesses. Could they have 11, 15 or 20?

I think Armstrong knows the USADA case is strong. We are not talking about 1guy doping, USADA are taling about a huge organised program here and multiple enablers of that program. I think anyone interested in anti-doping will want to go back to the beginning.

If they have evidence/testimoney of Armstrong doping from 98-05 then 1 witness will corroborate that nothing changed for comeback2.0. Why would a guy dope his tit$ off and win everything, then comeback and ride clean?

To remind everyone, from the charging letter they have "MORE than 10 cyclists AS WELL AS cycling team EMPLOYEES".

So at least 11 riders, and at least 2 employees. That means at least 13 witnesses altogether.

 

[D-Queued]

Either the editor of that particular page is drunk, they mis-transcribed the press conference, or the spokesman is afflicted with the same inability to speak English as Phat McQaid.





WTF did I just read

The UCI should start up a new cycling sport stream: backpedaling. The UCI themselves would gold medal in it.

You must have missed it.

This is phase 2 of the UCI's bicycle frame certification process.

Next up: All bicycles must be designed to be backpedalled only.

Dave.

 

[thehog]

Either the editor of that particular page is drunk, they mis-transcribed the press conference, or the spokesman is afflicted with the same inability to speak English as Phat McQaid.





WTF did I just read

The UCI should start up a new cycling sport stream: backpedaling. The UCI themselves would gold medal in it.

Looks like Team Lance hasn't conferred with the UCI:

"UCI has asserted that it has exclusive authority to decide whether charges should be brought in this case, and has directed USADA not to proceed further. We are reviewing the Court's lengthy opinion and considering Mr. Armstrong's options at this point," Herman said.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/judge-issues-stinging-criticism-of-usada-in-armstrong-case

 

[Benotti69]

To remind everyone, from the charging letter they have "MORE than 10 cyclists AS WELL AS cycling team EMPLOYEES".

So at least 11 riders, and at least 2 employees. That means at least 13 witnesses altogether.

Yep. But I am hoping it is more than 13.

If the riders gave testimoney to the Feds and are interfered with by Armstrong at this time is it still an offence as the Fed Case was shelved iirc and not closed?

 

[Weapons of @ss Destruction]

Fixed Herman's statement for him;

"UCI has failed to assert that it has exclusive authority to decide whether charges should be brought in this case, and has unsuccessfully directed USADA not to proceed further. We are reviewing the Court's lengthy opinion and considering Mr. Armstrong's very limited options at this point," Herman said.

 

[Velodude]

You think that is the sound of my own voice, Hoggy?

I expected to see from you a performance of jubilance to at least match your elation and crowing when Borat dropped the Fed case against Armstrong & others on the Friday before the Superbowl.

 

[Velodude]

I'm a bit surprised there isn't more jubilation here. I'm having a good jubilate

I particularly liked this bit:

I am part jubilant. Still waiting for the fat lady to finally sing.

 

[Benotti69]

I am part jubilant. Still waiting for the fat lady to finally sing.

I am more interested to hear the singing of more than 10 riders plus former employees

 

[Briant_Gumble]

If USADA have acquired most or all of their evidence from the fed case then why did they close that case as it seems to be very strong evidence.

The only thing I can think of is that while the investigation of the Feds may have proved indisputably that he doped they might have had problems making the connection that he used tax payer funds to carry out his doping as opposed to his own personal finances.

 

[Elagabalus]

USADA say they have more than 10 witnesses. Could they have 11, 15 or 20?

I think Armstrong knows the USADA case is strong. We are not talking about 1guy doping, USADA are taling about a huge organised program here and multiple enablers of that program. I think anyone interested in anti-doping will want to go back to the beginning.

If they have evidence/testimoney of Armstrong doping from 98-05 then 1 witness will corroborate that nothing changed for comeback2.0. Why would a guy dope his tit$ off and win everything, then comeback and ride clean?

I believe RR quoted LA (way down thread) as saying "Take the shot! Or you do not get to ride!" or something like that*. A corroborated quote like that will be especially damning.

*I'm assuming he was not talking about the pre-stage USPostal warmup basketball game held everyday during the Tour.

 

[Velodude]

This just in!!!

The irony is staggering!!

http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/1...never-fighting-to-defend-Lance-Armstrong.aspx

Ooops...I am 20 minutes off here....

A UCI spokesperson. Why not Pat?

Have they got him on suicide watch?

 

[Race Radio]

I believe RR quoted LA (way down thread) as saying "Take the shot! Or you do not get to ride!" or something like that*. A corroborated quote like that will be especially damning.
)

That was del Moral

 

[Elagabalus]

That was del Moral

Thanks. I was trying to figure out which thread I saw that in. Was that back in the JB thread or in this one?

 

[Race Radio]

For a while it seemed certain that Lance would not fight, now I am not so sure.

Sparks is a smart guy but even he was fooled by some of Armstrong's BS. Granted he has little understanding of the WADA code and USADA seldom attempted to correct Herman's BS but still he fell for some of the more ridiculous stuff

This might give Wonderboy hope

 

[MarkvW]

A UCI spokesperson. Why not Pat?

Have they got him on suicide watch?

Good point. Pat has been the exclusive spokesman on this so far.