USADA - Armstrong

[TubularBills]

http://www.ktvz.com/sports/31197975/detail.html

well played.

 

[webvan]

Ouch. Don't you think it is pretty likely?

Honestly? No I don't think Wiggo is using forbidden stuff.

@RaceRadio - CVV asked and then left for Manolo's team? Odd!

 

[BillytheKid]

I stand by my perception. Subjective, not objective.

You are free to believe and interpret your own reality.

I am also not an elite athlete, & therefore don't pretend to understand their motivations or aspirations.

Unfortunately, unless a Mod chooses to step in, the world in which people like you are allowed to slander at will is a sad state. Victory at any cost is exactly what you say your on a conquest against, and yet you use any means yourself? Do you realise your calling rider A completely clean with no absolute proof, while convicting rider B with evidence yet to be seen.

 

[TubularBills]

Enough lottery tickets to win. Or is this football?

Yep, World Sport... Globalization and the assurance of profits.

I wonder how the coverage network are feeling about the expansion of Kona?

(NBC?)

 

[BillytheKid]

VDV will have some interesting stories. He is one of the few guys who asked "Why?" "What is this?"

Is it possible that your boy there was sweety too, but couldn't win anyway?

 

[TubularBills]

Unfortunately, unless a Mod chooses to step in, the world in which people like you are allowed to slander at will is a sad state. Victory at any cost is exactly what you say your on a conquest against, and yet you use any means yourself? Do you realise your calling rider A completely clean with no absolute proof, while convicting rider B with evidence yet to be seen.

fortunately, my constitution affords freedom of speech.

I'm not looking for victory, I'm focused on the truth.

& will accept it either way.

No battle.

 

[BillytheKid]

fortunately, my constitution affords freedom of speech.

I'm not looking for victory, I'm focused on the truth.

& will accept it either way.

No battle.

Actually, the denuding of slander laws and international internet sites, for the moment, allows you to slander away...for the moment. Free speech, does not excuse slander. The distruction of reputation in false light is a old trick. Sometimes it may be based on some truth, but as the gossip grows it is spiced up with salt in the wound.

That's where one should gaurd against the hypocracy of going to any means to win. Especially in regards to doping in sport and your stance.

What were the southern state's were all about in the Amercian Cival War? "We're fight'en for are rites!" "We got rites."

 

[ggusta]

what's it about JV that makes even some more critical clinic posters believe Garmin is clean?
is it JV's glasses? the nerdy mike myers look?




really, it's not that complicated: you're not gonna end 4th in the tour without juicing.
you're not gonna win the races Garmin is winning without juicing.

+1000

For the love of God, tell me the guy you responded to was being facetious!!!! The ability of some folks to suspend disbelief is just mindboggling. How many people do you need to have caught before you come to the realization that they are all doing it. I am not talking about cycling in particular. I am talking about any professional sport where really large sums of money is on the line.

Tiger Woods' Dr Feelgood is busted for trying to cross the border with PED's, and the only topic that so-called journalists want to talk about is what lucky young lady will have the honors of being the 19th ho. He goes to rehab for undisclosed addictions. Then his game goes in the tank and he suffers quite a string of injuries while no one speculates that the injuries, the losing and the potential lack of PED's may account for it. Ratings tank. No winning form for tiger, interest drops off.

Now he is winning or in contention again and the ratings are through the roof. Do you really think anyone cares how he might be doing it?

 

[ggusta]

ouch. Don't you think it is pretty likely?

+1 . .

 

[TubularBills]

VDV will have some interesting stories. He is one of the few guys who asked "Why?" "What is this?"

A misunderstanding regarding acronyms. CVV and CH. All is well.

 

[Microchip]

I think it was TheHog who asked some pages back, who is Luskin? In truth, what about the lawyers we've got accustomed to hearing from when the Feds were investigating? LA has been spending $$ galore for the last couple years (on lawyers).

 

[elizab]

Mr. Polish,

I wonder if Lance will end up apologizing to Simieoni, Lemond, Kimmage, Emma O, M. Anderson, the pack fill, Landis, Hamilton...

Ahem, aren't you forgetting someone?

 

[Weapons of @ss Destruction]

Actually, the denuding of slander laws and international internet sites, for the moment, allows you to slander away...for the moment. Free speech, does not excuse slander. The distruction of reputation in false light is a old trick. Sometimes it may be based on some truth, but as the gossip grows it is spiced up with salt in the wound.

That's where one should gaurd against the hypocracy of going to any means to win. Especially in regards to doping in sport and your stance.

What were the southern state's were all about in the Amercian Cival War? "We're fight'en for are rites!" "We got rites."

Since you can`t even distinguish between the terms slander and libel in a technically correct fashion, you don`t have much credibility to comment on the topic. Since you are so heavily vested on the application of U.S. legal concepts (e.g. presumption of innocence) you`ll know that there is very little, if anything, posted on this forum which would form the basis of a libel case according to U.S. legal precedent.

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

Unfortunately, unless a Mod chooses to step in, the world in which people like you are allowed to slander at will is a sad state.

You were banned already as Flicker. Between you, polish, and Chris E, you've set a world record for number of times being wrong.

At the very least stop whining about the Mods.

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

Ahem, aren't you forgetting someone?

See point #6 of the original post.

http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?t=17471

 

[thehog]

Ahem, aren't you forgetting someone?

To be honest. Would you want an apology from him...... filthy amn he is...means little.

Retribution is moving on from this horrible period with head held high.

He'll have to look himself in the mirror. Hard to do with all that his done.

 

[elizab]

Got it. Thank you.
He will never apologize to anyone.
He should, but he won't.

 

[TubularBills]

I read Horner's comments as well. Sure he's long winded, but he's commenting on hard physical evidence and lack there of to date. Damming physicial evidence would be presumed in the GJ going forward with charges, but that evaporated.

Sure there lots of smoke on LA, but I've seen you guys running victory laps before.

A legal ruling on this ruling chould effect all sport for a long time. I think that the long delay in bringing this forth may actually be a leg to stand on. The comeback however may yield some fruit.

.

Accepted & true. It seems and I hope, this will be the final reveal? Through reflection and exposure, we will either bask in the glory of multiple charges up out of category cols, or not.

 

[hrotha]

To be honest. Would you want an apology from him...... filthy amn he is...means little.

Retribution is moving on from this horrible period with head held high.

He'll have to look himself in the mirror. Hard to do with all that his done.

When he looks at himself in the mirror I reckon the only thing crossing his mind will be "you still have it, tiger. Go, handsome".

 

[MarkvW]

I read Horner's comments as well. Sure he's long winded, but he's commenting on hard physical evidence and lack there of to date. Damming physicial evidence would be presumed in the GJ going forward with charges, but that evaporated.

Sure there lots of smoke on LA, but I've seen you guys running victory laps before.

A legal ruling on this ruling chould effect all sport for a long time. I think that the long delay in bringing this forth may actually be a leg to stand on. The comeback however may yield some fruit.

.

It's ridiculous to think that the feds terminated that particular investigation because of a lack of hard evidence of doping.

Look at what USADA has, and figure the feds had more (because the feds have compulsory process and the power to imprison people who lie to them).

And the feds wouldn't need hard evidence of the doping itself. They have the wonderful crime of conspiracy, among others, that they could charge.

It's obvious that the feds terminated that investigation because of something other than evidence of doping.

 

[BillytheKid]

Since you can`t even distinguish between the terms slander and libel in a technically correct fashion, you don`t have much credibility to comment on the topic. Since you are so heavily vested on the application of U.S. legal concepts (e.g. presumption of innocence) you`ll know that there is very little, if anything, posted on this forum which would form the basis of a libel case according to U.S. legal precedent.

So your going to quibble over the spoken versus the written. The sad fact is your right, either libel or slander laws are anemic. Can't you just wait for the upcoming election ads? Oh boy! The perfect forum for manufacutring some slibel.

When you say, someone is "trading lies," and with no proof that's just lame.

Why not, he's gives me the impression that he's......Don't state it as fact!

 

[mastersracer]

It's ridiculous to think that the feds terminated that particular investigation because of a lack of hard evidence of doping.

Look at what USADA has, and figure the feds had more (because the feds have compulsory process and the power to imprison people who lie to them).

And the feds wouldn't need hard evidence of the doping itself. They have the wonderful crime of conspiracy, among others, that they could charge.

It's obvious that the feds terminated that investigation because of something other than evidence of doping.

The Feds weren't interested in doping - they were interested in what laws were broken as a consequence of doping. Big difference...

 

[mewmewmew13]

Got it. Thank you.
He will never apologize to anyone.
He should, but he won't.

That should be part of his 'sentencing'. I can just imagine his demeanor if he were ever forced to read an apology...

 

[BillytheKid]

It's ridiculous to think that the feds terminated that particular investigation because of a lack of hard evidence of doping.

Look at what USADA has, and figure the feds had more (because the feds have compulsory process and the power to imprison people who lie to them).

And the feds wouldn't need hard evidence of the doping itself. They have the wonderful crime of conspiracy, among others, that they could charge.

It's obvious that the feds terminated that investigation because of something other than evidence of doping.

Dude, the Grand Jury called it, not the Feds. Grand Jury (5th ammendment, Bill of Rights). We don't really know the full body of evidence, becasue it is sealed. The Grand Jury protects you and I from false prosecution.

Sure it's imperfect, but a buffer serious form felony charges that have no weight. A GJ fail =weak evidence.

The USADA rules independent of the GJ...it's not a criminal case anymore.

 

[Race Radio]

I think it was TheHog who asked some pages back, who is Luskin? In truth, what about the lawyers we've got accustomed to hearing from when the Feds were investigating? LA has been spending $$ galore for the last couple years (on lawyers).

Where is Fabiani?

Luskin gets paid $1,000 to lie for his guilty clients. Nice work if you can get it