USADA - Armstrong

[Swifty's Cakes]

Crazy and scandalous decision. Hope Lance bring a suit against USADA for libel, and make some money and bring legal actions on them.

 

[mewmewmew13]

Nice work, Mr Landis. Nice work.

Ditto PS.

 

[mastersracer]

The reason they didn't act in 2010 was because of the Federal Investigation. They stated this at the time. That they'd wait for its conclusion before acting.

USADA have also being interviewing riders since 09/10 and collecting evidence. They have also been in touch with "bodies" in Europe whom have also passed on evidence.

Lets not get silly here.

plus USADA gave him until June 8 to appear to discuss these issues. He refused. They proceeded.

more generally, don't underestimate how punitive a lifetime ban from sport is going to be for him.

 

[GotDropped]

I disagree. If they could have acted they would.

I suspect that when they say the samples are consistent with doping, they do not mean that they prove doping by themselves. So they likely do not classify as positive tests.

Pellizotti was suspended for "irregular blood values" and/or "suspicious values" and that was enough for a 2 year ban. Not one positive test. Not sure how these descripcions compare to "the samples are consistent with doping", but for me, I would prefer to be accussed of "suspicios values" than "samples consistent with doping".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franco_Pellizotti

 

[WinterRider]

Did you even read what I wrote? Who said anything any positives tests.

Time waster.

You replied to Ninety5rpm was talking about the tests from 2009/2010, and was asking why they didn't act on the 2009/2010 tests. I was referring to his post while quoting you, since your response implied they were ignored soley because of the investigation.

As I stated, they would not have been actual positive tests, or else they would have acted sooner.

 

[Swifty's Cakes]

Pellizotti was suspended for "irregular blood values" and/or "suspicious values" and that was enough for a 2 year ban. Not one positive test. Not sure how these descripcions compare to "the samples are consistent with doping", but for me, I would prefer to be accussed of "suspicios values" than "samples consistent with doping".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franco_Pellizotti

displaying my ignorance here but what is the difference? On the face of it there doesn't seem like there is much between them.

 

[thehog]

Hang on. I thought there's was only 12 users on the forum!!

 

[MacRoadie]

So the letter is dated yesterday, 6/12/12.

Wasn't that a Tuesday?

 

[Kender]

if they do to lance what they did to bjarne Riis, he'll stay in the books with a note that he doped. at best if they act fast he can only lose his 2005 win due to the 8 year limitations. they didnt strip Zabel of his wins after he confessed either as far as i know (it was also after the 8 year limit ran out)

ok after reading this http://online.wsj.com/public/resources/documents/armstrongcharging0613.pdf i might have to rebut myself

in the section under "Review Board Process" it has this to say (last paragraph)

It is also the law that evidence of doping throughout the entire time period described is relevant and will be admissible in any hearing for at least 2 reasons: (1) evidence of doping and evidence of conspiratorial acts outside any applicable limitations period can be used to corroborate evidence within the limitations period, and (2) as explained in USADA v. Hellebuyck (copy provided in Attachment D) results outside the limitations period can be disqualified where reliance on the statue of limitations has been waived through false statements, fraudulent concealment or other wrongful conduct.

In short, if LA had have stayed retired they could do nothing. Now that they have evidence he doped on return, they can use all his 13 years from 1998 to 2010 to hang him up by the short and curlys, and strip him of everything.
If that happens, it would have to go down as the biggest failed comeback in the history of sport

The other thing i noted in the letter was all 5 are being charged as a consolidated case. If one goes down they all go down.

 

[Anonymous]

so the letter is dated yesterday, 6/12/12.

Wasn't that a tuesday?

Oh GAWD

 

[Epicycle]

I disagree. If they could have acted they would.

I suspect that when they say the samples are consistent with doping, they do not mean that they prove doping by themselves. So they likely do not classify as positive tests.

It's like Kayle Leogrande, he was USADA's first "non-analytical" positive. He had an EPO result that was only suspicious, not positive, at Superweek in 2007. Eventually USADA charged him because he'd told a team staff member about using EPO then, and Joe Papp produced a photo of Kayle at Joe's house holding an EPO vial with a note that said thanks Joe and how much Kayle paid for it. And Kayle was suspended after it went to arbitration.

The difference here is that USADA might not have corroborating evidence for a specific suspicious sample like with Leogrande, although the TdS sample might work. If a specific suspicious sample can't be corroborated then I'm sure USADA is planning to win the arbitration with an avalanche of damning evidence, including a lot of eyewitness testimony.

 

[GotDropped]

displaying my ignorance here but what is the difference?

Exactly my case. I am far from an expert on blood values, but if you can suspend a guy for "suspicious values", why couldn't you for "samples consistent with doping"?

It was my reply to WinterRider who said:

"I suspect that when they say the samples are consistent with doping, they do not mean that they prove doping by themselves. So they likely do not classify as positive tests."

 

[TexPat]

Thanks. I'm headed to the framing shop right now.

 

[ferryman]

It says that they "engaged in a massive doping conspiracy from 1998-2011" and cites the testimony of more than 10 cyclists. Michele Ferrari is one of the named doctors.

In its letter, USADA says Armstrong used EPO, blood transfusions, testosterone, corticosteroids and masking agents as well as distributed them and administered them to others.


Music to my ears. Bye Lance. Lying piece of sh.t hypocrite!

Also "as well as cycling team employees". But no more detail about who, what team(s) or how many that I could see after a quick and tired read at this time.

 

[thehog]

So the letter is dated yesterday, 6/12/12.

Wasn't that a Tuesday?

Yay!!!




.......

 

[sniper]

a couple of times in the letter they say "to reduce clearance time"
(e.g. w.r.t. microdosing).
shouldn't that be "to increase clearence time" ?

 

[Anonymous]

ok after reading this http://online.wsj.com/public/resources/documents/armstrongcharging0613.pdf i might have to rebut myself

in the section under "Review Board Process" it has this to say (last paragraph)



In short, if LA had have stayed retired they could do nothing. Now that they have evidence he doped on return, they can use all his 13 years from 1998 to 2010 to hang him up by the short and curlys, and strip him of everything.
If that happens, it would have to go down as the biggest failed comeback in the history of sport

The other thing i noted in the letter was all 5 are being charged as a consolidated case. If one goes down they all go down.

Pure hubris.

And a pretty big divorce settlement.

Funny thing.... the only race he won was Nevada City. That, inandofitself equals epic failure.

 

[GotDropped]

ok after reading this http://online.wsj.com/public/resources/documents/armstrongcharging0613.pdf i might have to rebut myself

in the section under "Review Board Process" it has this to say (last paragraph)



In short, if LA had have stayed retired they could do nothing. Now that they have evidence he doped on return, they can use all his 13 years from 1998 to 2010 to hang him up by the short and curlys, and strip him of everything.
If that happens, it would have to go down as the biggest failed comeback in the history of sport

The other thing i noted in the letter was all 5 are being charged as a consolidated case. If one goes down they all go down.

He'll be regretting not re-hiring Landis until the day he dies. He probably could have just paid a million bucks at the time... and got him on to some other pro tour team.

 

[21switchbacks]

my copy has lipstick marks on it... is that ok?

Are the pages stuck together yet?

 

[Lanark]

a couple of times in the letter they say "to reduce clearance time"
(e.g. w.r.t. microdosing).
shouldn't that be "to increase clearence time" ?

No, clearance time is the time it takes for the stuff to leave your body (i.e. how long it can be detected).

 

[mastersracer]

Exactly my case. I am far from an expert on blood values, but if you can suspend a guy for "suspicious values", why couldn't you for "samples consistent with doping"?

It was my reply to WinterRider who said:

"I suspect that when they say the samples are consistent with doping, they do not mean that they prove doping by themselves. So they likely do not classify as positive tests."

This is not simply returning a positive sample. The charges are use, possession, trafficking, administration to others, assisting, encouraging, aiding, abetting, covering up, other complicity, and aggravating circumstances spanning from prior to 1996 to 2011. In other words, the biggest doping scandal in sporting history...

 

[GotDropped]

a couple of times in the letter they say "to reduce clearance time"
(e.g. w.r.t. microdosing).
shouldn't that be "to increase clearence time" ?

It probably means "to reduce clearance time" from the body in order to obtain a "clean" test.

 

[Bala Verde]

Yay!!!




.......

Good job Hog. I knew you had it in you. It's all about the posting, and you clearly work harder than anyone else here on the boards.

 

[Anonymous]

This is not simply returning a positive sample. The charges are use, possession, trafficking, administration to others, assisting, encouraging, aiding, abetting, covering up, other complicity, and aggravating circumstances spanning from prior to 1996 to 2011. In other words, the biggest doping scandal in sporting history...

Yep.. Love the repetitive use of the word 'conspiracy.'

 

[thehog]

Front page Sydney Morning Herald.

Sweet.