USADA - Armstrong

[OldManThyme]

doubt hincapie will talk about anything for many years.

I agree. Think he's been on the bench knowing he will if he has to, but now he doesn't so won't. Unless others go to arbitration?

it's an absurdity. USADA has ensured division in the sport for years to come. i think there will be a lot of backlash on why they had to go so far back. UCI and pros won't recognise it. even armstrong's critics feeling empty tonight.

Again, i agree. It's all an absurdity. Lance is one massive absurdity. The UCI and all the bodies, including USADA, have played their part in letting things continue for so many years. As the judge noted. But it's past the time for half measures. It's now or never. Clean things up properly now or it'll never happen.

 

[TubularBills]

Hey when you look at like that...it's still a record:

7 TDF.....DQs.

Just replace DQ with:

The Clinic

Ladies and Gentlemen we have a Winner!

Congratulations and Chapeau to the faithful clinicians, we did not falter.

Sir Travis

 

[Turner29]

I just pre-ordered Tyler's book from Amazon. It will arrive on release day, Sept. 18th. Giddy.

M

As much as I loathe Tyler nearly as much as I loathe Lance, I will get the book to help keep it on the shelves!

 

[eyemgh]

Stripped Titles...

As much as I dislike LA and like Jan, I do have a problem with giving the title to the runners up. Lance didn't cheat Ulrich. He beat him on an even playing ground because Jan wasn't as disciplined. You know he had the best juice too. I don't believe everyone cheated, bumonos do you decide who didn't? If UCI and ASO had any credibility, they'd just vacate those years and treat them like they never happened.

M

 

[ÅSBJÖRN BENKT]

This has to be good for sales of Hamilton's book. I hope he lays everything bare.

i think it will be a defense of the widespread doping culture of the era. it won't all be bad for armstrong on that front.

 

[jackwolf]

https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&...vbWFpbnxueWRuZG9jc3xneDo0NWQ1MWMzMmE3MWU0NThl

Henman's letter to USADA.

They're still claiming innocence.

Reminds me of somebody I once saw having the **** beat out of him, asked for mercy, then walked away limping and saying "I haven't been beat." Many 10-year-olds are more mature than that.

 

[ÅSBJÖRN BENKT]

Taylor Phinney‏ tweet:

1 thing I will say abt @lancearmstrong is that he was integral in bringing this @USAProChallenge to life. And this race ROCKS. #usapro

 

[Turner29]

As much as I dislike LA and like Jan, I do have a problem with giving the title to the runners up. Lance didn't cheat Ulrich. He beat him on an even playing ground because Jan wasn't as disciplined. You know he had the best juice too. I don't believe everyone cheated, bumonos do you decide who didn't? If UCI and ASO had any credibility, they'd just vacate those years and treat them like they never happened.

M

My problem with doping is that doping does not level the playing field. Rather, winners are decided by riders and their program. Clearly, no rider benefitted more from a "program" than Lance Armstrong and the possibility exists that with the US Postal program, he would not have won any TdFs, as is evident from his Motorola days.

 

[BroDeal]

i think it will be a defense of the widespread doping culture of the era. it won't all be bad for armstrong on that front.

That is not Armstrong's front. Armtrong's front is "I didn't dope. I passed all those tests. But I am tired of fighting it and need to concentrate on being the Cancer Jesus." It won't do him much good for Hamilton to tell about the doping that went on at Postal.

 

[python]

Didn't I tell you friends that everything will be alright!

Botanybay, you are right, only a coward would chose that road.

A guilty coward...few things I disdain more in grown up man than cowardice.

 

[krinaman]

Just tossing it out there: did anyone consider the possibility that LA made a deal with the USADA?

 

[QuickStepper]

Here's yet another question for anyone who has any idea how this stuff may evolve.

USADA will issue sanctions. Among the sanctions that the media are reporting is the obligation of the sanctioned athlete to forfeit all prizes and purse money from the events in which the results are now being sanctioned.

So USADA says he should be stripped of his TDF wins. Let's assume that ASO and UCI both go along with that, and Lance's name is removed from the winner's list for every Tour from 1999 until 2005.

But how do they get the money back? And who actually goes after the prize money? I don't think USADA has the power or even the jurisdiction to do that, and surely if they try to impose that sort of "sanction" by bringing suit here in the U.S. to recover all the prize money that Armstrong won, there would be a huge fight about that. Would ASO really try to get back the money that was paid to Armstrong? And I'm unclear about this: I thought that most of the TDF money was paid to the team, not to the rider and that in turn, the team pays the rider.

Anyone got any insight into how the monetary side of the sanctions might work based on anything that they know of that has occurred in the past when an athlete has been sanctioned?

 

[Turner29]

That is not Armstrong's front. Armtrong's front is "I didn't dope. I passed all those tests.

Correct -- "I did not cheat."

 

[QuickStepper]

Just tossing it out there: did anyone consider the possibility that LA made a deal with the USADA?

Keep tossing. There was no deal here.

 

[86TDFWinner]

Taylor Phinney‏ tweet:

1 thing I will say abt @lancearmstrong is that he was integral in bringing this @USAProChallenge to life. And this race ROCKS. #usapro

Huh? all the "US PRO CHALLENGE" is is a re-branding of the Coors Classic, pretty much the same routes/cities/etc.. Pharmstrong wasnt.that "integral" in it, folks just decided to bring the race back.

 

[BroDeal]

Correct -- "I did not cheat."

I did not have an "unfair advantage"...

Deep thoughts from Slowb!tch, where disco lives forever:

"If you guys think this is over you are idiots. This is just starting. Lance has already set up many that will come to his rescue. I dont know who they are but expect them to start coming our of the woodwork... oh wait...UCI already came out who will be the next. He is now going to show USADA how it is done when you want to crush somebody. USADA will be crushed like a bug. He gave them a chance to back down and now this is going to get ugly for USADA."

 

[eyemgh]

My problem with doping is that doping does not level the playing field. Rather, winners are decided by riders and their program. Clearly, no rider benefitted more from a "program" than Lance Armstrong and the possibility exists that with the US Postal program, he would not have won any TdFs, as is evident from his Motorola days.

No doubt. Look at a moron like Ricco who almost killed himself. He was juiced, but not very skillfully. I believe Jan, like Lance, benefitted from a fully mature, well funded program. That puts those two on equal footing. Jan counted sausages and beers while Lance was counting grams of chicken. There is the difference.

M

 

[Berzin]

Even armstrong's critics feeling empty tonight.

Dream on. I was so happy I was jumping for joy.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

That is not Armstrong's front. Armtrong's front is "I didn't dope. I passed all those tests. But I am tired of fighting it and need to concentrate on being the Cancer Jesus." It won't do him much good for Hamilton to tell about the doping that went on at Postal.

Exactly.
Poor guy - he is tired of being tired, and he needs that energy to bring awareness to the 5 people who will get cancer and his 28 million children.

 

[MarkvW]

My problem with doping is that doping does not level the playing field. Rather, winners are decided by riders and their program. Clearly, no rider benefitted more from a "program" than Lance Armstrong and the possibility exists that with the US Postal program, he would not have won any TdFs, as is evident from his Motorola days.

Yeah. The "who doped more" argument is really silly. It's more of a combination between the "who doped better" and "who responded best."

 

[ÅSBJÖRN BENKT]

That is not Armstrong's front. Armtrong's front is "I didn't dope. I passed all those tests. But I am tired of fighting it and need to concentrate on being the Cancer Jesus." It won't do him much good for Hamilton to tell about the doping that went on at Postal.

most people know about the doping. it's whether you think it effected whether he deserved to win or not that most people care about. if you have a guy tacitly justify it all and showing how widespread and accepted it was, that will help armstrong. especially now. i bet tyler will go out of his way not to fall into the trap of making the book a vendetta - another plus for LA. what's more damaging is the personality stories.

 

[BroDeal]

Here's yet another question for anyone who has any idea how this stuff may evolve.

USADA will issue sanctions. Among the sanctions that the media are reporting is the obligation of the sanctioned athlete to forfeit all prizes and purse money from the events in which the results are now being sanctioned.

So USADA says he should be stripped of his TDF wins. Let's assume that ASO and UCI both go along with that, and Lance's name is removed from the winner's list for every Tour from 1999 until 2005.

But how do they get the money back? And who actually goes after the prize money? I don't think USADA has the power or even the jurisdiction to do that, and surely if they try to impose that sort of "sanction" by bringing suit here in the U.S. to recover all the prize money that Armstrong won, there would be a huge fight about that. Would ASO really try to get back the money that was paid to Armstrong? And I'm unclear about this: I thought that most of the TDF money was paid to the team, not to the rider and that in turn, the team pays the rider.

Anyone got any insight into how the monetary side of the sanctions might work based on anything that they know of that has occurred in the past when an athlete has been sanctioned?

Has prize money been repaid by any doper in cycling? It gets divided by the teammates plus the DS. The other riders cannot be expected to cough up their share.

 

[FoxxyBrown1111]

Just reminds me of SCA.
It would be great if they sue Armstrong, b/c he is no TdF winner anymore. Now the witness must become public.
All up to SCA now (once the titles are stripped)...
If i´d be SCA, i´d side with USADA.

Here's yet another question for anyone who has any idea how this stuff may evolve.

USADA will issue sanctions. Among the sanctions that the media are reporting is the obligation of the sanctioned athlete to forfeit all prizes and purse money from the events in which the results are now being sanctioned.

So USADA says he should be stripped of his TDF wins. Let's assume that ASO and UCI both go along with that, and Lance's name is removed from the winner's list for every Tour from 1999 until 2005.

But how do they get the money back? And who actually goes after the prize money? I don't think USADA has the power or even the jurisdiction to do that, and surely if they try to impose that sort of "sanction" by bringing suit here in the U.S. to recover all the prize money that Armstrong won, there would be a huge fight about that. Would ASO really try to get back the money that was paid to Armstrong? And I'm unclear about this: I thought that most of the TDF money was paid to the team, not to the rider and that in turn, the team pays the rider.

Anyone got any insight into how the monetary side of the sanctions might work based on anything that they know of that has occurred in the past when an athlete has been sanctioned?

 

[WinterRider]

http://www.cbc.ca/m/touch/news/stor...ng-lance-armstrong-doping-appeal-charges.html

Here is a Canadian take. The best part is this:


"Travis Tygart, USADA's chief executive, said Armstrong would also be hit with a lifetime ban on Friday."

On the whole they told it like it is, even giving mention of the Andreus and the hospital room.

 

[DomesticDomestique]

Screen Shot 2012-08-23 at 10.08.51 PM.png

Oh the irony