Teams & Riders Vincenzo Nibali discussion thread

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Re: Re:

huge said:
I must have missed something.
When exactly did he lose his reputation? An according to whom?
Really interested in the answer!
Why you are even answering to such post :)
it is not worth reaction, if you will get answer, it will be simmilar post like previous one
 
Aug 31, 2012
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The reputation of being able to climb with the best climbers, and in general, compete with the best GT riders if they don't crash out,
To be fair, we still don't know how 2014 Nibali would have fared. The argument is a bit like with Contador: Both times he got spanked by Froome at the Tour, he was not at his best. The same is true for Nibali in 2015.
 
Re:

SeriousSam said:
The reputation of being able to climb with the best climbers, and in general, compete with the best GT riders if they don't crash out,
To be fair, we still don't know how 2014 Nibali would have fared. The argument is a bit like with Contador: Both times he got spanked by Froome at the Tour, he was not at his best. The same is true for Nibali in 2015.
Shh, you arent allowed to spew such blasphemy in here!
 
Aug 16, 2011
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Re:

SeriousSam said:
The reputation of being able to climb with the best climbers, and in general, compete with the best GT riders if they don't crash out,
To be fair, we still don't know how 2014 Nibali would have fared. The argument is a bit like with Contador: Both times he got spanked by Froome at the Tour, he was not at his best. The same is true for Nibali in 2015.
I think most cycling fans will be able to realize that 2015 for Nibali (in regards to his stage racing results) was largely an off year and that he still is the attacking rider we all know him for.

The way he won the stage in the Tour, his Lombardia result, and results in the races leading up to it help to show this.

Having an off year where a top tier riders results in the GT's are lackluster is nothing new. We've seen it happen with Contador, Froome, and many others.
 
Re:

SeriousSam said:
The reputation of being able to climb with the best climbers, and in general, compete with the best GT riders if they don't crash out,
To be fair, we still don't know how 2014 Nibali would have fared. The argument is a bit like with Contador: Both times he got spanked by Froome at the Tour, he was not at his best. The same is true for Nibali in 2015.
Who cares about labels like 'climbing with the best climbers and competing with the best who dont crash out'?
Like who? Nairo and Aru? 1 GT each while Nibz has all GTs in his pocket plus a monument and probably more to come.

And even if Nairo and Aru win in the future, since its not vs. peak Froome and Contador those GTs obviously wont mean anything :rolleyes:
 
Re: Re:

Afrank said:
SeriousSam said:
The reputation of being able to climb with the best climbers, and in general, compete with the best GT riders if they don't crash out,
To be fair, we still don't know how 2014 Nibali would have fared. The argument is a bit like with Contador: Both times he got spanked by Froome at the Tour, he was not at his best. The same is true for Nibali in 2015.
I think most cycling fans will be able to realize that 2015 for Nibali (in regards to his stage racing results) was largely an off year and that he still is the attacking rider we all know him for.

The way he won the stage in the Tour, his Lombardia result, and results in the races leading up to it help to show this.

Having an off year where a top tier riders results in the GT's are lackluster is nothing new. We've seen it happen with Contador, Froome, and many others.
do you imply 2012 as froome's off year? there are 4 top dogs out there and they clearly cannot settle all the gt wins every season just for the reason their goals constantly intersect. but i don't think that's the reason to call any non-gt win year a complete failure. in the tour nibs was decent. he was just unlucky to have a really terrible day on pierre-saint-martin.
 
Aug 16, 2011
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Re: Re:

dacooley said:
Afrank said:
SeriousSam said:
The reputation of being able to climb with the best climbers, and in general, compete with the best GT riders if they don't crash out,
To be fair, we still don't know how 2014 Nibali would have fared. The argument is a bit like with Contador: Both times he got spanked by Froome at the Tour, he was not at his best. The same is true for Nibali in 2015.
I think most cycling fans will be able to realize that 2015 for Nibali (in regards to his stage racing results) was largely an off year and that he still is the attacking rider we all know him for.

The way he won the stage in the Tour, his Lombardia result, and results in the races leading up to it help to show this.

Having an off year where a top tier riders results in the GT's are lackluster is nothing new. We've seen it happen with Contador, Froome, and many others.
do you imply 2012 as froome's off year? there are 4 top dogs out there and they clearly cannot settle all the gt wins every season just for the reason their goals constantly intersect. but i don't think that's the reason to call any non-gt win year a complete failure. in the tour nibs was decent. he was just unlucky to have a really terrible day on pierre-saint-martin.
Yes, 2012 or maybe 2014. Still got some good results both years though. I agree, not winning a grand tour in one year doesn't mean it was a failure by any means. Nibali did a good job of salvaging his Tour with his stage win and making it up to 4th in GC.

For me, looking at the past 6 years of his career and his GT results, this year stands out as the "off year" (in respect to GT results) due to no podiums and DNFing the Vuelta. That doesn't mean at all it's a failure of a year though. This is the year he captured his first monument. And that win alone makes it a special and/or good year.
 
Aug 16, 2011
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Of the years Froome has been competitive, 2012 at this point is more off than the other ones mostly because of how he faded in the Vuelta and to a lesser extent how he spent the Tour in service to Wiggo.

There's not a clear cut off year for Froome though. It's entirely objective of course. Where as with other riders it is more certain. For example Contador's 2013 was pretty off. And of course his entire career has been rather strange in it's evolution.
 
Re:

Afrank said:
Of the years Froome has been competitive, 2012 at this point is more off than the other ones mostly because of how he faded in the Vuelta and to a lesser extent how he spent the Tour in service to Wiggo.

There's not a clear cut off year for Froome though. It's entirely objective of course. Where as with other riders it is more certain. For example Contador's 2013 was pretty off. And of course his entire career has been rather strange in it's evolution.
Wut? Froome's job was to be Wiggo's servant, that has nothing to do with him having a off year. He was clearly and best climber in that Tour and rode, quite frankly, spectacularly on the flat TT's. Later on, he faded in the Vuelta against Valverde, Contador and Rodriguez who rode on an extremely high level throughout that Vuelta without the Tour in the legs. Well, Valverde had, but he didnt ride GC.

If you wanna point to a off-year, 2014 must be it.
 
Vuelta-Froome is him at 90%. He has always been zig-zagging a bit in the Vuelta. Always with a couple of off-days. While he is still very strong, he is definitely beatable. Both in 2011, 2012, 2014 and most likely in 2015 too.

In the Tour, he is at his absolute peak. His second highest peak tend to be at the start of the season (Oman, Andalucia). Then he is fading. But the closer we get to the Tour, the stronger he gets.
 
Aug 31, 2012
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Valv.Piti said:
Speaking of Froome's 2012 as a off year shows to me you guys have absolutely now idea of what you are talking bout
Yeah, since his rise in 2011, Frome hasn't had an off year in the sense that he was suddenly a million miles off his usual climbing level. Neither has Quintana.
 
Sep 2, 2010
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Re: Re:

huge said:
whittashau said:
The only way he will get his reputation back is if he wins the Giro and gets gold. Or if he rides the Tour and is competitive with the top riders. If he rides the Tour and finishes a minute or so back from Froome or whoever wins the Tour overall he'll get a lot of respect. Far more than he would by winning the Giro and then doing the Olympic roadrace and then getting beaten by a rider who just rode the Tour.

Of course as I said, I think winning both the Giro and getting gold would also do the trick.
I must have missed something.
When exactly did he lose his reputation? An according to whom?
Really interested in the answer!
I feel he needs to prove that he can compete with Froome and Contador. I believe he can, but the general opinion is that he can't and only wins GT against second rate opposition

Again, that isn't my opinion, but I believe he should ride the Tour and ride against the best riders.
 
Re: Re:

whittashau said:
I feel he needs to prove that he can compete with Froome and Contador. I believe he can, but the general opinion is that he can't and only wins GT against second rate opposition

Again, that isn't my opinion, but I believe he should ride the Tour and ride against the best riders.
No, they all should ride both Giro and Tour and Vuelta to prove how good they really are, but that times are gone
sorry but no matter how good performance froome will show on tour, for me never be best rider if he will be not able to show his performance on some other big race, do one race/year is just not enough, for me Valverde e.g. is much better in generally
and I am really do not considering some 2nd tier prepare races as Romandia or Dauphine as important, GT´s, monuments and WC are, and that matter for me
 
Nibali says there are good chances to renew with Astana. He was proposed a new deal few days after Vuelta which he feels was a show of great respect and another offer recently. He says that what he wants is not so much the money but to go to races happy surrounded by people he wants.
 
Geez Nibs at least admit it. After all it was on TV!!!

Nibali said. “Being expelled from the Vuelta also changed me. I still don’t think I was guilty but I’ve learnt several things.”

Hopefully he learned not to take rides on vehicles!

I will be disappointed if he stays with Astana. But as long as he returns to the attacking rider who performed year round I'll be happy enough :).
 

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