Teams & Riders Vincenzo Nibali discussion thread

[bob.a.feet]

Re:

Nibali is so pessimistic about his chances the last few days. Entirely different from the Giro where he kept believing it was possible.

Is that he sees it's hopeless to attack Sky? There is no ambush possible with such a strong team, unlike in the Giro were the leader had no team?

I think the Giro allows for a more free style of racing, compared to the Tour or Vuelta where it is mostly raced only on the final climbs.

 

[Rollthedice]

Re:

Nibali is so pessimistic about his chances the last few days. Entirely different from the Giro where he kept believing it was possible.

Is that he sees it's hopeless to attack Sky? There is no ambush possible with such a strong team, unlike in the Giro were the leader had no team?

He was happy today with how it went. Regarding Froome, contrary to what some people believe here I think he is fading. Normally it would have been a much clearer win today with bigger gaps and I don't buy the crap with holding back. On the other hand the guys who have done the Giro are going better and better and today it was very clear, Keldermerckx, Nibs and Zaka all did a good TT. Tomorrow and the stage to Angliru I don't think that his team can deliver Froome fresh as a daisy with 500m to go just for him to sprint to the line so he'll have to fight by himself, the longer and with as many attackers possible, the better. All four stages remaining offer terrain for ambush but Nibali will need allies of circumstance. Contador is closer to the podium so he'll try for sure and Wilco and Zak will have to respond, I'm sure Superman wants more and he has the legs. These movements can explode the race and shed the Sky doms.

Nibali will try until the very end. Then there are the descents, have a look at one from tomorrow, Portillo de Lunada, a bit far from the finish but who knows:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QpVhiOArZ90&feature=youtu.be

 

[Carols]

Re:

Nibali is the last man that could avoid Froome enter in the history , he doesn't like Froome they pretty hate each other remeber the tour 2015 and the book Nibali wrote , Nibali define Froome biohazard

Really?

If so, Vince you hit the nail right on the head!

 

[ruby]

thanks for the video Rollthedice- that turn at 4.48 - glad I'm not taking that descent!

 

[Sestriere]

Vincenzo will attack during the next stages, and he will do so relentlessely. I mean, why should he not do so?
He already lost to Sky in a Grand Tour but he has already won this very race. And he already finished second in la Vuelta. This means he surely knows how to judge his current situation. He knows what he has got and he knows how it feels like to arrive in Madrid like this. Standing on the runner-up spot, looking up to Froome who doesn't even bother chasing down attacks by himself because he has his baby sitters to do so? I think Nibali would rather finish fourth.
This is his chance to prove he really is an all time great; in wide circles he surely isn't regarded as one. To do so he has to try and break the Sky machine. Apparently, this doesn't work if there are still three men in black surrounding on man in red up a 5% drag.
He has to come up with something more unpredictable or something they just can't do anything about, or, even better, both. Like attacking down a wet, 3-meter-wide mountain road in the fog, rocky cliffs on the one side, yawning abyss on the other, 70 km from the finish.
I would love an obscure tactic like that. He has to do it! Come on, give us something to cheer for, Vincenzo!

(Warning: This comment was written out of a cosy desk chair with no danger of falling down a cliff and very little pain )

 

[Brullnux]

Re:

For Nibali, in this field, this was about par for the course.

More or less. I was expecting 1:15 but the surprise mainly comes because people forget that Nibali can go well in TTs. He was about the same time as Zakarin which is what you'd expect.

 

[Tonton]

I was expecting a little better. He's on par with the Giro, where he was strong week three. It's not the '14 TdF Vincenzo, but he's smart. It will take a Froome or Sky blunder for him to win. GiroDumoulin was stronger than this Dawg.

 

[cineteq]

Re:

Thanks for reminding us that, it made my day!

Nibali is the last man that could avoid Froome enter in the history , he doesn't like Froome they pretty hate each other remeber the tour 2015 and the book Nibali wrote , Nibali define Froome biohazard

 

[movingtarget]

Re: Re:

Nibali is so pessimistic about his chances the last few days. Entirely different from the Giro where he kept believing it was possible.

Is that he sees it's hopeless to attack Sky? There is no ambush possible with such a strong team, unlike in the Giro were the leader had no team?

He was happy today with how it went. Regarding Froome, contrary to what some people believe here I think he is fading. Normally it would have been a much clearer win today with bigger gaps and I don't buy the crap with holding back. On the other hand the guys who have done the Giro are going better and better and today it was very clear, Keldermerckx, Nibs and Zaka all did a good TT. Tomorrow and the stage to Angliru I don't think that his team can deliver Froome fresh as a daisy with 500m to go just for him to sprint to the line so he'll have to fight by himself, the longer and with as many attackers possible, the better. All four stages remaining offer terrain for ambush but Nibali will need allies of circumstance. Contador is closer to the podium so he'll try for sure and Wilco and Zak will have to respond, I'm sure Superman wants more and he has the legs. These movements can explode the race and shed the Sky doms.

Nibali will try until the very end. Then there are the descents, have a look at one from tomorrow, Portillo de Lunada, a bit far from the finish but who knows:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QpVhiOArZ90&feature=youtu.be

Froome of course has to be fading but he and Contador have obviously done well coming out of the Tour while Bardet and Aru haven't. There are probably two good climbing stages left for Superman to cause problems and Contador has no reason to ride conservatively in his last race. He will cause headaches but will he be able to break Sky ? Poels seems to be getting stronger after missing the Tour. The only way Froome loses now I think is if he gets isolated or has mishaps. Froome has made it clear after the TT that he is now only following for the rest of the race.

 

[dacooley]

to win the race, nibali needs to force froome make a mistake and crash or the scenario of all big guys riding against sky should come into play. just attacking downhill and extending the gap on the final climb is not what leads to triumph because as of now sky know his output limit pretty well.

 

[Oliver]

Good TT. Hope he'll unleash the beast de following days. Shark time!

 

[SafeBet]

The bad thing is Poels is now in great shape. He rode an excellent TT, he must feel very fresh. Almost impossible to isolate Froome at this point unless Poels has a bad day.

The good thing for Nibali is that all attacking riders (Astana, Contador, Zakarin) need to attack to gain what they want, and they probably will. Froome will obviously ride defensively from now on, choosing when and how to follow attacks. Kelderman is another rider I can see following Sky wheels since he doesn't have a team and can be satisfied with his current position.

So it's mostly about choosing the right attacks to follow or the right moment to ignite the action. He just be smarter than last Sunday. Probably not gonna be enough anyway but it's worth trying.

 

[telencefalus]

Re:

The bad thing is Poels is now in great shape. He rode an excellent TT, he must feel very fresh. Almost impossible to isolate Froome at this point unless Poels has a bad day.

The good thing for Nibali is that all attacking riders (Astana, Contador, Zakarin) need to attack to gain what they want, and they probably will. Froome will obviously ride defensively from now on, choosing when and how to follow attacks. Kelderman is another rider I can see following Sky wheels since he doesn't have a team and can be satisfied with his current position.

So it's mostly about choosing the right attacks to follow or the right moment to ignite the action. He just be smarter than last Sunday. Probably not gonna be enough anyway but it's worth trying.

That's the problem , now Froome will be behind sky train all the time , Nibali just need a bad day from him or something like a crash , otherwise he will not win

 

[telencefalus]

the interview of Nibali are good sign , he said that the stage of los machous stage 17 and stage 20 the team is not important , so he will attack but he was a bit hungry for the time lost in tt , Nibali is pride

 

[Lo squalo di messina]

Hello fellow nibali fans, after the influx of new skytrain trolls i decided to join so i could put these people on ignore and maybe post a little.
So does vincenzo ride lombardia this year or is his season over after the vuelta?

 

[cineteq]

Re:

That's one scenario. Ideally, Froome loses time because of accumulated fatigue. This would keep everybody happy.

to win the race, nibali needs to force froome make a mistake and crash or the scenario of all big guys riding against sky should come into play. just attacking downhill and extending the gap on the final climb is not what leads to triumph because as of now sky know his output limit pretty well.

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

Yeah but even a fatigued or ill Froome can defend damage well with doms. And especially now Poels seems to be finally in shape. And Poels is a monster on monster climbs.. It'll be hard. I still have some hope for the Angliru stage, since it's not a mono stage but 3 difficult climbs. You could do something there

 

[skippo12]

Yes...42s gained and a big mental boost for the last stages. Froome suffered today and looked very weak...without team Sky he could have cracked completly.
Nibali did great and his alliance with Zakarin after they dropped Kelderman really helped to extent the lead.

 

[jsem94]

Has to try something tomorrow or the day after, put guys in the break and Fuente De style? Idk. Can he really rely on taking more than a minute on Froome on the Angliru?

 

[Eclipse]

Big stage today. Never thought I'd be saying it after taking 40s out of Froome on a MTF but I was almost a bit disappointed to not see him be able to kick away from the others. Still, having a Zakarin in good form who may need to cooperate to chase down Contador attacks could work out very well going forwards. Very very excited to see what the rest of the race brings now.

 

[bambino]

Re:

Big stage today. Never thought I'd be saying it after taking 40s out of Froome on a MTF but I was almost a bit disappointed to not see him be able to kick away from the others. Still, having a Zakarin in good form who may need to cooperate to chase down Contador attacks could work out very well going forwards. Very very excited to see what the rest of the race brings now.

This is the key. Nibs needs to hook up to the fight of the lesser podium places. He needs to have the legs to follow Berto on the steep slopes of Angliru. He tried it today, but just didn't have the same kick for that relatively short period.

I said earlier that he needs to get to Angliru with less than a minute to Froome yo have real chance of winning. I still think that is the case.

 

[skippo12]

Re:

Has to try something tomorrow or the day after, put guys in the break and Fuente De style? Idk. Can he really rely on taking more than a minute on Froome on the Angliru?

So far Sky shut down all attempts of Bahrain and Trek. A huge reason why the race speed was very high early in the stages so far.
They want to prevent a successful long range attack at all costs.

 

[Valv.Piti]

Nibali will win this bike race and we can now add fading spectacularly in the last week in the rain of Northern Spain to Froome's impressive Vuelta *** up palmarés.

 

[Rollthedice]

Re:

Nibali will win this bike race and we can now add fading spectacularly in the last week in the rain of Northern Spain to Froome's impressive Vuelta **** up palmarés.

Amen. I was convinced after yesterday's TT which, as I said wasn't so good by Dawg standards, that he is fading. Today was the first crack, think there will be more.

 

[bambino]

Re: Re:

Nibali will win this bike race and we can now add fading spectacularly in the last week in the rain of Northern Spain to Froome's impressive Vuelta **** up palmarés.

Amen. I was convinced after yesterday's TT which, as I said wasn't so good by Dawg standards, that he is fading. Today was the first crack, think there will be more.

I think his issue is that he can't take everything he has out of the body. He actually didn't look too tired today right after the finnish.