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Vingegaard vs Pogačar - The Duel

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ppanther92

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ppanther92 said:
Rather relatively close (not very - they lose contact whenever road goes up) to post-injury Vingegaard and post-Giro Pogacar.
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Post Giro Pogacar is not a factor, He was training.

For me Roglic is not very close to Viggo and Poggi, especially in hard mountain stage he is far for Viggo. With Remco could be similar, or even better maybe (yersterday in the soft parts of the climb Remco drop him anyway)but there is a difference with Remco, Remco has some supertalents Roglic doenst have, he can fly on the flat o a soft descent without corners, so, despite he descent very bad, once he improve technically, he could close a gap in a flat as he did at Bolonia.

And of course, Remco is better for IIT, so in a race with several flat Km on an ITT he is clearly better.

We dont have to forget that if Remco wpuld have descent as the best riders, he would have a similar than Poggi at GC, becpuse he would have close the gap on the 2 km of false flat before Valloire, He would have been leader after the ITT, and he wpoudl have lost less time yesterday with a normal descent.n Burt the problem for him is that he is gong to lose time in the harder stages...he need more ITT kms to win a day le Tour and improve techically...

But anyway, he is a crack...he can figh for podium at le Tour and to be World Cahmpion in a route almost flat, and to win Lieje and San Sebastian with a big margin.
 
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Taxus4a

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Poggi did welll to race Giro..just a good training and he assure a GT this year, becouse le Tour he knows has very difficult with Vingegaard. Maybe hot weather is a factor, but Vingegaard is better, althpugh they have both terrain to show his cards, and the courage and qualitu of Poggi in all aspect of cycling make you are always wprried about.

And that is very good for cycling...sometimes one of these riders say some stupid thing, but you have to love them all...For me this make a little bit less interesting, becouse I woudl like to be preference for one of them...but It is difficult. I ahve always like endurace climbers as Vibgegaard...but in this case it is impossible dont love Pogacar for all the good thuings he is doing for this beautiful sport. and all of them are brave riders, one of them more crazy to attack, as Poggi, van der Poel, Van Aert, or evenepoel, but Vibgegaard as well, but he chose better the moment.
 
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Medvind

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Berniece said:
So mind games. Vingegaard shouldn't act as if he isn't in amazing shape. Obviously he can be better, but let's not pretend he isn't at 99% already.
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Sure his shape is really good, but I still believe that a Vinge in absolute peak can follow Pog's attack yesterday, can push harder on descents and can tt a little bit stronger. But climbing legs look spectacular.
 
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CyclistAbi said:
@Taxus4a

Didn't you put Pidcock in the big four group, after arguing Rogla doesn't belong in it? So indeed best if the mountains tell the real story. I can surely agree with that.
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If you consider riders for GT, you can talk about big four, but for me is my proper big 2.

If you talk about riders extraterrestrial of this generation, I see 5. No Pidckock, but he is really good and really complete. People as him or Pedersen or Roglic are really good, and make better this generation, but not extraterrestrials.
 
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Taxus4a

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Froome said:
He is not far, probably he can achieve top shape very soon, and i think that was the plan.
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He had a good winter training, lot of the work was done. But of course in other conditions he wpudl have been better here.

But what anybody can pretend is to believe a broken wrist in April, with just some days without any training was a problem for Pogacar and now to be one month into hospital with serious injuries is not.

Vingegaard has showed a big determination, he deserve my total admiration as Pogacar deserves for another issues.
 
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CyclistAbi

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Taxus4a said:
If you consider riders for GT, you can talk about big four, but for me is my proper big 2.

If you talk about riders extraterrestrial of this generation, I see 5. No Pidckock, but he is really good and really complete. People as him or Pedersen or Roglic are really good, and make better this generation, but not extraterrestrials.
Click to expand...

Well, beating extraterrestrials and remaining human, that works for me so i can agree with that.
 
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theyoungest

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Froome said:
https://twitter.com/x/status/1811320900211323110
View: https://x.com/faustocoppi60/status/1811320900211323110
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It is a particular talent of Vingegaard to get into shape really fast. Here's an excerpt from an interview with his trainer Tim Heemskerk, from past December:

If Pogačar and Vingegaard both have two weeks to prepare for, say, Paris-Nice: would Vingegaard win?

“Haha, that's a difficult question. I don't know what Pogačar is doing, of course. I do know that Jonas can make very rapid progress in two weeks. Of all the riders I have ever worked with, Jonas is the one who can get into shape the fastest if he is given the right stimuli.”
Click to expand...

He already said before that with Jonas it's more a case of having him do as little as possible in training, rather than as much. But I do think that the surprise about his current level is genuine. Jorgenson indicated that during training camp in Tignes, Jonas wasn't yet seeing the numbers he's used to. And he probably isn't close to his very best... but his very best had him winning the Tour by 7 minutes, so that might not be necessary.
 
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