Vino bought the 2010 LBL?

[jens_attacks]

100% d'accord.

You don't get it, the issue is not 'how' he wins, but 'why' he wins.

looking forward to nibali managed by god himself.
you better hope he will learn from the god's tricks.

 

[Arnout]

It's not bribing, remember. Kolobnev could've said no, because you can say no.

I think there is something fundamentally different between doping and paying a competitor: you do the first thing in secret to beat your competitor in an unfair way, in the second it is just a business agreement in which both parties need to agree for it to work. And because the sport of cycling is unique in it's setup in which you need to work together to beat each other at the line, things like this are, in my opinion, part of the sport.

 

[Afrank]

I've always liked Vino as a rider. His attacking style of racing is the kind that every rider should aspire to duplicate. And I've been able to look past the doping because he served his suspension and came back strong. But if he did pay Kolobnev for the LBL victory like the emails seem to indicate he did, well I guess it is still a good performance after 2 years out of the sport because even without the money he would have been 1st or 2nd. But it does taint the victory, and put a damper on it.

Also I've never heard of a winning rider paying the rider that got 2nd like people on here are saying happens. Is this actually something that happens in cycling? I can't really think of a good reason for the winning rider to pay the 2nd placed rider unless it was for the win. Are there any proven examples of this happening?

 

[Lanark]

I've always liked Vino as a rider. His attacking style of racing is the kind that every rider should aspire to duplicate. And I've been able to look past the doping because he served his suspension and came back strong. But if he did pay Kolobnev for the LBL victory like the emails seem to indicate he did, well I guess it is still a good performance after 2 years out of the sport because even without the money he would have been 1st or 2nd. But it does taint the victory, and put a damper on it.

Also I've never heard of a winning rider paying the rider that got 2nd like people on here are saying happens. Is this actually something that happens in cycling? I can't really think of a good reason for the winning rider to pay the 2nd placed rider unless it was for the win. Are there any proven examples of this happening?

Paying the 2nd can happen sometimes, in the case that 2 people are away, and they both have to work together, it can be a good incentive to agree beforehand to pay the loser, to guarantee both keep working. Now paying 150.000 euro in such a gentlemen's agreement is a whole different story....

 

[gingerwallaceafro]

He deffo bought the Olympic win too

 

[Carols]

He should be banned for life from the sport of cycling.

I've been a Vino fan for a Long Time; but this is just to much. Seems he will take every avenue to cheat there is...I sure don't want to see him managing Nibali!!!

 

[Zam_Olyas]

He deffo bought the Olympic win too

Is it july yet? gingerwallace gracing us with his presence.

 

[Tinman]

It's not bribing, remember. Kolobnev could've said no, because you can say no.

I think there is something fundamentally different between doping and paying a competitor: you do the first thing in secret to beat your competitor in an unfair way, in the second it is just a business agreement in which both parties need to agree for it to work. And because the sport of cycling is unique in it's setup in which you need to work together to beat each other at the line, things like this are, in my opinion, part of the sport.

I hear you, and it's been as old as cycle racing itself. But in certain situations, like this one, it could be seen as akin to "matchfixing", and it's certainly against the UCI rulebook. And they will have to rule on it.

http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/1...e-file-sent-to-the-UCI-for-investigation.aspx

BTW, Vino is a cancer to the sport.

 

[draexem]

There can be NO payments or agreements made between professional riders in the middle of a race, for obvious reasons. This isn't an amateur race organised between mates around the local park. Nor is this 1945. Racers who can't behave in a professional and clean manner, and yes I'm looking directly at Vinokourov, need to be tossed out of the sport. And I don't want to hear these idiotic excuses that 'it's an agreement to ensure both riders continue to work'. The guy who rides with you won't work? I believe that's filed under the heading of 'tough ****'. Unfortunately Vino's just retired so nothing really can be done.

And I agree with Tinman when he said Vino is a cancer to the sport.

 

[webvan]

Something could still be done to prevent him from polluting the sports with his thuggish ways as a team manager. His potential to harm is possibly even worse now !

 

[ramjambunath]

and another article... starting to make the english news now.

it's been discounted before but now, all of a sudden, it's roaring back to life... why?

Why was it discounted till now is the more important question.

These aren't new claims. L'illustre published transaction details on the fourth of July. Wonder what the cycling media were doing when this was published?
http://www.illustre.ch/Alexandre-Vinokourov-achat-victoire-cyclisme-Liege-Bastogne-Liege-Kolobnev_162322_.html

150k, nice bonus sharing

 

[Vino attacks everyone]

So much hatred in here.

 

[thirteen]

Why was it discounted till now is the more important question.

These aren't new claims. L'illustre published transaction details on the fourth of July. Wonder what the cycling media were doing when this was published?
http://www.illustre.ch/Alexandre-Vinokourov-achat-victoire-cyclisme-Liege-Bastogne-Liege-Kolobnev_162322_.html

150k, nice bonus sharing

i don't think they were able to find anything at the time.

in the first article i sited, there's this (emphasis added is mine):

The payoff revelations were first reported by Swiss magazine L'illustre.

"It's a very old story," UCI spokesman Enrico Carpani told The Associated Press, adding that the UCI asked L'illustre for evidence of the case two years ago but was turned down.

 

[ramjambunath]

So, they published it now. It doesn't change that they've alleged that two transactions worth 150 grand have been made and that the Padova prosecutors believe it's proof.

 

[thirteen]

So, they published it now. It doesn't change that they've alleged that two transactions worth 150 grand have been made and that the Padova prosecutors believe it's proof.

and the "evidence" is finally being passed on.

it took them two years to come up with it, so have a little patience and let the authorities look at the information that was given on a weekend when offices were closed.

honestly, the vitriol against Vino has reached a new level since Vino won the Olympics fair and square. deal with it

 

[coinneach]

So much hatred in here.

Maybe that's because we don't like the idea of bike races being bought.

This puts the spotlight back on the Olympics.

Will you be happy to see cycling banned as an olympic sport?

Vino is a typical sport cheat: doesn't care about anything, any damage to the sport so long as he wins. Riders like him are a large part the reason cycling is in the state it is today.

BTW I did like his attacking style of cycling, but could never enjoy it, knowing what he'd get up to.

 

[gingerwallaceafro]

Is it july yet? gingerwallace gracing us with his presence.

Haha! Touché

 

[ramjambunath]

I enjoyed his racing, but didn't support him. Not that I support many. It's not like he's the only cheat around. This is a different allegation.

and the "evidence" is finally being passed on.

it took them two years to come up with it, so have a little patience and let the authorities look at the information that was given on a weekend when offices were closed.

honestly, the vitriol against Vino has reached a new level since Vino won the Olympics fair and square. deal with it

I'm dealing fine enough, not the one having a strop now It could be ignored and all will still be sunshine and roses, no?

Btw, the illustre article was published before the olympics.

 

[Vino attacks everyone]

Maybe that's because we don't like the idea of bike races being bought.

This puts the spotlight back on the Olympics.

Will you be happy to see cycling banned as an olympic sport?

Vino is a typical sport cheat: doesn't care about anything, any damage to the sport so long as he wins. Riders like him are a large part the reason cycling is in the state it is today.

BTW I did like his attacking style of cycling, but could never enjoy it, knowing what he'd get up to.

Honestly if cycling should be banned from the olympics, it should not be becasue someone payed someone for the victory instead of the second place. If that was the reason tennis would have been banned a long time ago rofl.

 

[rhubroma]

and the "evidence" is finally being passed on.

it took them two years to come up with it, so have a little patience and let the authorities look at the information that was given on a weekend when offices were closed.

honestly, the vitriol against Vino has reached a new level since Vino won the Olympics fair and square. deal with it

Vino is as corrupt as the oil oligarchy of the nation that supports his baby Astana, in ex-Soviet style state propaganda. None of this is surprising, however, I'm wondering if the Italian PM will really be able to incriminate him, because of all the political and economic interests between Italy and Kazakhstan and their respective mafias. Although they have the evidence to do so and Astana, now with Nibali, seriously risks loosing its World Tour liscence. These orthodox/former Polit Bureau states have replaced such former oligarchies, with state sponsored oil mafias. Hence corruption is rife within the very DNA of the institutions, to where it becomes a hereditary culture of their society.

As reported in today's la Gazzetta dello Sport, the Roberti led Padova investigation has sworn testimony from Bertagnolli and Voldymir Bileka regarding Astana and Ferrari, movements from Swiss bank accounts and Monte Carlo (a triangulation between Ferrari's son and the two fiscal paradises, with fake contracts to boot); as well as e-mails and phone conversations between Kolbonev and Vino, which irrefutably demonstrate the veracity of the accusations.

To assert anything to the contrary is simply asinine.

 

[thirteen]

To assert anything to the contrary is simply asinine.

i apologise that i still haven't figured out how to take a pic of a tweet, so this will have to do:

festinagirl ‏@festinagirl

UCI using the several months old story about Vino's LBL as yet another smokescreen

^^^ my thoughts exactly.

 

[Netserk]

 

[python]

be your own judge...i don’t think that the following (somewhat dated) statements from the involved riders ever appeared in english. (source: http://i-news.kz.)

Kolobnev:
This article is a jab against vino. I don’t want to comment on the publication. In and of itself , such a situation is impossible for purely technical reasons…we are talking about a one-day monument, its last 10 km, when you are being chased by a grupetto. What’s there to talk about? Each rider will fight to the end particularly if he can podium.

the indignant and expected statement by vino will be translated next. followed, as is his usual, bizarre analysis by eki
---
nah, does not pay to invest my time anymore in the translations as it interferes with the fan/anti-fan bickering...

 

[Lanark]

i apologise that i still haven't figured out how to take a pic of a tweet, so this will have to do:

festinagirl ‏@festinagirl


^^^ my thoughts exactly.

Really, the UCI now controls Italian prosecuters? Wow, I never imagined they have that much power. Oh wait, they don't.

The only smokescreen is by Vino-fans who can't stand the fact that their hero is being exposed for the crook he is.

 

[Vino attacks everyone]

Really, the UCI now controls Italian prosecuters? Wow, I never imagined they have that much power. Oh wait, they don't.

The only smokescreen is by Vino-fans who can't stand the fact that their hero is being exposed for the crook he is.

rofl

1. Money exchange is nothing new in any sport.
2. He is not a "hero" because he is this perfect superhuman (he is only superhuman), but because he is 10 times more entertaining to watch ride than the whole peloton put togheter.