Vuelta 2012, Stage 20: La Faisanera Golf-Bola del Mundo (170,7 km)

[hrotha]

Are there any grand tour contenders that you do like?

Baring in mind Madrazo is not a grand tour contender.

NIBBLES

And off the top 10 of this year's GTs...
Hesjedal
De Gendt
Cunego
Henao
Van den Broeck
Van Garderen
Evans
Pinot
Gesink
Talansky
Intxausti

 

[killswitch]

You forget the fact that Alberto also did huge pulls himself.

He did pull a bit and even without Paulinho and Tiralongo would have taken the lead. But the gap between him and Valverde/Jrod would have been a matter of seconds with the big showdown at Bola del Mundo still to come.

 

[Vino attacks everyone]

NIBBLES

And off the top 10 of this year's GTs...
Hesjedal
De Gendt
Cunego
Henao
Van den Broeck
Van Garderen
Evans
Pinot
Gesink
Talansky
Intxausti

What do you have agaisnt Brajkovic?

 

[hrotha]

What do you have agaisnt Brajkovic?

I'm kinda neutral towards him. The ones in the list are riders I actually like and root for.

 

[Parrulo]

Paulinho and Tiralongo babysited Bertie (established the gap on stage 17) and won the overall for Contador. Mano o mano Bertie put 25 sec on Purito - the gap before the stage was 28 seconds. Does this fact make Bertie not a deserving winner? Plus Saxo was the strongest team in the race.

way to completely miss the point. . .

in other words you just don't acknowledge hesjedal can be a better climber in a separate race?

wait what? i love how you completely change the subject when you are wrong.

fact is, purito has more GT experience then hesjedal and hesjedal still attacked in giro so your point of purito still learning how to a be a GT contender by stage 19 of the giro is moot.

 

[cineteq]

NIBBLES

And off the top 10 of this year's GTs...
Hesjedal
De Gendt
Cunego
Henao
Van den Broeck
Van Garderen
Evans
Pinot
Gesink
Talansky
Intxausti

Replace Rodriguez for Intxausti, and that'll be my list too. You're not that bad after all.

 

[airstream]

way to completely miss the point. . .



wait what? i love how you completely change the subject when you are wrong.

fact is, purito has more GT experience then hesjedal and hesjedal still attacked in giro so your point of purito still learning how to a be a GT contender by stage 19 of the giro is mute.

i never do that, if one can't grasp my thought on the base of his own post, either i'm sorry for my bad wordy constructions or everything was clear and that's not my defect. the fact is experience itself doesn't make a rider stronger in every race or that's wrong? as i see you base on impression that purito was a better than ryder climber in the giro, but some indecision didn't let him win. i disagree with that. in my view, they were equal climbers, approximately like purito and alberto in this race. joaquim was a better sprinter that gave him some seconds. if we take pure time they overcame high mountains within the limits of 20 sec i guess. yeah, ryder had more courage and improvisation sometimes on the climbs but to say that he was a weaker climber... i wouldn't tell so

 

[Netserk]

NIBBLES

And off the top 10 of this year's GTs...
Hesjedal
De Gendt
Cunego
Henao
Van den Broeck
Van Garderen
Evans
Pinot
Gesink
Talansky
Intxausti

Really?

 

[Corona]

This winner attacked though

When did Alberto attack once he'd got the leaders jersey?

I'm not knocking Contador, he is an attacking rider but once he had the leaders jersey he defended it, as most riders would.

Why on earth would you expect Wiggins (and the boring Sky train) in the TDF to attack though? It's for the other teams to attack him when he's in the leaders jersey. That nobody did is the fault of the other teams, they made it boring not Sky by failing to attack him.

 

[killswitch]

 

[Vino attacks everyone]

When did Alberto attack once he'd got the leaders jersey?

I'm not knocking Contador, he is an attacking rider but once he had the leaders jersey he defended it, as most riders would.

Why on earth would you expect Wiggins (and the boring Sky train) in the TDF to attack though? It's for the other teams to attack him when he's in the leaders jersey. That nobody did is the fault of the other teams, they made it boring not Sky by failing to attack him.

Could Contador attack on any stage with the jersey? Except today, but we could all see hat JRod was the strongest so I can't see your point to be honset

 

[Parrulo]

Really?

i also like VdB2 and i am pretty sure hrotha likes him for the same reason i do.

jurgen Vanderbreakaway memories still last. right hrotha?

 

[iZnoGouD]

Paulinho and Tiralongo babysited Bertie (established the gap on stage 17) and won the overall for Contador. Mano o mano Bertie put 25 sec on Purito - the gap before the stage was 28 seconds. Does this fact make Bertie not a deserving winner? Plus Saxo was the strongest team in the race.

do you have a brain?

 

[Arnout]

Purito officially elected as stupidest cyclist ever.

One wonders with how many minutes he would've won, would he have used the right tactic.

Also disappointing stage once again.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Could Contador attack on any stage with the jersey? Except today, but we could all see hat JRod was the strongest so I can't see your point to be honset

This. Lol there were two flat stages and Bola.

 

[hrotha]

i also like VdB2 and i am pretty sure hrotha likes him for the same reason i do.

jurgen Vanderbreakaway memories still last. right hrotha?

Yes and no. I like his name alright, and Vandenbroucke was one of the first five riders I picked as a favourite of mine (the others being Tonkov, Rebellin, Totschnig and Camenzind). But if Jurgen's name was "Vandenbroucke" I wouldn't care for his name: as a language nerd, what I like is that it's the Flemish spelling of the same surname.

I do tend to root for riders with names I like, but aside from that I like Van den Broeck for other reasons too. Like telling Sarkozy to **** off, for example.

 

[El Pistolero]

Yes and no. I like his name alright, and Vandenbroucke was one of the first five riders I picked as a favourite of mine (the others being Tonkov, Rebellin, Totschnig and Camenzind). But if Jurgen's name was "Vandenbroucke" I wouldn't care for his name: as a language nerd, what I like is that it's the Flemish spelling of the same surname.

I do tend to root for riders with names I like, but aside from that I like Van den Broeck for other reasons too. Like telling Sarkozy to **** off, for example.

So the reason you hate Contador is because you don't like his name.

Yeah, I'm going with that!

 

[shalgo]

Strongest rider: Rodriguez > Contador > Valverde
Smartest rider: Valverde > Contador > Rodriguez
Bravest rider: Contador > Rodriguez > Valverde

 

[hrotha]

So the reason you hate Contador is because you don't like his name.

Yeah, I'm going with that!

I like his name. Bends itself well to many a Clinic joke

 

[LaFlorecita]

I like his name. Bends itself well to many a Clinic joke

Too many clinic jokes actually

 

[robert_c]

Any chance JRod will try to get 2nd overall tomorrow, or is it just a parade like the Tour?

 

[etymology]

purito has no proper attacking experience, excluding piani resinelli 3k raid. he was competing against a priori the strongest climber in the race and often to catch contador was really really hard for him (besides cuitu negru i think).

perhaps - though the only way to gain experience is to do the thing in which one is inexperienced. it is through cumulative experience that one learns their limitations. once those limitations are known - it is *possible* to learn to push past them.

but anyways you'd offer him attack contador, without feeling necessary strength? it's really stupid and just retroactive thinking based on what we've watched today which is not represéntative for the whole race. «if i can predict future, i’ll live in vegas». sadly, purito can't do that, unlike his critics.

yes, i'd say attack contador -not every stage, mind you - just attack when it is not expected for no other reason then...he can. might not work, might work - one never knows unless one tries. then, when riding on terrain he KNOWS he owns...be as merciless.

my thinking has little to do with strength necessary to make and sustain an attack, nothing to do with tactical stupidity, and less than nothing to do with any of the vuelta's stages prior to today.

it has everything to do with having the heart and mind of a champion, with being willing to risk everything to win., with NOT riding for second or third or top 10, and with, far more often than not, racing to win instead of racing to not lose.

i understand that there are sponsors to please in order to mainain funding, and that sometimes that in itself requires a less risk strategy in order secure a high placing which in turn ensures the folks paying the bills getting their money's worth.

i have no after-the-stages criticisms of purito. not even a "why didn't he respond to contador's attack in stage 17? i mean...50 kilometers out, with his team...50 kilometers out, how is even contador going to sustain an attack that is going to knock me (purito) out of red, let alone gain more time thani cannot get back on saturday, which finishes on a mountaintop on ramps that are MY territory???

tactics are often like theories: they look and work great on paper. however: tactics and reality are often kilometers/minnutes apart.

in the "how will win the vuelta" poll after stage 17, i voted for contador. my head told me "purito," but my heart - or more truthfully, my knowing contador has the never give up heart of a champion - told my head to take a hike.

i am not an armchair cycling tactician. i am definitely not a "know evey nuance of every pro cyclinst geeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeenious. i am someone who, as the result of following pro cycling for more than 40 years, knows ennough that every rare once in a while, cyclng is gifted with a rider for whom the race is NEVER over until it is over. that is why while i would never have bet on contador to win after stage 17, i would not bet against him or proclaim 'his race is over,'.

the physically strongest man does not always win. sometimes the psychologically stronger rider can neutralize of render ineffective advantages of the phsically stronger rider. in that part of the sport we love, no one - NO ONE presently riding - comes close to contador.

that is why i did not - and until he shows otherwise willl i ever - think "ah, well...he's tired. just doesn't have it...guess alberto will ride for and be content with second place."

apologies to all for such a bllitheringly long post, bordering on fanyboyism if i may say so myself. it's just that, well...i have unceasing admiration for true champions.

 

[The Hitch]

i also like VdB2 and i am pretty sure hrotha likes him for the same reason i do.

jurgen Vanderbreakaway memories still last. right hrotha?

How any cycling fan can like vdb is beyond me. We joke on schleck only riding the tour but Andy is a flipping season all rounder compared to jvdb . The big defense from his fans was - "he will ride the vuelta this year"
And he went in for the lols then.pulled out because he couldn't be bothered.

 

[El Pistolero]

He had a stomach bug, like half the Lotto squad.

He was good at every stage race he did this year actually. Good at Algarve, Catalunya and Dauphiné. Was with the best uphill at Pais Vasco, but ruined his GC in the time trial.

Andy is much worse considering he's much more talented. VDB2 needs to work hard for the results he gets, Andy is a huge waste of talent. These guys couldn't be any more different. If VDB2 had the talent of Andy Schleck he'd have won a couple of GTs by now.

 

[The Hitch]

Any chance JRod will try to get 2nd overall tomorrow, or is it just a parade like the Tour?

Its a parade with the champagne and all but there is racing for a good.70k. Jrod will remember this as he lost the green jersey on the last stage last year. No chance at taking time though.