Vuelta a Andalucia (Ruta Del Sol) 2.HC // 18.2 - 22.2

[Taxus4a]

What part I have say is not true and with which argument??

I am going to give arguments.

http://www.over40cyclist.com/drafting-in-cycling/

Drafting in cycling depend on the speed, but if we consider just two riders the advantage could be more or less 10 % at 20 Km/h, and 30 % at 50 Km/h. it depends as well of wind power and direction.

I dont know exactly, but something like that. It is true that in climbs as Mortirolo or Ancares, when you are in km above 10 %, cyclist use to say in that situacion drafting it useless.

That is almost true, but it is not a question of % slope, but speed of the riders. if the speed is 15 km/h drafting works and at least is a 2 % (maybe more) of energy saved. Very little, but is something.

But Ancares has 3 kms close to the finish not so step and where there are even half a km plane. In that 3 Km Froome was more or less at 25 km/h average, in the flat at 35 k/h...

To go that 3 Km at his whell can be an advantage of 10-15 %, if you add that to the little advantage in the previous 3 kms, it is an important advantage for Contador, and to put in 1 km at 10 %, than take more than 3 minutes, 15 seconds, 8 % faster, dont show to be stronger in the hole climb.

I would say of course the same if you put an example in wich Contador do the opossite, as in the Vuelta with Purito or Valverde in some stages.

As always I was looking at the motorbikes, becouse Contador knows quite well how to use his draft (ey, that is a mistake of motorbikes, for me is a good point for Contador, it is part of the game and everybody can do it if he knows when is possible), but today motorbikes didnt have any role, that is true. (at 20 Km/h the moto start to help at about 5 meters, at it is the closest he was, so it wanst a factor)

 

[Cance > TheRest]

IMHO Froome is lagging in form with respect to Contador. An equal form would mean more or less Froome gaining 5-10sec in stage 1b.
Which i think would have resulted in a mano-a-mano today as well.
The most ideal medium of comparison between them was the Dauphine 14. Too bad it lasted only two days. And too bad we probably won't see them race in their best possible shape in 2015 as well.

The most ideal medium of comparison might aswell be the Vuelta last year. Both riders had no excuse to not be in top form.
Contador has never been at full peak in Dauphine, while SKY (both Wiggins and Froome) in their respective winning years was almost at their peaking in Dauphine. Same could apply for Dauphine last year, so really it's not necessarily an ideal state of comparison.
In a hilly, technical short time trial, there's no way that Froome would beat Contador if they were in equally good form.

 

[Taxus4a]

IMHO Froome is lagging in form with respect to Contador. An equal form would mean more or less Froome gaining 5-10sec in stage 1b.

That is not true, Contador was some years the best of the world in short and hilly ITT, he won even Tony Martin or Wiggins in that kind of ITT. Contador has a big acceleration.

The ITT of Coria has some dangerous corners and Froome say he didnt take any risk.

I am going to put you examples of ITT (not Anneccy, that the change of the wind helps him) of lees of 25 Kms, not totally plain with Alberto in a great performance:

http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/race.asp?raceid=9650
http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/race.asp?raceid=261
http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/race.asp?raceid=1852
http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/race.asp?raceid=3307
http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/race.asp?raceid=5056
http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/race.asp?raceid=5105
http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/race.asp?raceid=5215
http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/race.asp?raceid=7101
http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/race.asp?raceid=6956
http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/race.asp?raceid=10444
http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/race.asp?raceid=10565
http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/race.asp?raceid=10970
http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/race.asp?raceid=11927
http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/race.asp?raceid=12907
http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/race.asp?raceid=16817
http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/race.asp?raceid=16976
http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/race.asp?raceid=16964
http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/race.asp?raceid=17211

(all of them before his suspension)

he was as well good in long ITT, especially about 40 km witout wing and some climb, as Annecy or Giro de Italia (won by Bruseghin), especilly in 2009, when he was amazing at ITTs and some people wrote in spanish forums contador was the best ITT of the world.

Well, Froome, in his first time he rode a GT, tour 2008, he did good long ITT, especially the last one, 14th possition, Contador in his first tour at the same age was about 40 in similar ITTs.

Froome, in short ITT after his explosion in 2011.

http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/race.asp?raceid=22293
http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/race.asp?raceid=21624, but he was second in the long that Tour.
http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/race.asp?raceid=25979 he won the long one in that Romandia.

Of course he could win a shot ITT if is hard and he is in great shape and he has not a super contender, but he has showed to be better in long ITT than in short, and he has always said that.

Contador in the same shape should be better in short ITT, especially with changes of rythm, becouse of his powerfull and electrical aceleration.


Good wishes!

 

[Taxus4a]

In a hilly, technical short time trial, there's no way that Froome would beat Contador if they were in equally good form.

I think today yes, if the ITT is not tecnical with lot of rythm changes, becouse Froome is a better rider. When he is in top form, it is difficult to beat in any Tour ( ITT or climbs) by Contador. Last Vuelta Froome wanst in his best, but anyway very close, he did a mistake in the ITT, trying to keep an impossible pace at the begining, and in the climbs I have showed they were similar strong.
In dauphine before the crash he showed to be little bit stronger in the short ITT, but as well in the climb, Contador was always at his draft and at the end he couldnt pass him for the stage, that is about 10 % weaker.

 

[inri2000]

It's rather comical for it to happen again. Once is a mistake. Twice or more makes you question WTH is going on with their race tactics. You see leadouts for sprinters amongst the chaos of final km's of mass sprint, glancing back to make sure their sprint train is still intact or that their leader is still on the wheel. Puzzling.

Comical indeed, just like Alberto "The crows are going to eat us"

From 08:00

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLqV033CoBQ

 

[Taxus4a]

Comical indeed, just like Alberto "The crows are going to eat us"

From 08:00

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLqV033CoBQ

He want to be funny , but he use to fail...

He is not good talking, but he has a good nose fo cycling, that is what finally counts.

 

[MatParker117]

It's rather comical for it to happen again. Once is a mistake. Twice or more makes you question WTH is going on with their race tactics. You see leadouts for sprinters amongst the chaos of final km's of mass sprint, glancing back to make sure their sprint train is still intact or that their leader is still on the wheel. Puzzling.

Sky were looking for new DS's this offseason, problem is they can't touch anyone good for clinic reasons.

 

[Swifty's Cakes]

Sky were looking for new DS's this offseason, problem is they can't touch anyone good for clinic reasons.

Froome really shouldn't need a DS to tell him to get close to his biggest rival when they are approaching the foot of the climb on a MTF. He was the best part of 20 seconds back on Contador at 7kms when the attack came and lost by 19 which tells us the legs are not that far apart but Alberto is 20 seconds faster in his head.

 

[manafana]

I would really like Kennaugh to get to give it go on this stage, meanwhile Kudus to keep improving here.

 

[Forunculo]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dyfvpDyIvIo

A video from the finish line. How lucky Contador and Froome have been

 

[saunaking]

That's what you get with riders used to riding purely on wattage and DS orders, a bunch of robots. I don't get how a professional rider like Kennaugh can just ride on and on and setting a brutal pace for more than a kilometre (can't remember exactly for how long) without making sure he had Froome in his wheel.

This "interference" screwing with power meters sounds fishy. I cant think of a reason for bertie to lie, but seriously? Tv signals messing with this stuff? I doubt it. If soo Froome would have tinfoil all over his gear

 

[T-Nielsen]

This "interference" screwing with power meters sounds fishy. I cant think of a reason for bertie to lie, but seriously? Tv signals messing with this stuff? I doubt it. If soo Froome would have tinfoil all over his gear

Perhaps a translation error and the interference was with the communication between him and the teamcar.

 

[The_Juan]

What part I have say is not true and with which argument??

I am going to give arguments.

http://www.over40cyclist.com/drafting-in-cycling/

Drafting in cycling depend on the speed, but if we consider just two riders the advantage could be more or less 10 % at 20 Km/h, and 30 % at 50 Km/h. it depends as well of wind power and direction.

I dont know exactly, but something like that. It is true that in climbs as Mortirolo or Ancares, when you are in km above 10 %, cyclist use to say in that situacion drafting it useless.

That is almost true, but it is not a question of % slope, but speed of the riders. if the speed is 15 km/h drafting works and at least is a 2 % (maybe more) of energy saved. Very little, but is something.

But Ancares has 3 kms close to the finish not so step and where there are even half a km plane. In that 3 Km Froome was more or less at 25 km/h average, in the flat at 35 k/h...

To go that 3 Km at his whell can be an advantage of 10-15 %, if you add that to the little advantage in the previous 3 kms, it is an important advantage for Contador, and to put in 1 km at 10 %, than take more than 3 minutes, 15 seconds, 8 % faster, dont show to be stronger in the hole climb.

I would say of course the same if you put an example in wich Contador do the opossite, as in the Vuelta with Purito or Valverde in some stages.

As always I was looking at the motorbikes, becouse Contador knows quite well how to use his draft (ey, that is a mistake of motorbikes, for me is a good point for Contador, it is part of the game and everybody can do it if he knows when is possible), but today motorbikes didnt have any role, that is true. (at 20 Km/h the moto start to help at about 5 meters, at it is the closest he was, so it wanst a factor)

Cycling, as with most other sports, is easy to understand. You show up at the start and try your hardest to be the first person to get to the finish. Whatever happens in between is completely "irrelevant". By this I mean that it doesn't matter if you ride at an out-of-this-world cadence for 95% of the stage and then collapse with 15K to go and lose 15-20 minutes.

I know it's a hard pill to swallow but, as with all great champions, Alberto has found another way to win, he's adapted to the circumstances and did what was in his power (not his power meter) to get to the finish first.

It's up to Chris to up the ante. And so far he hasn't shown any signs of having learned anything from last year's a$$-whooping. Heck, some are still stubbornly debating as to whether it was an a$$-whooping or not.

It's my wish and I hope that Chris is able to bring the fight to Contador.

 

[Netserk]

This "interference" screwing with power meters sounds fishy. I cant think of a reason for bertie to lie, but seriously? Tv signals messing with this stuff? I doubt it. If soo Froome would have tinfoil all over his gear

I think it's legit. At least I have heard of it before.

 

[arvc40]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dyfvpDyIvIo

A video from the finish line. How lucky Contador and Froome have been

Bloody hell........................

.

 

[Bushman]

This "interference" screwing with power meters sounds fishy. I cant think of a reason for bertie to lie, but seriously? Tv signals messing with this stuff? I doubt it. If soo Froome would have tinfoil all over his gear

Well, Contador still paced himself well. Kept a solid gap without going into red. Kennaugh, on the other hand....

 

[Carstenbf]

He is not an explosive rider

 

[Carstenbf]

Some (slightly boring) pics from Almunecar.

Breakaway.

El Grande Valgren!

Peloton.

(pics won't display on the laptop for some reason. Lemme know if formatting is totally screwed)

 

[wirral]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dyfvpDyIvIo

A video from the finish line. How lucky Contador and Froome have been

That is the *** helicopter pilot who has been determined to get as low as possible all week. There have been previous complaints about him. But he feels he needs to get down as close to the action as possible.

 

[Bexon30]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dyfvpDyIvIo

A video from the finish line. How lucky Contador and Froome have been

Imagine if Froome was at race weight he'd have blown back down the climb! On a serious note though helicopter pilots ought to know better, this happens quite often. There's a video clip where some riders are blown to a standstill going uphill. Also poor by the cars and bikes on the 1 km downhill just before the climb kicked up. Saxo were putting in a big turn of pace and it hampered them somewhat. Let's hope race organisers get on it better today. Imagine when Contador was riding no handed for 100m that the down draft took him out. Dangerous.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Some (slightly boring) pics from Almunecar.

(pics won't display on the laptop for some reason. Lemme know if formatting is totally screwed)

you did everything right, but when using the insert image button (I assume you did) you didn't remove the http:// that was already there! So when you copied in the link you had two sets of http:// - you can fix your own post by simply removing one of them

But - the pictures are massive - perhaps it's better to resize them in tinypic for example - just select the "message board" size or you could just post the links alone

 

[Carstenbf]

you did everything right, but when using the insert image button (I assume you did) you didn't remove the http:// that was already there! So when you copied in the link you had two sets of http:// - you can fix your own post by simply removing one of them

But - the pictures are massive - perhaps it's better to resize them in tinypic for example - just select the "message board" size or you could just post the links alone

Allrighty. thanks LaFlo.

 

[Netserk]

Some (slightly boring) pics from Almunecar.

Breakaway.





(pics won't display on the laptop for some reason. Lemme know if formatting is totally screwed)

Here you go:

BotD:

Valgren:

Peloton:

 

[rune1107]

Does anyone know how the race will be transmitted today? Because Eurosport said something about the race not being live...

 

[LaFlorecita]

Does anyone know how the race will be transmitted today? Because Eurosport said something about the race not being live...

it is not live on ES 1 or 2 in many countries, but apparently French Eurosport 2 will broadcast it from 14.15 CET, so there should be live streams