Vuelta a España 2012

[Descender]

In stage 8? Where are they going to spend the first week of racing? Pamplona is not that far from Andorra after all. Perhaps they'll go west first, into the Basque Country?

 

[The Hitch]

Well vuelta organizers wanted to return to spring, I think we could be confident they'd have a better lien up of climbing with that. But of course that will never happen. I don't know if i even like the idea, but you can't blame them for disliking the spot they have.

Spring. Oh, thats a horrible idea.

Vuelta is far better in September. It gives us a longer season rather than mess with the classics. It gets a better lineup. It also gives very high temperatures which helps give it its own identity as a Grand Tour, rather than just - that other one.

No one would go for the Giro Vuelta double anymore.

And arent some of the climbs still in snow in April?

 

[El Pistolero]

Almost everyone would skip the Vuelta if it was in April. No one would even watch it on TV during the most important days: Sundays.

Anyway, hope they go back to Pais Vasco again. Crowds were as crazy there as the Flemish crowds. The Vuelta needs Pais Vasco to regain some prestige imo.

 

[roundabout]

Yea, there are more than enough climbs in Spain to create far more gaps than the beloved 20+km @ 5% grinds in France. It's just that the Vuelta doesn't use them or doesn't utilise them to their best potential (i.e. one-climb stages or, as with the stupendously hard Ancares, not close enough to the finish to be effective). To give the organisers their credit they have been introducing new and difficult climbs recently (Anglirú, Cotobello, Farrapona, La Pandera, Valdepeñas de Jaén) as well as returning to long-forgotten ones (Peña Cabarga).

Also, announced just now, they're going to Andorra - but not climbing the usual ones of Arcalis, Ordino, Pal or even Naturlandía La Rabassa (which they brought in in 2008).

No, instead they're going to Coll de la Gallina de Sant Julià de Lorià (7km, 8,3%, max. 18%). This is reported to be in stage 8, with stage 9 thus beginning in Andorra La Vella and travelling back into Catalunya (Coll de Pal please!!!).
http://www.elperiodicdandorra.ad/esports/14669-la-nova-joia-de-la-vuelta.html

Which grinds are those?

Seems like it's another 1 climb stage to Andorra? They should climb at least La Rabassa before...

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Galibier, Croix de Fer, Aubisque (Soulor side), Marie-Blanque, Piau Engaly, Bonette? All long and ca. 5% or less.

I'd hope for them to do something like La Rabassa first, for sure, but I don't expect them to. Still, 7km @ 8,3% is probably enough to open up at least some gaps, and as that will be the weekend, I hope they have a tough mountain stage into Catalunya the day after (as I said before, fingers crossed for Coll de Pal).

Rumours also have them doing País Vasco again, so that would be really good imo as it means we would get hilly week 1 stages and no lengthy flat stages to open. I guess they would either loop south from Pamplona then up through País Vasco and back across to Andorra, or directly west into País Vasco then south and across.

 

[roundabout]

Galibier, Croix de Fer, Aubisque (Soulor side), Marie-Blanque, Piau Engaly, Bonette? All long and ca. 5% or less.

I'd hope for them to do something like La Rabassa first, for sure, but I don't expect them to. Still, 7km @ 8,3% is probably enough to open up at least some gaps, and as that will be the weekend, I hope they have a tough mountain stage into Catalunya the day after (as I said before, fingers crossed for Coll de Pal).

Rumours also have them doing País Vasco again, so that would be really good imo as it means we would get hilly week 1 stages and no lengthy flat stages to open. I guess they would either loop south from Pamplona then up through País Vasco and back across to Andorra, or directly west into País Vasco then south and across.

I thought you were going to mention Petit-Saint-Bernard. Now that's a a grinder climb.

Galibier, I agree but luckily they also climb the northern side, Croix-de-Fer has easier stretches but I wouldn't really call it a 5% grind

http://cyclingcols.com/profiles/CroixDeFerW.gif
http://cyclingcols.com/profiles/CroixDeFerE.gif

Aubisque, yes. But it also has tougher parts. Marie-Blanque is short and steep and is mostly climbed from the best side

http://cyclingcols.com/profiles/MarieBlanqueW.gif

Piau Engaly was climbed once I think, but agree. However it can be connected to multiple passes.

Bonette is a monster of a climb. Pretty regular but more than 5% most of the way up

http://cyclingcols.com/profiles/BonetteS.gif
http://cyclingcols.com/profiles/BonetteN.gif

Anyway, enough OT.

I'd like to see a good stage out of Andorra as well. I do think that stage 8 isn't early enough to add at least 1 or more climbs before the final one. But I suppose I can live with that if the next stage is going to be really challenging.

 

[roundabout]

Periodic d'Andorra referenced in biciciclismo mentions a loop in Andorra from the southern border to Canillo and back to Andorra la Vella over Ordino and then the final climb.

http://www.biciciclismo.com/cas/site/noticias-ficha.asp?id=44728

 

[18-Valve. (pithy)]

Periodic d'Andorra referenced in biciciclismo mentions a loop in Andorra from the southern border to Canillo and back to Andorra la Vella over Ordino and then the final climb.

http://www.biciciclismo.com/cas/site/noticias-ficha.asp?id=44728

Not too bad, I'd say.

 

[airstream]

Nothing special, but yet better than customary Andorra junk.

 

[c&cfan]

Nothing special, but yet better than customary Andorra junk.

riders make the race. fortunately not all GC contenders are andy-like. some will give a show no matter how dull or great the vuelta is. cobo vs anton vs contador vs j-rod vs nibali vs mosquera???? can you imagine????????!!!!!fireworks!!!!!!

bring it on

 

[airstream]

riders make the race. fortunately not all GC contenders are andy-like. some will give a show no matter how dull or great the vuelta is. cobo vs anton vs contador vs j-rod vs nibali vs mosquera???? can you imagine????????!!!!!fireworks!!!!!!

bring it on

Do all your posts boil down to Contador and Schleck? Undoubtedly, it's all about riders. Yeah, not all that hard MTF like Pal can bring a great show as well, but it happens rarely, as many factors should add up. Anton and Mosquera felt super, Nibali was very good, Rodriguez dropped in a very severe way, that created a strong contrast. It was an excellent spectacle. But more often we need really difficult climbs that climbers have possibility to show themselves at their best.

 

[c&cfan]

Do all your posts bold down to Contador and Schleck? Undoubtedly, it's all about riders. Yeah, not all that hard MTF like Pal can bring a great show as well, but it happens rarely, as many factors should add up. Anton and Mosquera felt super, Nibali was very good, Rodriguez dropped in a very severe way, that created a a strong contrast. It was an excellent spectacle. But more often we need really difficult climbs that climbers have possibility to show themselves at their best.

not really. if guys like contador wasn't there, guys like andy would never attack. this is funny, because he knows that he will always loose if he does not attack.

do you really want to know what is needed for this sport? brainwash. forget merckx, forget armstrong, forget bruynel, forget those that stabbed cycling. then, show the truth to football fans, nab fans, nfl fans, etc. show them how ALL current sports are being ruled and what's going on.

restart.

 

[airstream]

not really. if guys like contador wasn't there, guys like andy would never attack. this is funny, because he knows that he will always loose if he does not attack.
restart.

OK. How would have you reacted on this year Vuelta, if Cobo couldn't have participated?
In fact there couldn't have been anyone to attack. Or fireworks!!!!!!happen on the Vuelta by default?

 

[c&cfan]

OK. How would have you reacted on this year Vuelta, if Cobo couldn't have participated?
In fact there couldn't have been anyone to attack. Or fireworks!!!!!!happen on the Vuelta by default?

wigans, froome, bawss menchov, mollena.. all of them gave a really nice show.
can you please change your avatar? it's annoying and dull.

 

[apmfbs]

as usual the vuelta doens´t chose a good option, they know rabassa very well and instead of it the go by ordino-canillo.............
I don´t understand

 

[18-Valve. (pithy)]

as usual the vuelta doens´t chose a good option, they know rabassa very well and instead of it the go by ordino-canillo.............
I don´t understand

Better publicity for Andorra I reckon. It's like the 2012 TDF stage to Foix; the host city or region ultimately decides.

Nothing special, but yet better than customary Andorra junk.

Agreed, all in all it's a 2nd category climb, followed by a descent, 15 kilometers of false flat, and a steep 1st category MTF. But I expected worse for the first mountain stage.

 

[Descender]

as usual the vuelta doens´t chose a good option, they know rabassa very well and instead of it the go by ordino-canillo.............
I don´t understand

That makes two of us. It's very frustrating.

 

[Timmy-loves-Rabo]

Spring. Oh, thats a horrible idea.

Vuelta is far better in September. It gives us a longer season rather than mess with the classics. It gets a better lineup. It also gives very high temperatures which helps give it its own identity as a Grand Tour, rather than just - that other one.

No one would go for the Giro Vuelta double anymore.

And arent some of the climbs still in snow in April?

I don't disagree, I like the 3 GTs in the place but like I said vuelta get the worst spot, where it is common for mass-exodus due to worlds prep. Too often this race gets the left overs. Anyway I still like the Vuelta, riders make the race.

 

[The Hitch]

I don't disagree, I like the 3 GTs in the place but like I said vuelta get the worst spot, where it is common for mass-exodus due to worlds prep. Too often this race gets the left overs. Anyway I still like the Vuelta, riders make the race.

I think Giro has worse place and relies more on its prestige. I think a lot of riders next year like Nibali Contador, Evans Sanchez maybe Gilbert since tour starts in his city, would love to do the Giro but just cant risk it before the Tour.

They would even work themselves up to a pretty good fitness level for it, but they cant do the same when its Giro Tour because they just can't take the risk.

Im basing that on things all those riders have said over the last few years.

Vuelta has a good place imo. It lacks the prestige slightly but hopefully it will get it over a few more years. Its at the end of the season so riders don't need to really worry about saving themselves for later.

And as Cadel showed so recently, its perfectly possible to be on top form for Vuelta and Worlds.

Hell Gilbert carried a Vuelta stage 2 form through stage 7 stage 19 Worlds and into Lombardy 5 weeks later.

 

[Luke Schmid]

How about something a bit more radical, swap the worlds and the Vuelta. Riders would not pull out of the Vuelta to do the worlds. Put the worlds on the week ending on the last weekend in August and start the Vuelta in the first weekend in September. Vattenfalls and Plouay forward one week and riders can use Denmark or Burgos then Eneco or Vattenfalls and Plouay as a build up to Worlds. Even Portugal could be used as a lead up to the worlds or even the Vuelta which might give it a bit of a boost with a bit more interest from teams.

 

[khardung la]

I like your idea, for me it makes sense.

How about something a bit more radical, swap the worlds and the Vuelta. Riders would not pull out of the Vuelta to do the worlds. Put the worlds on the week ending on the last weekend in August and start the Vuelta in the first weekend in September. Vattenfalls and Plouay forward one week and riders can use Denmark or Burgos then Eneco or Vattenfalls and Plouay as a build up to Worlds. Even Portugal could be used as a lead up to the worlds or even the Vuelta which might give it a bit of a boost with a bit more interest from teams.

 

[greenedge]

If Contador comes here he will win. Del munda will be his coupe d grace.

 

[Kvinto]

Vuelta's problem with a prestige is the problem with its self-identification first of all. The Tour is the oldest of GTs, the original GT in the end. The identification of Giro is the cruellest mountains, you may contest it for hours but winning the Tour doesn't guarantee the win in Giro. But what is the Vuelta, especially now when it's being organized by ASO? What could make it special? I dunno, but so far (without it) the only purpose of Vuelta (and i don't see how it could change in future) is letting those who is not capable of winning the Tour/Giro (those who failed at the Tour/Giro) show themselves (save their season).

 

[airstream]

Vuelta's problem with a prestige is the problem with its self-identification first of all. The Tour is the oldest of GTs, the original GT in the end. The identification of Giro is the cruellest mountains, you may contest it for hours but winning the Tour doesn't guarantee the win in Giro. But what is the Vuelta, especially now when it's being organized by ASO? What could make it special? I dunno, but so far (without it) the only purpose of Vuelta (and i don't see how it could change in future) is letting those who is not capable of winning the Tour/Giro (those who failed at the Tour/Giro) show themselves (save their season).

They rebranded the Vuelta jerseys. It's ok about that. I guess the most important thing is not to compare the Vuelta with the TdF and the Giro gloss and shine. It's a bit different race, not so full of heart for most of cycling fans, but still very prestigious. That's it.

 

[Descender]

Rumours of a MTF on Vallter 2000 the day after Andorra.

23.5kms at 5.3%.