Vuelta a España 2019 stage 17: Aranda de Duero - Guadalajara > 219.6 km

[Valv.Piti]

Then why hire Landa or why not explain to some of the chiefs that its time to move on before now. Thats bad management and I know I am saying that about a team with a huge trophy cabinet

Because the opportunity presented itself and they didnt know that Carapaz would turn into a world beater this fast.

Sky also has a lot of big names and there has always been quite a lot controversy in the media, at least in last year's Tour. It just happens that more often than not, its actually an ADVANTAGE having more riders contesting the win apart from just one despite what the media is trying to tell you. I mean, look at FDJ in this years Tour - all that work for nothing, basically.

 

[Breezy1985]

Because the opportunity presented itself and they didnt know that Carapaz would turn into a world beater this fast.

Sky also has a lot of big names and there has always been quite a lot controversy in the media, at least in last year's Tour. It just happens that more often than not, its actually an ADVANTAGE having more riders contesting the win apart from just one despite what the media is trying to tell you. I mean, look at FDJ in this years Tour - all that work for nothing, basically.

I meant Bala/Nairo/Landa not Carapaz but it is not comparable to FDJ as yes they would love 2 leaders but cant afford it but even if they could I bet they would not chase each other down. Bala is one of the greatest classics riders of all time but should never be allowed in a co leadership position as he is proven poison to teammates. Single leader worked fine for Indurian and I bet Bala would be really angry to be co leader in the classics

 

[tobydawq]

I imagine this was the fastest road stage ever in a Grand Tour. Can anybody confirm or prove me wrong?

I believe this stage held the record before today but am not entirely sure:

https://www.procyclingstats.com/race/tour-de-france/1999/stage-4

 

[Valv.Piti]

I meant Bala/Nairo/Landa not Carapaz but it is not comparable to FDJ as yes they would love 2 leaders but cant afford it but even if they could I bet they would not chase each other down. Bala is one of the greatest classics riders of all time but should never be allowed in a co leadership position as he is proven poison to teammates. Single leader worked fine for Indurian and I bet Bala would be really angry to be co leader in the classics

It just so happens that Valverde has proved to be better in the mountain than Quintana, so I dont really know what you are on about.. apart from hating on Valv, obviosuly..

 

[Libertine Seguros]

I dont think the stick Movi get on here is because of Nairo trying things rather its about Movi chasing him down when he does

Nairo individually gets a lot of stick for not trying things, though.

 

[Oldermanish]

For all the stick they get, Abarcá have - regularly - managed to interject themselves into GC battles they had absolutely no business being part of (Tour '06, Giro '10), and tried to do the same on numerous other occasions (e.g. with LLS and Plaza in the 2010 Tour). Those GTs they've won recently have been thanks to some calculated gambles (Quintana and Formigal, Carapaz). While they may sometimes draw blanks and their tactics may wind up counterintuitive, it's largely because they keep trying things and, crucially, apart from Valverde who is gradually fading more and more as a stage racer, none of their riders have been able to be consistently good for a three week race in a good few years. Quintana gets a load of stick for being defensive from people that don't remember that how he made his name when everybody loved him back in 2012-13 was a long range attack in the Route du Sud and an unexpected ride to the polka dots in similar fashion; both of his GT wins were predicated on picking one or two stages and attacking from far. And while, yes, he does ride defensively much of the rest of the time, focusing all of his efforts on some really big long-range attacks, there are lots of riders who get a lot of love from the forum whose aggression plans are no different. And even when the race has gone completely awry, Quintana has been able to salvage something from it in general - taking stages in the 2018 and 2019 Tours after his GC bid has failed. Nobody can say that he hasn't raced this Vuelta in entertaining fashion. He won stage 2 with an attack on the flat after turning a stage perceived to be a reduced sprint (obviously along with several others) into an important one, he was on the attack in Andorra seeing as that's why Soler was called back, he was in the break today on a flat stage to try to win his time back (and almost successfully doing so). He'll probably pay for it tomorrow, but hey, he tried to interject himself back into a GC mix he had fallen out of, and more power to him for doing so.

I've noted before that Quintana is an actual racer and admirable in showing initiative. Movistar and Valverde are better off than before although they'd prefer AV in 2nd. I haven't seen the race yet but it sounds like their tactics worked fairly well; the cost of that will play out in the remaining stages. Nairo will not pass Roglic imo barring some mishap but he's made the Vuelta credible.

 

[ice&fire]

I imagine this was the fastest road stage ever in a Grand Tour. Can anybody confirm or prove me wrong?

I believe this stage held the record before today but am not entirely sure:

https://www.procyclingstats.com/race/tour-de-france/1999/stage-4

PCS has posted a list of the fastest vuelta stages in today's live ticker. This one's at the top:

Vuelta a España 2001 Stage 9 results

Igor González de Galdeano is the winner of Vuelta a España 2001 Stage 9, before Sven Teutenberg and Biagio Conte. Joseba Beloki was leader in GC.

www.procyclingstats.com

 

[JosephK]

It was almost a perfect storm of circumstances that could have cost Roglic a lot today (though in the end, it didn't). Jumbo's team director acknowledged as much. With almost all of DQS up front and pulling as hard as if it were a team time trial, along with Sunweb and Moviestar, that was too much firepower for Jumbo's domestiques to chase down, or even keep pace with. Jumbo may be pretty tired tomorrow from today's damage-control efforts, though other teams worked hard also.

 

[Lequack]

 

[Koronin]

I see what Quintana did today as selfish.

 

[TheBigRing]

I see what Quintana did today as selfish.

Of course you do!

 

[Poursuivant]

Superb stuff, tired just watching it.

 

[Lequack]

I see what Quintana did today as selfish.

I wonder how much of it was actually planning and how much luck that he was in that front group. The only ones I could see planning it were Quickstep.

 

[Breezy1985]

Nairo individually gets a lot of stick for not trying things, though.

True I always forget those years I wanted him to attack the skytrain and he just couldn't

 

[UndergroundResistance]

Roglic admits that he wasn't properly positioned in the beginning of the stage.

That makes me so incredibly frustrated that it was Quintana, not Valverde who went in the break.

I think that all this wouldn't have happened in that case. Mistake about which Roglic is talking about was, that he was following Valverdes wheel instead of being in the group with his own teammates who were correctly positioned. They had to drop back when it was known that Primoz missed the break. In my opinion this was only possible with NQ at the front.

 

[Koronin]

I wonder how much of it was actually planning and how much luck that he was in that front group. The only ones I could see planning it were Quickstep.

Quintana could have sat on and NOT worked against his teammate. Which is the only time he doesn't just wheel suck. Quickstep likely did plan this.

 

[DFA123]

Quintana could have sat on and NOT worked against his teammate. Which is the only time he doesn't just wheel suck. Quickstep likely did plan this.

This is getting a bit weird. Quintana had a legit chance of taking the race lead at several points today. It would have been one of the biggest disgraces in recent cycling if he wouldn't have taken any pulls. Even more so if the reason was just to protect the 2nd place of someone nearly three minutes off the lead.

 

[Singularitarian]

Reporte: Did you panic today?
Pogacar: No. I knew that Astana would do all the work.

UAE moneyz to Vino The Merchant?

 

[tobydawq]

This is getting a bit weird. Quintana had a legit chance of taking the race lead at several points today. It would have been one of the biggest disgraces in recent cycling if he wouldn't have taken any pulls. Even more so if the reason was just to protect the 2nd place of someone nearly three minutes off the lead.

Is it only getting a bit weird now?

I think it was weird from post 1 tonight.

 

[rick james]

I see what Quintana did today as selfish.

Valverde attacking to bring the gap down was selfish

 

[rick james]

not really dealing with the point that Valverde was selfish and wrong to attack to bring the gap down

 

[Koronin]

Valverde shouldn't have been point in that position and as he showed up to race for GC and was always being given the freedom to race however he wished and the team stated he was not there to work for anyone else, he had the right to do that.

 

[tobydawq]

not really dealing with the point that Valverde was selfish and wrong to attack to bring the gap down

That's placing yourself right in the other end of the blindness spectrum.

 

[Escarabajo]

Quintana could have sat on and NOT worked against his teammate. Which is the only time he doesn't just wheel suck. Quickstep likely did plan this.

Quintana actually sat on. It was Erviti, Oliveira and Rojas (his friend) who didn't. They were all pulling like madmen to help Quintana get more time against Valverde. Quintana repeatedly was on the radio trying to slow them down so that Valverde had less gap at the end. He was being a good teammate!

 

[hrotha]

I think everything Movistar did today (getting Quintana in the break, pulling from the front group, raising the pace in Roglič's group to disrupt the chase and drop the domestiques) was perfect. It's a pity the payoff wasn't bigger due to Astana's dumb conservative tactics, because Movistar deserved an even better result: Quintana in red with a dangerous gap.