Vuelta a España 2019 stage 2: Benidorm > Calpe 199,6 km

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Lopez could have made it much easier for himself by simply having his teammate pull the group as soon as the climb finished. Set a high steady tempo to prevent attacks.

I agree he had to follow when Roglic and Quintana went. And I agree he's tactically lost more often than not.
 
What a joke Astana was today...
If anyone was a joke, then it's Lopez.
Valverde split the peloton into pieces, only around 15-20 riders crest the climb in the first group and in that group there were no teams with more than 2 riders. Astana was among those teams.
Then Roche and Nieve attacked, Roglic, Uran, Quintana and Aru followed, in that order, and Miguel Angel Lopez stand still!
Then he came to a brilliant idea, to totally burn his last man Ion Izagirre in trying to catch that group, instead of working together with him.
Then of course he was left on his own, although he had some luck cause Formolo was willing to work for Majka.

So I need to ask why do you think that Astana was a joke, or to rephrase it: why Astana was a joke, and Lopez isn't?
 
I think it's difficult to compare. It would make more sense to compare it to the penultimate time they climbed it in the 2017 stage
That comparison would be meaningless because the stage was raced differently. When the climb was done twice, the first time they where in energy preservation mode and many of those who dropped were able to chase before the second ascent. Yesterday they were (almost) full gas and those who dropped were unable to chase before the finish.
BTW, where's @Descender ?
 
That comparison would be meaningless because the stage was raced differently. When the climb was done twice, the first time they where in energy preservation mode and many of those who dropped were able to chase before the second ascent. Yesterday they were (almost) full gas and those who dropped were unable to chase before the finish.
BTW, where's @Descender ?
Pretty much. In 2017 the climb was done with a negative split too, with the uphill sprint only happening after they made the turn towards the dead end.
 
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I honestly don't know what you mean?

My point was, that we don't know what riders had been told to save themselves today, and which have been told to perform.

There is no doubt that on an intermediate stage like today, all the big GC teams pick some riders, and tell them to save themselves for later in the Vuelta..... none of them had everyone up front and ready today, even the teams that made a move.

I surmised that in the case of Astana, it would probably be some of the riders that did the Tour, who are there to ride themselves into form and be of help in the second half of the Vuelta, especially after killing themselves on the TTT yesterday.

If you disagree with that assessment, fair enough, but I don't really see you making a logical argument against it, so I am left wondering why you believe that not to be the case?
I mean dont know what is so hard to understand, if Roglic attacks he should follow, if he doesnt its a mistake or he just couldnt, simple
 
That comparison would be meaningless because the stage was raced differently. When the climb was done twice, the first time they where in energy preservation mode and many of those who dropped were able to chase before the second ascent. Yesterday they were (almost) full gas and those who dropped were unable to chase before the finish.
BTW, where's @Descender ?
no one goes full out when there's still 25k to go afterwards.

But in the end, both comparisons are meaningless because the circumstances were completely different.
 
You only said most impressive ride no mention of the type of terrain.
Not true in any way.

It wasn't me that you were responding to, it was Perico, who said:
First time I’ve ever seen him win anything outside of his comfort zone.
You then replied, with unnecessary aggression:
You can't have been watching him for long then.
So I asked you to elaborate as to what races he has won outside his "comfort zone", to which your reply
You only said most impressive ride no mention of the type of terrain.
is plainly not true.

So to repeat my question:
What do you have in mind? Only non mountain wins I can see for him other than this are time trial victories in Route du Sud 2016 and national U23s in 2009.
 
Reactions: perico
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Not true in any way.

It wasn't me that you were responding to, it was Perico, who said:

You then replied, with unnecessary aggression:

So I asked you to elaborate as to what races he has won outside his "comfort zone", to which your reply

is plainly not true.

So to repeat my question:
I am confused about who said what here Obviously misunderstood the first comment. Probably a bit sensitive to all the IMO necessary criticism of Quintana . But if you think anything was aggressive then I am afraid that is your perception and not my intention
 
I think that "You can't have been watching him for long then" will be interpreted by the vast majority of readers as aggressive, in intention as well as reception.

You are not "confused" about who said what: I have made it very clear to you. What you are is wrong about that, but apparently lacking the civility to apologise for it.

There was no criticism of Quintana in @perico 's post: he said that it was "impressive" and represented an expansion upon what he had been had previous acheived.
 
Reactions: perico
I think that "You can't have been watching him for long then" will be interpreted by the vast majority of readers as aggressive, in intention as well as reception.

You are not "confused" about who said what: I have made it very clear to you. What you are is wrong about that, but apparently lacking the civility to apologise for it.

There was no criticism of Quintana in @perico 's post: he said that it was "impressive" and represented an expansion upon what he had been had previous acheived.
Thank you.

You are right. I was commenting on the fact that I was more impressed by the fact Nairo won in an unexpected manner. It’s not a surprise for Nairo to win a mountain stage. He’s supposed to contend there, not a flat finish. So I was very impressed.
 

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