- May 5, 2010
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Two ITTs, long
One TTT, long
Mountain top finishes in Pyrenees and Alps separated by days.
Last ITT separated from mountains by a couple of days
Hard aggressive riding, not negative racing.
In short, the exact opposite of everything we are seeing this year.
This course does not produce a winner who is the most complete rider.
It rewards defensive chicken-sh*t riding and conserving becasue the last 4-5 days are stupid hard. If they want a clean peloton, make hard stages separated from heard stages with chances for riders to recover and the sprinter teams taking control of the race.
Evan Cav was complaining that no teams can or will go to hte front to bring the breaks back--they are all conserving.
One TTT, long
Mountain top finishes in Pyrenees and Alps separated by days.
Last ITT separated from mountains by a couple of days
Hard aggressive riding, not negative racing.
In short, the exact opposite of everything we are seeing this year.
This course does not produce a winner who is the most complete rider.
It rewards defensive chicken-sh*t riding and conserving becasue the last 4-5 days are stupid hard. If they want a clean peloton, make hard stages separated from heard stages with chances for riders to recover and the sprinter teams taking control of the race.
Evan Cav was complaining that no teams can or will go to hte front to bring the breaks back--they are all conserving.
- Jun 27, 2011
- 6
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There's nothing wrong with the course; it gives ample opportunity to attack. The problem is with the riders. They are prepared by scientists in a lab, but they lack the right attitude in a race: the will to win. That's why someone like Voeckler can do well. He hasn't got the athletic abilities of some others, but he's got those old fashioned qualities and he's not afraid to race.
In the year 2021 or 2026, you will all look back at this Tour and remember the good bits, while forgetting the bad bits and say how the Tour was so much better 10-15 years ago compared to that year's version, when in fact it will be largely the same.
A couple of years ago I got hold of a copy of all the British highlight shows from the 1989. Believe me, there was just as much crap back then as there is now.
A couple of years ago I got hold of a copy of all the British highlight shows from the 1989. Believe me, there was just as much crap back then as there is now.
- May 15, 2011
- 45,171
- 617
- 24,680
- Apr 3, 2009
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LaFlorecita said:
They've had 1km prologues in the Giro. This would be twice that and a climb. I think it's a great idea, actually. Would cause some small gaps and be great to watch.
- Sep 10, 2009
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Exactly what we're seeing this year - two weeks in and there's no dominant rider, GC still very much up in the air, an outsider stirring the pot, and the Alps yet to come. Best of all, I'm having a really hard time deciding who I want to win - Bertie to come back and grab the Giro-Tour double? Evans to finally win his Tour? Voeckler with the big upset, and the first French winner since Fignon? One of the Schlecks to finally win the big one? I think I'd be happy if any of those scenarios happened, tbh.
So much better than the days of Indurain and Armstrong, when, by this point, they would normally have a stranglehold on the race and all one could hope for is that they cracked. Which only happened once, really, ie Indurain in '96.
So much better than the days of Indurain and Armstrong, when, by this point, they would normally have a stranglehold on the race and all one could hope for is that they cracked. Which only happened once, really, ie Indurain in '96.
- May 5, 2010
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LaFlorecita said:
Maybe start them a little before the climb. I'm not sure but I imagine putting the starting ramp up the actual ascent might be a little difficult.
It doesn't have to be Mur de Bretagne though. Just a relatively short and steep climb. Say about 12%...
Is Mur de Bretagne even that steep?
- Feb 20, 2010
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Puy de Dôme is unfortunately not a logistical possibility anymore - not enough room at the top. I'm sure Angelo Zomegnan would have worked some crazy way around it, possibly involving the riders completing an ITT from Clermont-Ferrand to Puy de Dôme and then ziplining down to the Col de Ceyssat for the presentations, but for the Tour it's simply not feasible. The Col du Grand-Colombier, between Lyon and Genève, is probably the nearest feasible one.the asian said:
They could have 19 sprint stages in a row, then an ITT or a MTF and then the parade into Paris. No winner decided until the penultimate day, but it would be absolute drivel to watch.Barracuda said:
Not a bad idea. Races like the Settimana Lombarda have done that. I think you could also put a prologue in cities or towns with some hills in them, or similar shortish climbs. A Giro start in Chieti, for example. A Tour starting in Lyon could start with a prologue with a couple of flat km then a climb of the Colline de Fourvières, or one starting in Nice could climb the Col d'Èze like the old days of Paris-Nice. Similarly, a race in Toulon could climb Mont Faron, or a start in Marseille could climb to Val Toulouse.RedheadDane said:
- May 15, 2011
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red_flanders said:
They did? And not a mountain prologue? Just a normal one? That's like a long sprint LOL. Gaps were probably miniscule, weren't they?
- Feb 20, 2010
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- Apr 3, 2009
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LaFlorecita said:
Sorry, I shouldn't have listed that as a plural. They had the 1 k prologue in the 2005 Giro, which BTW (and probably unrelated to the prologue) was a FANTASTIC race.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2005_Giro_d'Italia#Prologue
Barracuda said:
Because nothing happened yet. In a great Tour something does need to happen at least a couple times a week. In 2011 the only thing that happened is people crashing.
For a great Tour, I would love it if either the Alps or the Pyrenees are in the first week and the other in the last.
Best tour ever - Giro 2003
Never been a tour de France to match the Giro in 2003.
- Simoni wins by making crazy attacks in the mountains that frequently almost come unstuck.
- lots of flat out attacks with nothing held back from all parties. None of this little dig to see if they are watching rubbish (yes I am talking about the Schlecks).
- Cipo sets the record for the most Giro stages won, which is unlikely to ever be approached. If you think that Cav's record in the Tour is good, take a look at the Giro record.
- Pettachi wins 6 stages and looks to be the new dominant sprinter.
- Pantani turning himself inside out trying to return to glory.
Never been a tour de France to match the Giro in 2003.
- Simoni wins by making crazy attacks in the mountains that frequently almost come unstuck.
- lots of flat out attacks with nothing held back from all parties. None of this little dig to see if they are watching rubbish (yes I am talking about the Schlecks).
- Cipo sets the record for the most Giro stages won, which is unlikely to ever be approached. If you think that Cav's record in the Tour is good, take a look at the Giro record.
- Pettachi wins 6 stages and looks to be the new dominant sprinter.
- Pantani turning himself inside out trying to return to glory.
Highlander said:
No, they do that because most of France is pretty flat. There's always lots of flat stages.
Since we're starting in Liege next year they have to pay tribute to La Doyenne on the first weekend. Personally I would then hope for a route like this with a quick dive down to the Black Forest and Vosges area and some proper medium mountains in the middle of the first week to settle the nerves - I drew a mtf at Schauinsland, which I think is Montevergine type difficulty, then a tough route through the Vosges finishing at Gerardsmer after the Col de la Schlucht. Obviously some flat stages after that, then 50km flat chrono on the middle monday before tuesday rest day, then camp in the Alps for the rest of the second week with a mix of mountain finishes and transitional stages to suit the breakaways. Transition to the Pyrenees for the end of the third week, and second itt at Pau just because the Tour ALWAYS goes to Pau!
I can't really understand why people are so grumpy about the quality (or lack of) in this tour.
Yeah, we've not had fireworks but there's suspense, intrigue and talking points aplenty.
And, with a week to go, we still don't have a clue who's going to win. In that sense I think this tour has been a nicely balanced affair with a very interesting and enjoyable first week, a nice sortie into the massif central and the pyrenees nicely setting the scene for what could yet be a battle royale through the alps.
OK, maybe the alps will be a big let-down as the climbers are unable to drop the testers and we get 6 or 7 riders looking at each other but they might not. We just don't know. And that's the beauty of it.
Yeah, we've not had fireworks but there's suspense, intrigue and talking points aplenty.
And, with a week to go, we still don't have a clue who's going to win. In that sense I think this tour has been a nicely balanced affair with a very interesting and enjoyable first week, a nice sortie into the massif central and the pyrenees nicely setting the scene for what could yet be a battle royale through the alps.
OK, maybe the alps will be a big let-down as the climbers are unable to drop the testers and we get 6 or 7 riders looking at each other but they might not. We just don't know. And that's the beauty of it.
- Jul 16, 2010
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