Where is Chris Carmichael?

[TexPat]

Why was Carmichael part of the circus?

 

[DirtyWorks]

Why has Tygart not gone after Carmichael, Eddie B or Och?

Given Carmichael's status as a beard, it would be a little surprising to hear he was actually involved in the doping that USADA sanctioned.

Och is another one that has gotten away Scott free.

 

[Benotti69]

Why was Carmichael part of the circus?

To put people off the scent that they were using Ferrari, I guess.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

Why was Carmichael part of the circus?

Coz you can't sell Dr Ferrari's training plans, with their circles and their dots, but you sure as hell can sell any other kind of cookie cutter program if you align it with a big star.

 

[ustabe]

Given Carmichael's status as a beard, it would be a little surprising to hear he was actually involved in the doping that USADA sanctioned.

Och is another one that has gotten away Scott free.

Eddie B. gets of because of the statute of limitations.

As a beard, Carmichael's role in actual doping might be non-existent. (As a rider, we know otherwise, according to Walsh, but, again, that statute of limitations.)

Far as I can tell, Och is hiding somewhere under the witness protection program.

Remember that Armstrong's 2009 comeback was key in USADA's decision to go after him.

Both Chris Carmichael and George Hincapie seem to have thriving careers still administering cycling clothing and training advice to Freds. I've got a Hincapie jersey from last year's Ride the Rockies, and both are showing up for a pre-ride "conditioning ride" and presentations during this year's event.

 

[86TDFWinner]

As a beard, Carmichael's role in actual doping might be non-existent. (As a rider, we know otherwise, according to Walsh, but, again, that statute of limitations.)

Far as I can tell, Och is hiding somewhere under the witness protection program.


Both Chris Carmichael and George Hincapie seem to have thriving careers still administering cycling clothing and training advice to Freds. I've got a Hincapie jersey from last year's Ride the Rockies, and both are showing up for a pre-ride "conditioning ride" and presentations during this year's event.

Didn't Carmichael dope as far back as when he rode for 7 Eleven? I'm sure that's what you're talking about, I'm just trying to clarify. I was really surprised and shocked when reading Wheelmen, just how far back the doping went, and that many of the guys on 7 Eleven were doping. Who was right there "looking the other way", was Och.

The more I know/find out about that guy, the bigger a POS he's become.


Like most here(and I've asked before too), I often wonder how he's gotten off scott free, w/a get out of jail card.

 

[Oldman]

Didn't Carmichael dope as far back as when he rode for 7 Eleven? I'm sure that's what you're talking about, I'm just trying to clarify. I was really surprised and shocked when reading Wheelmen, just how far back the doping went, and that many of the guys on 7 Eleven were doping. Who was right there "looking the other way", was Och.

The more I know/find out about that guy, the bigger a POS he's become.


Like most here(and I've asked before too), I often wonder how he's gotten off scott free, w/a get out of jail card.

That 7 Eleven era was child's play compared to now. If they did anything it was steroids and speed. The willingness was there but would venture that a good portion of the team was relatively clean.

 

[mewmewmew13]

That 7 Eleven era was child's play compared to now. If they did anything it was steroids and speed. The willingness was there but would venture that a good portion of the team was relatively clean.

Child's play yes..but the mentality of many seemed to be 'do whatever it takes'…and it sounded casual and out in the open..

 

[Oldman]

Child's play yes..but the mentality of many seemed to be 'do whatever it takes'…and it sounded casual and out in the open..

Granted we were amateurs and not directly privy to their training regime until some teammates proved their equals...squeaky clean. Then the USAC slimebags started checking in to see if the guys we were riding with were natural or Program riders. Imagine their excitement at finding out they were pristine, unspoiled specimens with much upside! Imagine their disappointment when most of them declined to participate and gave up the sport. 7-11 and most of the other teams raised the profile of the sport but did little to actually promote true talent.

 

[Freddythefrog]

A common misconception about Eddie B. I used to think he was some doping guru but all the folks I talk to say quite the opposite. It was Ed Burke who set up the transfusions and Eddie B was not informed of it until afterward

That is interesting, I did not know that. However, it is inconceivable that an elite Eastern Block Athlete of this time was not exposed to PED use and someone like Eddie B who, in Poland, had transitioned from athlete to coach, would have been well acquainted with benefits and the system. No "I'll do it clean" attitude would have been able to stay in the system and unless he could bring knowledge to the table, he would not have been employed by USAC.

Blood Transfusions may have a step beyond his personal knowledge, but when was it all public? I well remember even the BBC commentators speaking about Lasse Viren taking blood and re-injecting it, in his preparation fro the Montreal games so, it would have to have been on the agenda for every state system by 1980. It was not illegal at the time - when did it become illegal in Athletics - mid 1980s ?

Question is - what would Carmichael have taken from his exposure to USAC and 7-11 ? Well for that I think we have evidence enough in the Strock Keiter case.

 

[ustabe]

Didn't Carmichael dope as far back as when he rode for 7 Eleven? I'm sure that's what you're talking about, I'm just trying to clarify.

Thanks for making me look this up. Carmichael was coaching the US senior squad while Rene Wenzel coached the juniors, in the early '90s. According to Lance to Landis, Greg Strock recalled getting injected with "extract of cortisone" by Carmichael, who appeared to be pretty handy with the syringe. I must have lifted the news of doping as a rider from a less authoritative source.

With all the emphasis on blood boosting, the "steriod period" tends to get swept under.

 

[Granville57]

April 10, 2001

60 Minutes

Dope and Glory
Were American Athletes Given Performance-Enhancing Drugs

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/dope-and-glory-10-04-2001/

 

[ustabe]

Oh, yeah. And also, according to Walsh, Carmichael settled with Strock to have his name removed from the suit against the USCF and Wenzel.

 

[DirtyWorks]

Oh, yeah. And also, according to Walsh, Carmichael settled with Strock to have his name removed from the suit against the USCF and Wenzel.

A Strock interview at VN was done with Strock's lawyer present to be sure Carmichael's name was not mentioned to comply with a settlement terms. The article bends over backwards to make sure another coach was referenced. The 60 Minutes segment makes it plain as day Carmichael was running the show.

I was never so good, but it was made clear to me being invited to an evaluation at USAC for even a brief period of time included whether or not you would take the injections.

 

[86TDFWinner]

A Strock interview at VN was done with Strock's lawyer present to be sure Carmichael's name was not mentioned to comply with a settlement terms. The article bends over backwards to make sure another coach was referenced. The 60 Minutes segment makes it plain as day Carmichael was running the show.

I was never so good, but it was made clear to me being invited to an evaluation at USAC for even a brief period of time included whether or not you would take the injections.

THAT'S why he's never mentioned much.....

 

[RobbieCanuck]

Oh, yeah. And also, according to Walsh, Carmichael settled with Strock to have his name removed from the suit against the USCF and Wenzel.

The Strock case settled in late 2006. Does anyone know any of the settlement details?

 

[Dear Wiggo]

The Strock case settled in late 2006. Does anyone know any of the settlement details?

All the pros agree to stop doping from that point forward.

 

[RobbieCanuck]

All the pros agree to stop doping from that point forward.

That is classic!

 

[Hugh Januss]

All the pros agree to stop doping from that point forward.

Now that is funny!

 

[Fortyninefourteen]

All the pros agree to stop doping from that point forward.

Someone forgot to tell the Chicken.

 

[Race Radio]

Chris is packing his suitcase of courage......errrr, drugs

 

[DirtyWorks]

Chris is packing his suitcase of courage......errrr, drugs

Double posting this, "What about Chris Carmichael?"

http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showpost.php?p=1410209&postcount=6416

Betsy doing the right thing. Again. Thank you Betsy, or Becky, or Besty??

 

[Freddythefrog]

Remember when Rebecca Twigg was so disgusted with Chris she left the Olympics before her last event to get away from him?
http://articles.latimes.com/1996-08-01/news/ss-30168_1_individual-time-trial

Chris Comical "questioning her preparation"

and

"A common misconception about Eddie B. I used to think he was some doping guru but all the folks I talk to say quite the opposite. It was Ed Burke who set up the transfusions and Eddie B was not informed of it until afterward"

At
Joe Harris comments :http://theouterline.com/?p=450&utm_...al&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer
[Great Article by Harris & Maxwell]
"However, it should be noted that Eddie didn’t experiment with the technique until mid-1984, after news of Conconi’s “method” made the rounds in Europe, and his application was both amateurish and barbaric. For example, he used homologous blood donated by like-blood type individuals and relatives of the riders, and only transfused whole blood. As a result, up to half the cells were dead by the time of infusion, and Rebecca Twigg became sick with flu from the infected donor of her bag. He could have killed any one of the riders whom he enticed to use the technique.

Borysewicz likely wasn’t the first cycling coach to use blood doping, as the technique was widely known in sports science since Lasse Viren’s distance running exploits in the ’70s. We argue that Conconi and his team refined, productized, and laid the foundation for the practice as an institutional tool in professional athletics, and more importantly, created the body of knowledge that made EPO the most powerful weapon ever in endurance athletics."
So we have Rebecca Twigg taking the transfusion and yet I believe she was not one of the 7 confirmed dopers in the 1984 team. Can anyone confirm that please ? We have Carmichael there, seeing it all first hand and getting his prototype for what he would do with the USAC Juniors including Big George, Lance, Strock and Keiter.

 

[mewmewmew13]

Double posting this, "What about Chris Carmichael?"

http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showpost.php?p=1410209&postcount=6416

Betsy doing the right thing. Again. Thank you Betsy, or Becky, or Besty??

Besty…makes me smile

 

[86TDFWinner]

As a result, up to half the cells were dead by the time of infusion, and Rebecca Twigg became sick with flu from the infected donor of her bag. He could have killed any one of the riders whom he enticed to use the technique.

So what is this saying, did she dope just this once, or what? I'm not trying to to start anything, I was just curious if there was more to this then what's said here. Was Twigg contemplating a sophisticated doping program, or was this just her experimenting(which I think is more the case) and her not liking the results.