Why Tenerife?

[Benotti69]

I guess the local economy in Tenerife is very happy to have cycling teams there spending money and will not do anything to jeopardise it.

 

[42x16ss]

I guess the local economy in Tenerife is very happy to have cycling teams there spending money and will not do anything to jeopardise it.

Just think of the business 4-5 world tour squads would bring. When you consider that they will spend most of their time there out of peak season I'd imagine that the riders (and their food consumption - the catering bills would be huge!) would be most welcome.

 

[Ferminal]

Serious questione here, but why have a few Saxo Bank riders been training at altitude at Mt Etna in Italy the last few weeks if Tenerife is the place to be for doping purposes?

Easier for Ferrari...

 

[sniper]

Just think of the business 4-5 world tour squads would bring. When you consider that they will spend most of their time there out of peak season I'd imagine that the riders (and their food consumption - the catering bills would be huge!) would be most welcome.

yep, many benefits.
it attracts more tourism.
local media have stuff to report about.
etc.

 

[doperhopper]

Serious questione here, but why have a few Saxo Bank riders been training at altitude at Mt Etna in Italy the last few weeks if Tenerife is the place to be for doping purposes?

Come one, just listen. The magic powers of Etna last longer, 6+ weeks according to Chris Anker (1:10).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RURauOqHkFI#t=138

That's why this year we'll see Albuterol kicking Vroomie's a$$.

 

[pastronef]

Froome packing bikes to fly to Tenerife last friday. Thomas too. I guess Richie will join. Maybe Kennaugh, Kiri and some other July guys there too.

https://twitter.com/chrisfroome/status/467251547890790400/photo/1/large

https://twitter.com/GeraintThomas86/status/466611883446112256/photo/1/large


which hotel is that close to the volcano?

 

[Nilsson]

Froome packing bikes to fly to Tenerife last friday. Thomas too. I guess Richie will join. Maybe Kennaugh, Kiri and some other July guys there too.

https://twitter.com/chrisfroome/status/467251547890790400/photo/1/large

https://twitter.com/GeraintThomas86/status/466611883446112256/photo/1/large


which hotel is that close to the volcano?

The Parador de las Cañadas del Teide. It's located at an altitude of 2100 m.

 

[Franklin]

Serious questione here, but why have a few Saxo Bank riders been training at altitude at Mt Etna in Italy the last few weeks if Tenerife is the place to be for doping purposes?

Serious question here: Why is it relevant where a few riders decide to prepare?

I fail to see why you think there's only one place in the world where you can dope. Indeed, to turn it around I also fail to see why choosing for Tenerife is choosing for doping.

To zoom in: I'd say what you need for a nice program is:

1. reliable good weather
2. good infrastructure to train
3. a mountain
4. good private hotels.
5. not too expensive
6. remote location.

Nice to have:

Low language barrier (not a biggie), reliable food (you can bring your own)


Which is accidentally also what you would want for a clean traings program.

To sum up: the puzzle piece missing is the doctors. It's interesting if we had any clue who are hanging around Tenerife... or the Etna. Then again with the already available doctors at the teams you don't need to hire an external

 

[DirtyWorks]

Serious question here: Why is it relevant where a few riders decide to prepare?

I fail to see why you think there's only one place in the world where you can dope. Indeed, to turn it around I also fail to see why choosing for Tenerife is choosing for doping.

The country is easy on dopers, and Tenerife is far away from testers.

And whatever you do, ignore the fact two-time doping controversy generator Fuentes was/is????? a resident.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eufemiano_Fuentes

http://www.islandconnections.eu/1000003/1000031/0/39074/sports-news-article.html

That doesn't mean automatically that Fuentes sees all these riders on the island. But, we know from Fuentes' last trial Spain essentially runs a National doping program with Fuentes as a key person.
-Dope on Tenerife
-Let "glow time" pass. Well, no one is testing, so no "glow time." And even then, the UCI could just ignore like they just did.
-Show up and destroy field with no recent racing in the legs.
-Never test positive.

Since I've just digested this whole thread for Franklin to ignore, it's worth mentioning training at altitude is not shown to be consistently effective. And if it is effective, the gains don't take a mid-field rider to grand tour podium.

Seems legit.

 

[pastronef]

.
-Dope on *
-Let "glow time" pass. Well, no one is testing, so no "glow time." And even then, the UCI could just ignore like they just did.
-Show up and destroy field with no recent racing in the legs.
-Never test positive.

* what's the name of Quintana's birthplace again?

 

[manafana]

Have always disliked this training camps in isolated spots as it surely puts off the testers going their as its such a trek for them their not going to go their as much as the major towns.

 

[King Boonen]

Have always disliked this training camps in isolated spots as it surely puts off the testers going their as its such a trek for them their not going to go their as much as the major towns.

I doubt very much it is up to the testers when and where they test people. And getting to Tenerife is pretty easy...

 

[Race Radio]

 

[Franklin]

The country is easy on dopers, and Tenerife is far away from testers.

As I said: Remote. As is the Etna.

About the Spanish being soft on dopers, well we agree to disagree. The evidence about the judicial action indicates they have been cracking down harder than almost any other country. But don't let facts like courtcases distract you from a good biased opinion.

And whatever you do, ignore the fact two-time doping controversy generator Fuentes was/is????? a resident.

Considering I pointed out the importance of doctors I would say I hardly ignore it. But Fuentes is currently most likely a non-factor. So who are hanging around right now?

Since I've just digested this whole thread for Franklin to ignore,

Perhaps a bit less kneejerking instead of pushing up idiotic strawmen. I neither am ignorant, nor do I dismiss any notion of doping. Indeed if you read what I said instead of shooting of you wad, you would see I point out why the Etna, Tenerife and fill in your remote location works.

And your digesting seems to miss the hilarious fact I have been pointing out the BS about Tenerife about a year ago. Seems your digesting is a tad off

it's worth mentioning training at altitude is not shown to be consistently effective. And if it is effective, the gains don't take a mid-field rider to grand tour podium.

And that's missing the ridiculousness of climbing a col 100 times as "training". But hey, who am I besides pointing that out in this thread about a year ago....



Seriously. I am sick.and.tired of having to burn down these strawmen all because I don't go along with the frothing at the mouth nonsense. In this case someone starts to ask about the Etna... And that's simply utterly missing the point. Tenerife is just a place on the map. You can dope everywhere. And on the other hand there's nothing nefarious about training at a place with a good climate... I did it myself with my brother.

In other words, a rider going to Tenerife is not in itself proof of shehanigans. It's not even extremely suspicuous considering it has been a place to go for cyclists long before Epo was a dream.

The problems start when there is a verifiable cloud of BS around it all (like training methods that make no sense at all, hello Sky!). But Tenerife itself? It's a nice place to hang out

 

[Digger]

Last April 12mths Walsh wrote a piece on sky...he mentioned in 8 visits to Tenerife, testers had shown up once,

 

[42x16ss]

Last April 12mths Walsh wrote a piece on sky...he mentioned in 8 visits to Tenerife, testers had shown up once,

IIRC in April one of the Belkin riders said that he hadn't been OOC tested so far in 2014. He lived in the remote, far off Netherlands.

The testers rarely show up anywhere it seems.

 

[Franklin]

IIRC in April one of the Belkin riders said that he hadn't been OOC tested so far in 2014. He lived in the remote, far off Netherlands.

The testers rarely show up anywhere it seems.

It's a matter of money. Testing/testers are expensive. Who should pick up the tab?

- The local sports union? They are generally underfunded themselves. Also, is their primary goal cleaning cycling... or is it organising events, attracting new riders etc?
- The government? Spend tax-money in these meagre times? Not exactly a priority.

There's no easy solution there. And that's without even looking at vested interest and shehanigans

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

The only question is, did Wiggo take the pic

 

[Benotti69]

I doubt very much it is up to the testers when and where they test people. And getting to Tenerife is pretty easy...

Why have Sky who spend a lot of time there only been tested once in 8 visits to the Island?

 

[King Boonen]

Why have Sky who spend a lot of time there only been tested once in 8 visits to the Island?

That data point is useless unless you can provide data proving the other teams are tested significantly more times, or showing that testing is higher in areas where anti-doping labs are situated.

 

[Benotti69]

As I said: Remote. As is the Etna.

About the Spanish being soft on dopers, well we agree to disagree. The evidence about the judicial action indicates they have been cracking down harder than almost any other country. But don't let facts like courtcases distract you from a good biased opinion.


..........

Spanish are soft on doping. Fuentes case proves that. Since they have all the blood bags and are doing nothing!

How many times have they tested their top cyclists in 2013 or this year?

Got figures to back Spanish cracking down on doping?

Considering Spain is bankrupt, i doubt they are going to be spending money trying to catch sports stars cheating.

The Italians are trying to do something, but the bureaucracy in Italy means the task is very hard.

 

[stutue]

Why have Sky who spend a lot of time there only been tested once in 8 visits to the Island?

That is a ridiculously badly formulated question.

Edit: cross post with King B

 

[Benotti69]

That data point is useless unless you can provide data proving the other teams are tested significantly more times, or showing that testing is higher in areas where anti-doping labs are situated.

The other teams are not claiming to be transparent and anti doping like Sky.

They all dope, the UCI are not interested in catching doping, if they were, every team would be tested everytime they went to Tenerife. Not once in 8 visits.

Just like the announcement of banning a substance they cant actually test for.

 

[stutue]

The other teams are not claiming to be transparent and anti doping like Sky.
.

Clearly boll0cks.

11 out of 18 pro teams are signed up to MPCC.

 

[King Boonen]

The other teams are not claiming to be transparent and anti doping like Sky.

They all dope, the UCI are not interested in catching doping, if they were, every team would be tested everytime they went to Tenerife. Not once in 8 visits.

Just like the announcement of banning a substance they cant actually test for.

It's not up to Sky when they are tested, I don't see how Sky's PR spiel is at all relevant here. I'm unsure whose authority they fall under outside competition (UCI? UKADA? individual NADO's depending on rider nationality? Country where residings NADO?) but they can decide to test them whenever they want, you can't blame Sky for not being tested. There are twitter pictures, blogs and stories every time they are there, including before they arrive. It's not like the testers don't know they are going.

Like it or not, Tenerife is about as perfect a place for altitude training as you can get. And it certainly has better access links and is closer to Europe than many of the other possible places, probably even better than some mainland sites.

Anything that can be used for doping should be banned, it's irrelevant whether they can test for it or not. That's a different thread though.