Wiggins Discussion thread.

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Franklin

May 26, 2009
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The Hitch said:
I also dispute the idea that the second best rider on a team must be a domestique and can't have a free role. Under normal circumstances froome should have been given a free role, but sky wanted to win with Wiggins.
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Well Hitch, I would say that history has a fair share of duo-Leaderships which failed in the face of the competition. If we go to the near past: We have Jan-Kloeden-Vino who tied in different compositions. We have the Shreck bro's who have been crushed by Alberto and Cadel.

Recent succes stories? We have Sastre-Shrecks and that's it*. Indeed even with Sastre he was actually the leader designated before the TdF.

There's a reason the winner almost always comes from a team with one leader. It's more effective if consider the data that we have. Be it chemistry, organisation, whatever. Two captains on a ship is just a bad idea.

So clearly it's not normal at all that the lieutenant get's a free role.


*Contador-Armstrong was not a team with two leaders. It were two mini teams who just rode against each other.
 
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Franklin

May 26, 2009
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Cookster15 said:
His knighthood seems to have given him a sense of entitlement. .
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Yet it's not a drop in the ocean of entitlement Froome thinks he has. And yes, that's painfuly obvious through his own biography which is a most gruesome character suicide.

To my surprise, as I thought he was a collected character, Froome is missing more than a few restraints in the mental department.
 
gregrowlerson

gregrowlerson

Aug 6, 2010
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Franklin said:
Well Hitch, I would say that history has a fair share of duo-Leaderships which failed in the face of the competition. If we go to the near past: We have Jan-Kloeden-Vino who tied in different compositions. We have the Shreck bro's who have been crushed by Alberto and Cadel.

Recent succes stories? We have Sastre-Shrecks and that's it*. Indeed even with Sastre he was actually the leader designated before the TdF.

There's a reason the winner almost always comes from a team with one leader. It's more effective if consider the data that we have. Be it chemistry, organisation, whatever. Two captains on a ship is just a bad idea.

So clearly it's not normal at all that the lieutenant get's a free role.


*Contador-Armstrong was not a team with two leaders. It were two mini teams who just rode against each other.
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I agree with Hitch that you can have two leaders, or at least a strong domestique who is given a relatively free role.

It can depend on the team make up. When Lance won his seven Tours it wasn't going to matter what anyone else did. Apart from '03 he was clearly the strongest rider.

But take a couple of Kloden's Tours. In '04, if he'd been made to wait for Ullrich in the Pyrenees, then there is no way that he would have beaten Basso to second spot on the podium. And the small help that he could have given Jan wouldn't have allowed him to limit his losses enough to eventually defeat Ivan, so giving Andreas a free role here was a good decision.

The opposite occurred in the '07 Tour. Already well ahead of Vino in the overall standings and with apparently stronger legs given his super showing in the prologue, Kloden was nevertheless asked to work and then wait for his team captain on the first MTF in the Alps. In the end it didn't matter since Astana was thrown out of the race in disgrace, but Kloden was a potential podium finisher in that event, whereas Vino wasn't.

A little off topic so I will also post elsewhere ;)
 
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nevada

Dec 18, 2009
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Good article in ST today. It seems there has been a mutual dislike since the Vuelta. Also interesting is Wiggo hasn't been told yet that he's not going but takes it upon himself to interview on the BBC !

It's that kind errant behaviour that makes brailsford a decision any easy one.
 
Jones123

Jones123

Jun 6, 2014
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nevada said:
Good article in ST today. It seems there has been a mutual dislike since the Vuelta. Also interesting is Wiggo hasn't been told yet that he's not going but takes it upon himself to interview on the BBC !

It's that kind errant behaviour that makes brailsford a decision any easy one.
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Brailsford rang him and told him he should focus on on the Commonwealth Games
 
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webvan

Mar 11, 2009
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Indeed, whereas he could have appeared "miffed" at Wiggo for talking to the BBC yesterday, he is in fact offering him some "support" ("Despite the impression that might have been created", "People should be careful before thinking Chris is making decisions here").

Team Cound must have blown a gasket when reading that!
 
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bigcog

Jul 9, 2012
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I'd say he's edging his bets, this could be read as saying there are other inter- personal issues in play:

"Trust and harmony are important considerations and it’s a difficult decision. I’m not just talking about the harmony between Chris and Brad but harmony amongst all the riders and staff."
 
roundabout

roundabout

Jun 7, 2010
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webvan said:
Indeed, whereas he could have appeared "miffed" at Wiggo for talking to the BBC yesterday, he is in fact offering him some "support" ("Despite the impression that might have been created", "People should be careful before thinking Chris is making decisions here").

Team Cound must have blown a gasket when reading that!
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Actually it would make them seem less responsible when Wiggins subsequently is not taken
 
armchairclimber

armchairclimber

Jul 16, 2011
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He's just taking the heat off team Cound as well as re-asserting his own authority. He won't want an adverse reaction from the Brit crowds towards Froome...especially as we all now know that he is just as "sensitive" as Wiggins.

Frankly, I'd be astonished if Murdoch Jnr didn't have a hand in the team selection process, via Dave's ear.
 
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elfed68

Jan 28, 2014
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Turns out Froome's got a white cat called Coco Froome who posts on Twitter.

So, Ernst Blofeld and his cat or Dr Evil and Mr Bigglesworth?

Ah Mr Wiggins I've been expecting you
Or
When I get angry Mr. Bigglesworth gets upset, and when Mr. Bigglesworth get upset, PEOPLE DIE!!
 
Jelantik

Jelantik

Jul 19, 2010
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bigcog said:
Brailsford reacts to Wiggins:

http://www1.skysports.com/cycling/n...sir-bradley-wiggins-wrong-over-team-selection
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LOL. Thanks for the article. This reads to me as 'brilliant' move by wiggins announcing that he is definitely not selected. Again, wiggins is using the public to support for his cause. Brilliant! Now Brailsford has to come out and say something about it. The problem with his statement about team harmony between the riders and staffs can be read as 'wiggins is a pain in the a-ss'. so no way he create harmony within the rider and the staff. Wiggins got the form to back it up this year, the only thing that he doesn't have is" he is not the harmony puzzle piece." Otherwise, Brailsford would have said, brad in on form and would be a good asset to help Froome .. bla, bla, bla. By saying he hasn't chosen the team and depends on team harmony, he is basically delaying to say that wiggins is not going to be on TDF team. I remembered way back, he said that the form and performance were the reason to get selected to the team. Now seems like that wasn't the case, coz wiggins got his form back this year.

Even though I feel sorry for Wiggins, the fact the matters is he likes to stir up things using media. Since he is the former TDF winner, every news outlet will take whatever comment he said. If he doesn't win TDF few years back, no one will care about what he said. From Brailsford points of view, he is kinda a PR headache to deal with and for team perspective, he is kinda a distraction that they don't need.

Nonetheless, as I predicted before whether wiggins make the TDF team or not, it doesn't matter, sky will continue to be a soap opera as long as wiggins and Froome are in the same team. Brailsford just needs to choose which one is the lesser evil.

I'm surprise Michelle doesn't go on rampage on her twitter already. That woman usually have a loose mouth about everything and a PR loose canon. Now she clamped tight? Interesting!
 
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webvan

Mar 11, 2009
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We'll see how he does at the TDS but it can't be worse than Porte today. What's amazing is that DB and Mr. Cound thought Porte was doing great again! Does it mean the differences are minute but lead to big gaps or were they just bluffing?

The way things are going at Sky, they won't even have room for a "Plan B", they'll need Wiggo to pull earlier rather than later...
 
Jelantik

Jelantik

Jul 19, 2010
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webvan said:
We'll see how he does at the TDS but it can't be worse than Porte today. What's amazing is that DB and Mr. Cound thought Porte was doing great again! Does it mean the differences are minute but lead to big gaps or were they just bluffing?

The way things are going at Sky, they won't even have room for a "Plan B", they'll need Wiggo to pull earlier rather than later...
Click to expand...

I guess their PR machine is crumbling down now. Porte already got dropped on some 6-7km down on the easier mountain out of the 3. Clearly, it's obvious, all the talk about dynamic etc, is just their PR to try to skip Wiggins. I don't think wiggins will win TdS, but I do think he will perform better than Porte. (if Porte continuos his trend today). Week end will tell where Porte's form is actually is. Oh my.. this is going to be the best summer blockbuster soap opera courtesy of team sky.. and with porte performance's today, he is just throwing more gasoline to an already burning fire. Now, he is under pressure too, to perform on the weekend.
 
dduff442

dduff442

Jun 9, 2014
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Great stage (and comment thread).

It looked to me like Porte dropped off a little too easily. Same with Hesjedal (who seemed to have tons of energy all of a sudden once the camera started showing him drifting back). I'd guess they've other objectives for the race. Also, Sky hardly needed Porte for an 800m climb with the firepower they have.
 
Jelantik

Jelantik

Jul 19, 2010
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You have to applaud wiggins for using public opinion to support to his cause. This below is going to force sky to think hard to not include wiggins.

A senior figure in cycling, who asked to remain anonymous, said: ‘If Brad doesn’t ride it will be a disaster for the sport in this country. Here was a chance to showcase the sport here in England with the last two winners of the Tour, who are both British. But because they don’t get on, the one who’s most popular with the fans is not going to be there. It’s embarrassing.'

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...lusion-opening-stages-race.html#ixzz34BAn6UV6
 
MBotero

MBotero

Jun 4, 2014
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Wiggins is a smart guy knows to play his cards.I hope Sky management we'll reconsider the mater,Wiggo should be in the TDF team,he's no danger for Froome.You don't let a SIR out 2 years in a row.
 
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