Will Contador Be Juiced Up Again Upon His Return

[djpbaltimore]

It’s striking how emphatically he responds when asked if he still believes he has won nine Grand Tours rather than the adjusted figure of seven. “Si, si,” he exclaims. “Without doubt I’ve won nine. Look at the jersey of the Tour 2010 and the Giro 2011,” Contador says, pointing to the framed mementoes on the wall in his Foundation office. “I won both those races in a clean and honest way. Only with work and sacrifice. I put those up as an example.”

alberto contador
“With the system of anti-doping control we now have and the quantity of those tests for the top riders it is impossible to cheat. If you do it’s like a suicide. I’ve no doubt this is why it’s clean at the very highest level.”

Pretty solid evidence that Contador can be as strident and self-righteous about doping as any of the other dopers in the peloton.

http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2015/nov/16/alberto-contador-tour-de-france-olympics-end-interview?CMP=share_btn_tw

 

[LaFlorecita]

Those quotes are hilarious

 

[The Hitch]

Re:

It’s striking how emphatically he responds when asked if he still believes he has won nine Grand Tours rather than the adjusted figure of seven. “Si, si,” he exclaims. “Without doubt I’ve won nine. Look at the jersey of the Tour 2010 and the Giro 2011,” Contador says, pointing to the framed mementoes on the wall in his Foundation office. “I won both those races in a clean and honest way. Only with work and sacrifice. I put those up as an example.”

alberto contador
“With the system of anti-doping control we now have and the quantity of those tests for the top riders it is impossible to cheat. If you do it’s like a suicide. I’ve no doubt this is why it’s clean at the very highest level.”

Pretty solid evidence that Contador can be as strident and self-righteous about doping as any of the other dopers in the peloton.

http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2015/nov/16/alberto-contador-tour-de-france-olympics-end-interview?CMP=share_btn_tw

No. No it isn't.

You see the bit where it says "when asked". That's what determines whether he is being a self righteous ***, or if he's just a doper, who doesn't want to be caught.

No one expects any doper yet alone someone as committed to omerta as contador to when asked about doping say "you got me chief. Guilty".

Of course they are going to deny doping if the are asked about it. That would be the end of their career.

The self righteous part is taking the initiative oneself to go out there and spam the media with a fake anti doping narrative. Contador is not doing that. He's not releasing clearly fabricated stories about super training methods that combat doping, or about Riis ripping out pages from tour guides. He doesn't scapegoat either. Stories about how he knew ricco or Armstrong or vino or diluca were cheating him and he hopes they get life bans.

That's what the self righteous BS is. That's what the hypocrisy is.

 

[djpbaltimore]

Re: Re:

No. No it isn't.

You see the bit where it says "when asked". That's what determines whether he is being a self righteous ***, or if he's just a doper, who doesn't want to be caught.

No one expects any doper yet alone someone as committed to omerta as contador to when asked about doping say "you got me chief. Guilty".

Of course they are going to deny doping if the are asked about it. That would be the end of their career.

The self righteous part is taking the initiative oneself to go out there and spam the media with a fake anti doping narrative. Contador is not doing that. He's not releasing clearly fabricated stories about super training methods that combat doping, or about Riis ripping out pages from tour guides. He doesn't scapegoat either. Stories about how he knew ricco or Armstrong or vino or diluca were cheating him and he hopes they get life bans.

That's what the self righteous BS is. That's what the hypocrisy is.

I don't see how anybody can defend those comments with a straight face. It is Omerta pure and simple and shades of Lance Armstrong with the jerseys and logic. What is Contador on? His bike 6 hours a day!

Definition of Self righteous: Having or characterized by a certainty, especially an unfounded one, that one is totally correct or morally superior. This is exactly what hanging up the 2011 Giro and 2010 Tour to teach a lesson to those at his foundation demonstrates.

No one expects a rider to come clean, but Contador is often suggested by people in the clinic to not be as strident in his answers. But his answer about doping is as over the top as any current rider has given about the current state of the peloton. Comparing doping to suicide? Hyperbole at its worst.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Yes I am sure his amigos who work for his Foundation will be offended by those jerseys hanging on the walls.

What's next, telling dopers they can't have the trophies of race wins that got stripped on display in their homes?

 

[Benotti69]

Bertie owes Rasmussen one of the GT wins if he thinks he can count the ones taken off him for Clenbuterol doping!!!

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re:

Bertie owes Rasmussen one of the GT wins if he thinks he can count the ones taken off him for Clenbuterol doping!!!

Chicken did not finish the race. Berto did, and he stood on the top step of the podium

 

[djpbaltimore]

Re:

Yes I am sure his amigos who work for his Foundation will be offended by those jerseys hanging on the walls.

What's next, telling dopers they can't have the trophies of race wins that got stripped on display in their homes?

No one is telling Contador and others what they should be doing in their own home or office. I am just saying that the action and, especially, the rationale for doing that is incredibly self-righteous. People taking offense or not is beside the point.

 

[The Hitch]

Re: Re:

No. No it isn't.

You see the bit where it says "when asked". That's what determines whether he is being a self righteous ***, or if he's just a doper, who doesn't want to be caught.

No one expects any doper yet alone someone as committed to omerta as contador to when asked about doping say "you got me chief. Guilty".

Of course they are going to deny doping if the are asked about it. That would be the end of their career.

The self righteous part is taking the initiative oneself to go out there and spam the media with a fake anti doping narrative. Contador is not doing that. He's not releasing clearly fabricated stories about super training methods that combat doping, or about Riis ripping out pages from tour guides. He doesn't scapegoat either. Stories about how he knew ricco or Armstrong or vino or diluca were cheating him and he hopes they get life bans.

That's what the self righteous BS is. That's what the hypocrisy is.

I don't see how anybody can defend those comments with a straight face.

I don't see anyone who did. Do you? Perhaps you could show me.

It is Omerta pure and simple and shades of Lance Armstrong with the jerseys and logic. What is Contador on? His bike 6 hours a day!

Yes it is. Contador is omerta as most of us said 5, 6 years ago, and many times since. And btw he has been flaunting his doped wins every gt he's won since his return over 3 years ago.

Definition of Self righteous: Having or characterized by a certainty, especially an unfounded one, that one is totally correct or morally superior. This is exactly what hanging up the 2011 Giro and 2010 Tour to teach a lesson to those at his foundation demonstrates.

Strongly disagree. Don't see how that is "self righteous" from Contador. Like most dopers he subscribes to a law of the jungle mentality when it comes to performance enhancing drugs. He believes he won those races since he was on the top of the podium and did nothing the guys beside him didn't. You may disagree but he is entitled to that opinion.
That's all it is, a difference of opinion. You believe someone caught with clenbuterol should lose the title and be banned for two years. He believes they shouldn't, or at least that whoever wins a race, wins the race.

I've never seen Contador claim to be morally superior on anything. He shies away from the spotlight, limiting himself to the bare minimum of media appearances. When he does talk its all cliche's about racing being hard, wanting to win, liking attacking and general praise for all his opponents even the weak ones, and constant praise for dopers like Lance, Pantain, Riis, Indurain etc.

No one expects a rider to come clean, but Contador is often suggested by people in the clinic to not be as strident in his answers.

And he isn't.

But his answer about doping is as over the top as any current rider has given about the current state of the peloton. Comparing doping to suicide? Hyperbole at its worst.

well the suicide comment is a figure of speech.
But yes his answer is way over the top and obviously a lie.

But what you are trying to say he's as bad as others.
Let's not beat around the bush. Its mostly sky you have in mind and don't like that they get criticised for self righteous hypocrisy when in your eyes Contador does the same.

Contador isn't doing the same though. Even here all he's doing is making a general comment on the state of anti doping and not about himself.
There's no claim to be a great warrior of anti doping.
No ZTP.
No accusations against other riders and teams. No scapegoating of easy targets.
No stories about training.

If you want to look away from Sky then people like Nibali to some extent and JV to a very large extent also behave this way. Or Paula Radcliffe shoving her face into doping discussions calling for longer bans, more tests, Federer doing that a few days ago.

You ever see Contador calling for longer bans on his fellow dopers?
You seen him tweet that testers should visit Tenerife when Froome is there?
You see him holding "EPO cheats, out" sign?
You see him throwing doubt at Sky or Astana or Katusha?
Calling into question transformations?
You see him throw the likes of Ricco to the wolves and say "I knew he was doping when I saw him beat me on Kronplatz"? In fact, Contador still hesitates to call Lance a cheat, even after lance got caught saying stuff like "if these allegations are true, then its bad".
You see him claim that Basso comes to him to learn how to get clean, the way Froome claimed Basso went up to him and Richie to learn about how to ride clean?
You see him commit to scientific tests and then go back on that. Give bs stories about the anti doping culture in his team or the training?

Contador may very well be self righteous on a lot of things. He's no saint and I don't know him personally. But publicly he has never done any of the above and on the issue of doping keeps his head down and certainly doesn't try to make himself into a hero nor others into villains.

 

[Benotti69]

Re: Re:

Bertie owes Rasmussen one of the GT wins if he thinks he can count the ones taken off him for Clenbuterol doping!!!

Chicken did not finish the race. Berto did, and he stood on the top step of the podium

Chicken was not allowed finish the race by the same people that took Berties 2 wins away.

 

[BullsFan22]

Wow. Bertie is starting to sound like Lancey. That's never a good thing.

 

[djpbaltimore]

Re: Re:

(snipped for brevity) Let's not beat around the bush. Its mostly sky you have in mind and don't like that they get criticised for self righteous hypocrisy when in your eyes Contador does the same.

Why do you say that, because I didn't refer to SKY at any point in my three comments. Much of what you write is also beside the point, because you are bringing in the actions of teams and their PR when I was directing my comments solely at the riders themselves. Go back to any SKY/ JV thread where it is on topic and look where I criticize SKY and Garmin for their hypocrisy. That is not really a debatable point. But I also don't think the hypocrisy is worse than the actual act of doping itself. There was a thread about that somewhere in the clinic. My point was that Contador says stuff about doping as bad and cringe-worthy as anybody in the peloton. Does he do it as often or as blatantly? Without doubt, the answer is no. But I never made that claim in the first place. Ranking of dopers from 'best' to 'worst' due to their rhetoric is not something I would waste my time on. They are all equally bad. Notice that I never claimed that Contador was somehow a worse doper than anyone else in the peloton for what he said.

Contador stated that he won those jerseys in a clean and honest way. That is unfounded certainty if I ever heard it and the fact that he credits hard work and sacrifice alone when he knows the real story IS moralizing those victories. Let's call a spade a spade, he won those jerseys in a dishonest way just as cyclists have done for time immemorial. I don't hold much respect for Riis, but giving the jersey back at least shows more self-awareness than anyone that has come after him.

EDIT. As for no stories about training. Didn't Contador talk up his new altitude training for one of the reasons for his rebound?

EDIT2. Yep. http://cyclingtips.com.au/2014/07/de-jongh-explains-factors-in-contadors-improvement-riis-insists-rider-can-win-tour/

EDIT3. The thread I referred to above and my particular response. viewtopic.php?p=1516098#p1516098

 

[LaFlorecita]

Berto trolling the Clinic and all the haters on his twitter

 

[LaFlorecita]

Wow. Bertie is starting to sound like Lancey. That's never a good thing.

Lancey was his idol did you not know?

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re: Re:

Bertie owes Rasmussen one of the GT wins if he thinks he can count the ones taken off him for Clenbuterol doping!!!

Chicken did not finish the race. Berto did, and he stood on the top step of the podium

Chicken was not allowed finish the race by the same people that took Berties 2 wins away.

Was it not Rabo that withdrew Chicken? Was it not CAS that took away Berto's wins?

 

[Benotti69]

Re: Re:

Bertie owes Rasmussen one of the GT wins if he thinks he can count the ones taken off him for Clenbuterol doping!!!

Chicken did not finish the race. Berto did, and he stood on the top step of the podium

Chicken was not allowed finish the race by the same people that took Berties 2 wins away.

Was it not Rabo that withdrew Chicken? Was it not CAS that took away Berto's wins?

Yes and Yes.

But CAS also upheld Chicken's 2 year ban from his TdF withdrawal.

But my feeling stands that Bertie cannot claim 2007 win as Rasmussen was taken off for OOC lying (ie doping) and Bertie lost his for doping with Clen.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Rasmussen didn't even finish the race as the winner while Berto did in 2010 and 2011. Who knows what could have happened in the last few days of the race, maybe Chicken would have crashed or collapsed in the ITT.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Alberto Contador ‏@albertocontador 3 u3 uur geleden
Esfuerzo-Trabajo-Sacrificio-Disciplina-Superacion-Motivacion-Sufrimiento-Gloria-Giro-Tour-Vuelta #QuererEsPoder.

 

[TourOfSardinia]

Wow. Bertie is starting to sound like Lancey. That's never a good thing.

I know. This is how I'd put it.
(can someone translate it into Spanish for him)

Alberto we love you
on the road
you don't need to say this stuff
we saw you on the road
you blessed us with 9 great shows
let's not argue the toss about the official count
you are much bigger than that

 

[happytramp]

Wow. Bertie is starting to sound like Lancey. That's never a good thing.

I know. This is how I'd put it.
(can someone translate it into Spanish for him)

Alberto we love you
on the road
you don't need to say this stuff
we saw you on the road
you blessed us with 9 great shows
let's not argue the toss about the official count
you are much bigger than that

That last bit couldn't sound more like Lance if you tried.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Wow. Bertie is starting to sound like Lancey. That's never a good thing.

I know. This is how I'd put it.
(can someone translate it into Spanish for him)

Alberto we love you
on the road
you don't need to say this stuff
we saw you on the road
you blessed us with 9 great shows
let's not argue the toss about the official count
you are much bigger than that

I like it, very poetic

I can only say, Berto dear Berto, do not listen to these haters on the interwebs, you know what happened in those races, we know it, even the anti-doping trolls know it deep down, you are the best. You do not have to respond to their foolishness, but if you want to troll them, be my guest

 

[happytramp]

how can someone troll facts? He took drugs. Got busted. Lost titles. End of story. Nobody cares anymore except his fanboys. If you think it's okay to win titles whole doping that's fine, that's your opinion and your entitled to it.

 

[The Hitch]

Why do you say that, because I didn't refer to SKY at any point in my three comments.

Because you said this.

No one expects a rider to come clean, but Contador is often suggested by people in the clinic to not be as strident in his answers.

The only time contador is suggested to be not as strident in his answers, is when compared to sky.

Because he doesn't go as far as them in the bs and hypocrisy stakes

If all you are trying to say is that contador is a doper and serial liar, then I'm a bit surprised it's taken you this long to figure that out. Contador has always been full omerta and it's not like people here haven't called him out for it. 3-6 years ago the contador threads were thousands of pages long.

He's served his suspension though and is a conformed doper so most people take it for granted that this is what he is. Not like anyone here (besides Robbie cannuck) thinks contador is innocent or honest.

 

[Beech Mtn]

Contador needs to keep quiet, smile pretty for the cameras, and let the legs do the talking. It's stupid to talk about doping, especially in the off-season, when there are so few stories to grab the public's attention. I know he has to say something when he's asked about it, but damn.

I do not appreciate the vote of confidence for Froome's cleanliness. I also find the use of the word "suicide" to be ill-advised, given that he's talking about the cavernoma in the same interview. It's never good for people to be reminded that you continued to transfuse blood post-cavernoma. Kind of hard to explain that away as anything other than full-blown, hardcore doping. I'd like to keep telling myself that his talent-to-doping level is at a better ratio.

 

[djpbaltimore]

Re:

The only time contador is suggested to be not as strident in his answers, is when compared to sky.

Because he doesn't go as far as them in the bs and hypocrisy stakes

If all you are trying to say is that contador is a doper and serial liar, then I'm a bit surprised it's taken you this long to figure that out. Contador has always been full omerta and it's not like people here haven't called him out for it. 3-6 years ago the contador threads were thousands of pages long.

He's served his suspension though and is a conformed doper so most people take it for granted that this is what he is. Not like anyone here (besides Robbie cannuck) thinks contador is innocent or honest.

Do you have links for every time this has happened in the clinic? This bias suggests that you do not want to argue a point unless you can fall back onto your well-trodden SKY diatribes.

As I addressed earlier, Contador does go as far as everybody else on the BS (clen steaks) and hypocrisy (jerseys) stakes, just not as frequently. His quotes are as bad as anyone in the peloton has made. If you can't put 2 and 2 together.....

I have known what Contador is about since 2007. I think most people realize Contador is a doper, and I didn't make a claim otherwise. But his quotes about the current level of doping in the peloton are well worth discussing, feel free to participate or not.