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redtreviso said:
Private schools around here cost STARTING at twice the voucher value..Meanwhile parents of kids in those schools want tax credits for their full expense..The charter schools to take these voucher students do not exist. Once you destroy public schools then any charter schools can just go out of business and where will we (not you I guess) be?
Hey scott.. Wouldn't it be cool if colleges only accepted white/christian/republican/lexus delivered kids from private schools???

Lot's of evidence out there to demonstrate who benefits most from vouchers. Inner city youth (black kids).

You give yourself away by accusing me of what you yourself do. Accuse me of wanting to destroy public education yet the policies you advocate have basically done that very thing. Accuse me of racism yet the policies you advocate hurt minorities, particularly black kids, the most.

I'm not really sure why I point this out to you because you are either a bigoted A-Hole or you are too stupid to understand the end results of the nanny state you seem to need.

Either way, you bore the shit outta me.
 
May 23, 2010
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Scott SoCal said:
Lot's of evidence out there to demonstrate who benefits most from vouchers. Inner city youth (black kids).

You give yourself away by accusing me of what you yourself do. Accuse me of wanting to destroy public education yet the policies you advocate have basically done that very thing. Accuse me of racism yet the policies you advocate hurt minorities, particularly black kids, the most.

I'm not really sure why I point this out to you because you are either a bigoted A-Hole or you are too stupid to understand the end results of the nanny state you seem to need.

Either way, you bore the shit outta me.
Your kind has been trying to destroy public schools since the 60s..congrats you've done it well..Inner city schools have been the last in line thanks to your kind in elected office.. Your kind redistrict the schools to manufacture the worst possible environment then poodles like you complain about p-poor education system as a whole.
 
May 23, 2010
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Glenn_Wilson said:
:eek:great.

Sounds like some racist crap from both sides.
There's no way 8th grade hispanic students said that sh..
It is just a modification of the hannity forum fable after Obama was elected.
"this is a black world now" students said before putting a beat down on some republican kid.. Happened in 10 different places across the country always with the same words..Heard it from a friend of a friend of a friend's kid's brother's sister... Fat chance..
 
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Scott SoCal said:
HJ, we can't do anything. That's the point. 2 to 5 years to terminate a bad teacher.

How long could your shop survive if you couldn't shed bad help?

I think competition is the answer. You don't. I think things must change. You don't.

It's as if there is nothing we can do to fix the apparatus because it's the apparatus and we need to support it.:confused:
There is the fallacy of your argument. Republicans have traditionally relied on the exception rather than the rule to make a point. You want to withdraw support of the public school system based on maybe 1-3% of the teaching population? Because that is what you are arguing. The great majority of teachers are doing a great job. Their most pressing problem is that parents with attitudes like yours force idiotic constraints on them in the classroom.

True story: I was discussing prejudice with my class. (I was a history teacher, and we were talking about the civil rights movement) I gave the definition, which is to judge prior to knowing a person. One student became upset with the discussion. This student was an African American female who on many occasions had made racist remarks in regards to Hispanics. She just wouldn't hear that her beliefs were prejudiced. She became so upset that she called me a "stupid fagg0t" to wit I replied "you ignorant little punk." I got a letter of reprimand in my file. Noting happened to her. The funniest part is that the letter ONLY contained the fact that I said she was "ignorant." I chose that word specifically because what she said was ignorant (an absence of knowledge) and not stupid, however she was offended because she thought I was calling her stupid. The school was scared of her mother because she had threatened to sue the school before.

Now, the reason that teachers get reprimanded over stupid things like that is because of a general negative opinion of teachers and the job they do. Teachers are portrayed as ineffective, lazy people out to single kids out and fail them. Your attitude and one sided denouncement of the profession and system only further along the diminishing power a teacher actually has in the classroom.

Keep beating on teachers. Your party is having a field day because there are droves of ignorant people out there with a grudge to pick with some teacher they had in high school who was "out to get them." Their ignorance and pettiness is fertile ground for your party's message. They don't really care too much about fixing schools; they have a bone to pick, and now is as good a time as any.

Keep spreading the disease.
 
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Anonymous

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Scott SoCal said:
Lot's of evidence out there to demonstrate who benefits most from vouchers. Inner city youth (black kids).
Really, cite it. I promise to offer counters to anything you produce. The fact is that vouchers take out the kids whose parents give a sh!t. All the other kids are left in the rotting corpse of a system left in the wake of your "voucher" idea. Yea, maybe they deserve to rot away there until we can get them on a felony and house them in prisons for the rest of their lives. Serves them right being born into poverty and ignorance. Fu*k 'em!
 
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Thoughtforfood said:
Really, cite it. I promise to offer counters to anything you produce. The fact is that vouchers take out the kids whose parents give a sh!t. All the other kids are left in the rotting corpse of a system left in the wake of your "voucher" idea. Yea, maybe they deserve to rot away there until we can get them on a felony and house them in prisons for the rest of their lives. Serves them right being born into poverty and ignorance. Fu*k 'em!
I already did and I'm not in the mood to do it again.

Yep. Just force all the kids into a system that makes them all suffer. Fvk 'em indeed.
 
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Anonymous

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Thoughtforfood said:
There is the fallacy of your argument. Republicans have traditionally relied on the exception rather than the rule to make a point. You want to withdraw support of the public school system based on maybe 1-3% of the teaching population? Because that is what you are arguing. The great majority of teachers are doing a great job. Their most pressing problem is that parents with attitudes like yours force idiotic constraints on them in the classroom.

True story: I was discussing prejudice with my class. (I was a history teacher, and we were talking about the civil rights movement) I gave the definition, which is to judge prior to knowing a person. One student became upset with the discussion. This student was an African American female who on many occasions had made racist remarks in regards to Hispanics. She just wouldn't hear that her beliefs were prejudiced. She became so upset that she called me a "stupid fagg0t" to wit I replied "you ignorant little punk." I got a letter of reprimand in my file. Noting happened to her. The funniest part is that the letter ONLY contained the fact that I said she was "ignorant." I chose that word specifically because what she said was ignorant (an absence of knowledge) and not stupid, however she was offended because she thought I was calling her stupid. The school was scared of her mother because she had threatened to sue the school before.

Now, the reason that teachers get reprimanded over stupid things like that is because of a general negative opinion of teachers and the job they do. Teachers are portrayed as ineffective, lazy people out to single kids out and fail them. Your attitude and one sided denouncement of the profession and system only further along the diminishing power a teacher actually has in the classroom.

Keep beating on teachers. Your party is having a field day because there are droves of ignorant people out there with a grudge to pick with some teacher they had in high school who was "out to get them." Their ignorance and pettiness is fertile ground for your party's message. They don't really care too much about fixing schools; they have a bone to pick, and now is as good a time as any.

Keep spreading the disease.
You want to withdraw support of the public school system based on maybe 1-3% of the teaching population?
No, I think all schools should compete for public dollars.

The great majority of teachers are doing a great job.
I agree completely and yet you are ragging on me because I take exception to a system that bends over to protect the bad ones.

Their most pressing problem is that parents with attitudes like yours force idiotic constraints on them in the classroom.
Parents with attitudes like mine forcing idiotic restraints??? You mean like demanding kids being able to read at grade level??? WTF?

Your attitude and one sided denouncement of the profession and system only further along the diminishing power a teacher actually has in the classroom.
You are wrong on half of this. I'm not banging on teachers. I'm banging on a system. The teachers and the system are not the same. And BTW, with the possible exception of Rhubroma, please cite where I've denounced the teaching profession.

Keep beating on teachers.
Everybody needs a boogey man. I'm (reluctantly) your huckleberry.
 
Jul 9, 2009
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redtreviso said:
There's no way 8th grade hispanic students said that sh..
It is just a modification of the hannity forum fable after Obama was elected.
"this is a black world now" students said before putting a beat down on some republican kid.. Happened in 10 different places across the country always with the same words..Heard it from a friend of a friend of a friend's kid's brother's sister... Fat chance..
I live in socal, that is exactly the attitude of a large % of the hispanic population in the southwest. We stole it from them, and now they are gonna take it back.
An 8th grader would certainly be exposed to this from any number of uncles or cousins even if his parents never said it.
 
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Scott SoCal said:
I already did and I'm not in the mood to do it again.

Yep. Just force all the kids into a system that makes them all suffer. Fvk 'em indeed.
That is a fallacy. They aren't all suffering. They are suffering as presented by one sided Republicans who are ignoring the fact that most kids are being educated well. It is suffering in inner city schools that are "equally funded" which is a lie, and it is suffering in inner city schools that can have alternatives like the ones in Harlem that DO NOT REQUIRE private capital. None. I have no problem with Charter schools or Magnet schools, but vouchers are bullsh!t. It is an option offered by white people who feel guilty that they segregate their children in private schools, and wax poetic about having "diversity," only when the "diversity" comes, they will find reasons to flee that school too.
 
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Thoughtforfood said:
That is a fallacy. They aren't all suffering. They are suffering as presented by one sided Republicans who are ignoring the fact that most kids are being educated well. It is suffering in inner city schools that are "equally funded" which is a lie, and it is suffering in inner city schools that can have alternatives like the ones in Harlem that DO NOT REQUIRE private capital. None. I have no problem with Charter schools or Magnet schools, but vouchers are bullsh!t. It is an option offered by white people who feel guilty that they segregate their children in private schools, and wax poetic about having "diversity," only when the "diversity" comes, they will find reasons to flee that school too.
Sorry, I should have been more clear. I was speaking of inner city schools where vouchers, charter and magnet schools seem to be improving the outcomes.
 
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Hugh Januss said:
I live in socal, that is exactly the attitude of a large % of the hispanic population in the southwest. We stole it from them, and now they are gonna take it back.
An 8th grader would certainly be exposed to this from any number of uncles or cousins even if his parents never said it.
You just crossed swords with redtreviso. Lord only knows what names you'll be called now.
 
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rhubroma said:
How do you close the gap between poor inner city kids and rich suburbanites in a private system?

And how do we educate educators to be worthy, in a capitalist culture?
Most teachers union propaganda will tell you there is no difference or that public schools are actually better than private.

I don't know how to engage parents who don't care but I just can't see the harm in providing parents a choice if their current school (public or private) is underperforming. The only way to close the gap is bring the bottom up to the top. Unfortunately, the trend seems to be bringing the top down to the bottom.

Your second question is too subjective for me. I am not confident our definitions of 'worthy' would be very close.
 
Jul 9, 2009
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Scott SoCal said:
You just crossed swords with redtreviso. Lord only knows what names you'll be called now.
I don't care, it's true. It is also however true that "we" did steal it from "them", but I like it here and am not in the mood to give it back. If assimilation isn't working then I am not sure what the answer is.
 
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Hugh Januss said:
I don't care, it's true. It is also however true that "we" did steal it from "them", but I like it here and am not in the mood to give it back. If assimilation isn't working then I am not sure what the answer is.

"Them" were originally native Indians. So, unless these kids can trace their origin to the Chumash or Tongva Indians, they are really just talking out of their back-sides.
 
Jul 9, 2009
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Scott SoCal said:
"Them" were originally native Indians. So, unless these kids can trace their origin to the Chumash or Tongva Indians, they are really just talking out of their back-sides.
No the Indians are the ones the Spanish (Mexicans) stole it from. I don't see any Mexican Casinos operating in the state.
 
Jul 4, 2009
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Hugh Januss said:
No the Indians are the ones the Spanish (Mexicans) stole it from. I don't see any Mexican Casinos operating in the state.
So to get this straight the Mexicans stole it from the indians and the US bought it from them at a reduced price of $18,250,000 (about half a billion in todays dollars) after some aggressive negotiations which was call the Mexican American war.

So it is Texas's fault :D
 
Mar 17, 2009
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L29205 said:
So to get this straight the Mexicans stole it from the indians and the US bought it from them at a reduced price of $18,250,000 (about half a billion in todays dollars) after some aggressive negotiations which was call the Mexican American war.

So it is Texas's fault :D
hell yeah it's texas fault:D
 
Jul 9, 2009
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L29205 said:
So to get this straight the Mexicans stole it from the indians and the US bought it from them at a reduced price of $18,250,000 (about half a billion in todays dollars) after some aggressive negotiations which was call the Mexican American war.

So it is Texas's fault :D
It is always Texas' fault.:cool:
 
Dec 7, 2010
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Hugh Januss said:
It is always Texas' fault.:cool:
Well I guess all you guys are correct. It was originaly part of the Mexican Territories... that would be Cali...AZ....New Mex.... and West Tex... But in the End the WHITE man stole that **** and rolled them Spanish in Mexico...HALLS of MONTEZUMA! aka Battle of Chapultepec somewheres around 1847.....

It is only natural that THEY would want it back...but guess what......I AINTS in no mood to give it back... call me back after I have had a few more ABITA Restoration PALE ALES and you might get a different answer. ;)
 
May 23, 2010
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Hugh Januss said:
No the Indians are the ones the Spanish (Mexicans) stole it from. I don't see any Mexican Casinos operating in the state.
Many of the "mexicans" you see are not spanish at all..Here in Texas many of the Gomezes, Valdez, Gutierez's were here several hundred years before any anglos showed up..

but on point.. That school teacher just sexed up his bigot story saying that 8th graders told him they were here to take back their land..
 
Dec 7, 2010
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redtreviso said:
Many of the "mexicans" you see are not spanish at all..Here in Texas many of the Gomezes, Valdez, Gutierez's were here several hundred years before any anglos showed up..

but on point.. That school teacher just sexed up his bigot story saying that 8th graders told him they were here to take back their land..
Serious? I would have never guessed?
 
Jul 9, 2009
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redtreviso said:
Many of the "mexicans" you see are not spanish at all..Here in Texas many of the Gomezes, Valdez, Gutierez's were here several hundred years before any anglos showed up..

but on point.. That school teacher just sexed up his bigot story saying that 8th graders told him they were here to take back their land..
I am sure that the average Mexican can trace his lineage back to the Conquistadors just as directly as the average American can to the Pilgrims, but the point is I have seen Los Angeles politicians quoted as making the exact same statement and heard it from individuals to my face.
The teacher could have made it up, that is true, but he just as easily could have heard it from some smarta** kid. More to the point the rest of his narative could easily be true, which puts the lie to Scott's contention that everything is the teacher's or the school system's fault.
 
May 23, 2010
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Hugh Januss said:
I am sure that the average Mexican can trace his lineage back to the Conquistadors just as directly as the average American can to the Pilgrims, but the point is I have seen Los Angeles politicians quoted as making the exact same statement and heard it from individuals to my face.
The teacher could have made it up, that is true, but he just as easily could have heard it from some smarta** kid. More to the point the rest of his narative could easily be true, which puts the lie to Scott's contention that everything is the teacher's or the school system's fault.
I'm not hispanic or mexican but I would have told that teacher something like that..Kind of like people talking about the french being rude, but then you find out they are rude to someone like Tom DeLay who asked them if they speak German and when they say no he says your welcome.. etc.. But an open letter to his senator submitted as an LTTE ...pfffft... I bet that guy is not even a teacher... Probably just a freeper or a stormfronter or hannity forum d-bag.--- a scotty
 
May 23, 2010
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Glenn_Wilson said:
Serious? I would have never guessed?
You mean you would have never guessed someone named Gomez lived in Victoria 100 and something years before Daaaaavy Crockett and Sam Houston were born?
 
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