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Jun 8, 2011
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auscyclefan94 said:
All the feminists got behind her which makes me vomit because I hate the concept of feminism.

Strewth, a sexist Australian. Who'd have thought such things exist?

Awe look luv, get us another tinnie since your up cleaning. My **** is stuck to the couch and there's another 3 hours till the finish of this stage....

Nearly as insightful as your analysis that if a Spaniard is not working he must be out begging.

Priceless.
 
Captain_Cavman said:
Has this changed over time? I'm not a great student of US politics but the turn over of Senators seems to be similar to what it's been for the last 30 years.

Here in the UK too, the two main parties are following identical policies. The closer they become, the more hysterical is the screaming about the differences. In the end otherwise intelligent people are reduced to saying things like, "I don't trust them because they're Tories, Labour, or whatever."

My own theory is that politicians haven't any wriggle room in the current economic climate as we watch how 30+ years of exponential debt expansion in a debt based fiat money system unfolds.

But that's probably just me.


That's because in the post revolutionary, post-World War, Post-Cold War era, under the general affluence and easy access to a so called material well-being; the Western democracies have witnessed their political dialogues entirely formed around the preponderance that economic liberalism and the markets have held over the civilization. At least in regards to how that civilization has been conceived since the industrial revolution, as one in which a concept of "progress" is exclusively wrapped-up in and synonymous with economic growth. Thus everything is predicated upon the folly of eternal market growth, no matter what that may actually mean or cause down the line, because it has become their religion.

In short its all about the economy, the economy and nothing but the economy. This basically means that the entire political process has in our culture come to be pretty much centered upon the free-market system, on both sides of the ideological fence, for which any differences in worldview become decidedly marginal, or merely apparent, structural and used purely as a platform to try and win votes. In such a tight, centrist political construct, the only way to be successful politically is to raise ones voice in ire over the petty little initiatives and rebuttals shouted from the other platform's pulpit, however unsubstantial the differences may have been from what you were just announcing, while being egged on and abetted by the corporate lobbyists. Thus the insight you provided in your last comments was spot-on.

While this may be pathetic and sad, such is how money, greed and corruption have reduced our democracy into a lugubrious and thoroughly tasteless spectacle. That's the truth. If anything Obama's presidency is a sobering exposition of this fact that despels all illusions, as well as a harsh reality check. And it aint gonna get better before it gets much worse, I've thought.

In addition, this has, among the mainstream two-party centrist factions, obviously drawn them nearer and nearer together and essentially means having a regime with only one worldview: which is the economically liberal and conservative one. Especially because the politicians don't count and are in reality just the minions of a behind the scenes financial apparatus, which nobody votes for, but that entirely runs the show. This also means you no longer count and neither do I.

It has also gridlocked the system, which is why any effort toward effecting real and badly needed change form the left, is merely rhetorical and ultimately hopeless. Any chance at curtailing the voracious appetite of the financial apparatus, even when this means foisting gargantuan debt that was privately accumulated upon the public's shoulders, is impossible; as was evident when government bailed out Wall Street and the banks and then gave the bill to the tax payers. At the same time, though not at all surprisingly, government can't seem to scrap up the sums to finance even a minimum welfare that's becoming of any civilized and enlightened democratic society: public healthcare, schools and pensions. Because the real bosses fought a ruthless ideological war and won resoundingly.

The resounding victory that liberal capitalism had over socialism has meant that any sane and principled form of responsible economic planning and welfare went straight out the door. The establishment only prevaricates when it assures the masses that it is acting with any intent to push reforms through the legislation, or at least any useful reforms. Since the fall of the Berlin Wall nothing, in the way of an alternative, has of course been promoted, let alone is capable of resisting, or even calling into question, the most destructive tendencies of market fundamentalism. This while the world's population has been growing exponentially over the past 150 years, and while nature's resources have been depleted with equal multiplication during the same period. This means the societies of the world, unless a major cultural and political change occurs, will be condemned to always more brutal forms of competition and this will consequently restrict the access to good jobs and wealth to an ever restricted minority, not just in the West but globally.

Thus on the left we only get infirm and deceptive imposters, while on the right only the most fanatical and confident (always a most dangerous combination) of ideologues. This is why I don't subscribe to the thinking that left and right are basically two sides of the same coin, what the Italians call qualunquismo, or that anyone in the political spectrum can be exchanged for any other, right or left it doesn't matter, since its all identical. For we are missing an entire category and do not merely have two parties behaving similarly if not identically in the final analysis.

Thus this would be true only if we did not live under the centrist regime. Left and right are not the same. It's only that in the centrist democracies of today, which are chiefly governed by the overbearing powers of economic liberalism and globalization, the former has quite simply merged into the latter's domain, has virtually become a non-entity in the way the socially progressive left used to be perceived. While the right has become ever more arrogant and extreme.

Though this may appear to have been an unquestionable good that is without reproach in getting us over the Cold War and making us decidedly richer (in the material, but I doubt very much in the spiritual sense), the future health of the planet and therefore human civilization at large may very well be ultimately faced with far more dire prospects and consequences as a result.

This is why we need more bold and visionary thinkers and planners, and not the string commanded puppets we have among the actual political classes towing the line, which seems to be a ship recklessly bent on a collision course nobody appears to have noticed nor even cares about. Though because of just how ingrained the corruption, greed and lack of any moral principle has become within our political establishment, makes any hope for change in the absence of a real and dramatic tragedy, not very likely, at least not soon. While there is a considerable public that frankly seems clueless about what's actually going on, or simply doesn't give a damn about and has either given up out of sheer forfeit, or else cynically sees as an opportunity to pursue their own base and selfish ends.
 
May 23, 2010
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Wow!!! what a thinker!!!! What a surprise!! Tax cuts for corporations and the super wealthy..Maybe they should have free gas too. Since they do so much for society.

""According to our new analysis, the economic plan offered yesterday by GOP presidential candidate Mitt Romney would deliver a massive $6.6 trillion tax cut that would primarily benefit the very wealthy and corporations. After accounting for the added interest costs that we’ll have to pay, the total cost of Romney’s plan grows to $7.8 trillion over the next 10 years.""
 
Nov 30, 2010
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rhubroma said:
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This is why we need more bold and visionary thinkers and planners, and not the string commanded puppets we have among the actual political classes towing the line, which seems to be a ship recklessly bent on a collision course nobody appears to have noticed nor even cares about. Though because of just how ingrained the corruption, greed and lack of any moral principle has become within our political establishment, makes any hope for change in the absence of a real and dramatic tragedy, not very likely, at least not soon. While there is a considerable public that frankly seems clueless about what's actually going on, or simply doesn't give a damn about and has either given up out of sheer forfeit, or else cynically sees as an opportunity to pursue their own base and selfish ends.

It's too late for bold and visionary thinkers and planners right now. The ship is losing power and the tide is remorselessly dragging her towards the rocks. While below decks the band plays to a mesmerised public.

People of vision, or at least historical perspective, will come in handy for rebuilding from the wreckage though.
 
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redtreviso said:
Wow!!! what a thinker!!!! What a surprise!! Tax cuts for corporations and the super wealthy..Maybe they should have free gas too. Since they do so much for society.

""According to our new analysis, the economic plan offered yesterday by GOP presidential candidate Mitt Romney would deliver a massive $6.6 trillion tax cut that would primarily benefit the very wealthy and corporations. After accounting for the added interest costs that we’ll have to pay, the total cost of Romney’s plan grows to $7.8 trillion over the next 10 years.""

Are we supposed to take seriously new analysis from ThinkProgress? Surely you can do better than this.

There is plenty of potential problems with Romney's proposal. Do your own analysis and let us know what problems you find.
 
May 23, 2010
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Scott SoCal said:
Are we supposed to take seriously new analysis from ThinkProgress? Surely you can do better than this.

There is plenty of potential problems with Romney's proposal. Do your own analysis and let us know what problems you find.

I guess some Koch brothers pom pom girls would be your masters on the subject?? Face it Scott.. Romney might come out with a proposal that tax cuts for hedge fund managers are the nation's top priority.. He probably doesn't listen to anyone with a lower station than hedge fund manager anyway. The unwashed needn't try to differentiate themselves from each other..
 
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redtreviso said:
I guess some Koch brothers pom pom girls would be your masters on the subject?? Face it Scott.. Romney might come out with a proposal that tax cuts for hedge fund managers are the nation's top priority.. He probably doesn't listen to anyone with a lower station than hedge fund manager anyway. The unwashed needn't try to differentiate themselves from each other..

Here is the plan;

http://www.mittromney.com/sites/default/files/BelieveInAmerica%E2%80%93MittRomney%E2%80%93PlanForJobsAndEconomicGrowth.pdf

Here is the first problem I see...

The American Competitiveness Act
• Reduces the corporate income tax rate to 25 percent


25% is still not competitive with the rest of developed nations. We want to attract business to the US, not force more US business to Switzerland.

Have a read, maybe you'll find something you will agree with.
 
May 23, 2010
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Scott SoCal said:
Here is the plan;

http://www.mittromney.com/sites/default/files/BelieveInAmerica%E2%80%93MittRomney%E2%80%93PlanForJobsAndEconomicGrowth.pdf

Here is the first problem I see...

The American Competitiveness Act
• Reduces the corporate income tax rate to 25 percent


25% is still not competitive with the rest of developed nations. We want to attract business to the US, not force more US business to Switzerland.

Have a read, maybe you'll find something you will agree with.

25% of what? What do you suppose the REAL tax rate is for American corporations? Counting their offshoring of profit centers and onshoring of real overhead (and its writeoffs).. If Dominos and Subway want to move to Switzerland it is fine by me.. Where do you draw the line as to who should complain about global competitiveness? We already have free trade zones to make sure foreign slave labor is available. Would 5 dollar a week labor zones be you next Fretarded idea?
 
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redtreviso said:
25% of what? What do you suppose the REAL tax rate is for American corporations? Counting their offshoring of profit centers and onshoring of real overhead (and its writeoffs).. If Dominos and Subway want to move to Switzerland it is fine by me.. Where do you draw the line as to who should complain about global competitiveness? We already have free trade zones to make sure foreign slave labor is available. Would 5 dollar a week labor zones be you next Fretarded idea?

It depends on many factors. Multi-national's are much different than here at home. S-Corps are much different than C-Corps.

I'll probably go ahead and listen to the evil CEO's on rates. There's a reason Switzerland is the most competitive nation in the World at the moment. Wanna take a wild guess why?

Did you read the plan yet or are you gonna let others tell you what to think of it?
 
May 23, 2010
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"We don't pay taxes. Only the little people pay taxes..."

f


This is what it all comes down to...People like you scott don't think they should pay taxes.. There should be a threshold right at your income level that exempts everyone above including you.. Reminds me of the scene in Field of Dreams where James Earl Jones is about to step over the baseline off the field and he is told "You've done enough" This is how you see yourself and those higher up the economic food chain..It is just the "little people" who need the roads and bridges and water supplies...Why should the NOT LITTLE PEOPLE have to contribute anything since they can just buy it outright for their exclusive use?
 
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redtreviso said:
"We don't pay taxes. Only the little people pay taxes..."

f


This is what it all comes down to...People like you scott don't think they should pay taxes.. There should be a threshold right at your income level that exempts everyone above including you.. Reminds me of the scene in Field of Dreams where James Earl Jones is about to step over the baseline off the field and he is told "You've done enough" This is how you see yourself and those higher up the economic food chain..It is just the "little people" who need the roads and bridges and water supplies...Why should the NOT LITTLE PEOPLE have to contribute anything since they can just buy it outright for their exclusive use?

So does this mean you're not gonna read the plan?

I'm sure ThinkProgress will tell you everything you need to know.
 
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Scott SoCal said:
Here is the plan;

http://www.mittromney.com/sites/default/files/BelieveInAmerica%E2%80%93MittRomney%E2%80%93PlanForJobsAndEconomicGrowth.pdf

Here is the first problem I see...

The American Competitiveness Act
• Reduces the corporate income tax rate to 25 percent


25% is still not competitive with the rest of developed nations. We want to attract business to the US, not force more US business to Switzerland.

Have a read, maybe you'll find something you will agree with.

That is complete bull****. The effective corporate tax rate is nowhere near that and you know it.
 
May 18, 2009
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I would like to announce my candidacy for the president of the US.

I propose to just make the corporate tax rate zero, along with those making over 250k, or let's make the corporate rate zero and give them money. We could do away with say national parks and the FDA and give the savings from those programs to corporations. We could fire the FAA controllers, firefighters.

I mean WTF if you don't have an extinguisher in your house you don't deserve to live and plus you are taking away my freedom to burn or not. These colors don't run! Get govt off our backs!

Besides that God should take care of you. Just think how bad the Texas fires and drought would be right now if Governor Perry hadn't instructed us to pray for rain a few months back. Of course, it hasnt rained but I am sure our praying altered the rate of evaporation or something so it is all good. I am grateful to Governor Perry for saving us.....he will be my secretary of defense after I bust that junky wind tunnel tested hairy azz in the primaries. You hear he has some sympathy for those illegals taking our jobs? WTF?

Anyway we could give all of the national park land to the oil companies and they could drill on that land for free, and do away with any job killing fines or retrobution programs whenever they spill something. We should let industry polute the air with no economy wrecking fines so as to promote job growth. No more pesky fishing or hunting limits places upon real Americans by the traitorous tree-huggers. Beside there is good fishing around oil rigs.

I think we should champion a weekend warrior program where thankful Americans making less than 250k come and work for these companies for free on weekends, thus making them more income and fostering demand for their products. Then, with all of the increased tax intake as a result of all of these zero taxes we could increase the defense funding at some steady rate that we can all agree on, because my ingenious plan will surely bring out the jealous evildoers, commies, minorities, feminazis, homos, and just plain old stealth liberals that hate us for our freedoms. We real Americans must stand up and unite, and take our country back! Bomb their soil, take their oil! Smoke em out!

I figure if this plan would be put in place unemployement would be zero within a year, and we would all be making over 250k/yr and businesses will not be taxed, which in turn should ensure infinite tax intake by the govt!

And, oh yeah. I would outlaw abortion and abduction of hot white chicks, unless there are abductions when I am under scrutiny by the liberal media.

Who is with me?
 
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Anonymous

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Mitt Romney just kicked everyone's a$$ in the debate. It wasn't even close.

Perry is a bumbling idiot.
 
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Thoughtforfood said:
That is complete bull****. The effective corporate tax rate is nowhere near that and you know it.


Depends. Are we talking strictly C-Corps? If so, 'splain why so many US multi-nationals are now HQ'd in Switzerland or Ireland. Just to spite the USA?

IMO, I don't think so.
 
May 23, 2010
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Scott SoCal said:
Depends. Are we talking strictly C-Corps? If so, 'splain why so many US multi-nationals are now HQ'd in Switzerland or Ireland. Just to spite the USA?

IMO, I don't think so.

name one,.,. or three... and the legal jeopardy pending on them
 
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redtreviso said:
Republican Bragging.............................................

broken.jpg

Since when does MoveOn.org have five year olds doing graphics for them?

Moveon.:rolleyes: Okey Dokey.

You've now disqualified yourself from ragging on Fox News ever again.
 
May 23, 2010
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Scott SoCal said:
Since when does MoveOn.org have five year olds doing graphics for them?

Moveon.:rolleyes: Okey Dokey.

You've now disqualified yourself from ragging on Fox News ever again.

LOL you looked at the source... what a maroon
 
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redtreviso said:
name one,.,. or three... and the legal jeopardy pending on them

Ok, that made me smile.:)

I'm confident Barry O has marginalized himself so badly that John Chambers doesn't even take his calls anymore.

You read Romney's plan yet? Or are you still waiting for MoveOn to tell you what you should think about it? Do you need me to re-post the link? You know I will....
 
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Scott SoCal said:
Depends. Are we talking strictly C-Corps? If so, 'splain why so many US multi-nationals are now HQ'd in Switzerland or Ireland. Just to spite the USA?

IMO, I don't think so.

http://www.good.is/post/how-american-corporations-pay-no-taxes-in-2010/

http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2011/04/corporate-tax-rates-then-and-now/

http://www.businessinsider.com/companies-pay-lowest-tax-loopholes-2011-2

The rate is high, the loopholes are plentiful, and large corporations wrote in those loopholes. It is a high wind/little substance argument.
 
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Thoughtforfood said:

Goddammit TFF, you are ****ing me off because you are way better than this:D

Why did GE pay no Corporate tax last year?

And while it's true 2/3rd's of American corporations paid no corporate tax last year do you know why this is?

Don't let me down here:)
 
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