Worst descender. Wiggins vs Schlecks

[Roude Leiw]

You never saw Zulle descend in the rain? That was comedy gold, almost every time.

To be fair, Alex wore glasses, which in rain seriously reduces visibility on the bike.

 

[More Strides than Rides]

To be fair, being more timid and circumspect after a crash or being hurt isn't cowardice, it's common sense. Nibali is a fearless descender, and that works for him, but Wiggins isn't. That hardly makes him alone. Fränk Schleck was always a bad descender, but got worse after his swallowdive in the Tour de Suisse. Valverde is usually a very, very good descender, but returning from crashing out of the Tour in spectacular fashion, he promptly lost the Vuelta on a descent. Evans is a good descender, but David Arroyo made him look like an utter fool on his way down the Mortirolo in 2010.

Basso descended like post-crash Wiggins today - only Basso would descend like that in clear, dry conditions on non-technical descents.

This is the right answer.

 

[BYOP88]

Wtf just because he crached he is bad descender?
Wiggins is up there with best in descending

Mrs Wiggins is this you?

 

[Bala Verde]

To be fair, Alex wore glasses, which in rain seriously reduces visibility on the bike.

I think those glasses, at times, fogged up...

 

[ElChingon]

In Order (best to worst):

1. Frank Schleck, sure he flew off that Swiss road but he got back on the bike.
2. Brad Wiggins, took himself out of le Tour back in 2011, that's a major fail and in public in front of the camera's, embarrassing and recorded for re-viewing N times.
3. Andy Schleck, he ruined last year due to his tail bone incident and has yet to fully recover, most time taken out of racing due to that. Frank will make it back from his ban with about as much racing as Andy during that time. Has also created major comedy in the forums.

 

[Dazed and Confused]

To be fair, being more timid and circumspect after a crash or being hurt isn't cowardice, it's common sense. Nibali is a fearless descender, and that works for him, but Wiggins isn't. That hardly makes him alone. Fränk Schleck was always a bad descender, but got worse after his swallowdive in the Tour de Suisse. Valverde is usually a very, very good descender, but returning from crashing out of the Tour in spectacular fashion, he promptly lost the Vuelta on a descent. Evans is a good descender, but David Arroyo made him look like an utter fool on his way down the Mortirolo in 2010.

Basso descended like post-crash Wiggins today - only Basso would descend like that in clear, dry conditions on non-technical descents.

the issue for me still comes back to leadership. Basso is not a leader, never has been, just put in a position etc. Now watching Wiggins in adversity tells me he ain't much of a leader either.

Neutral on Nibali for now.

 

[Random Direction]

Ok everyone, to do a fit comparison, we don't need waving of arms or words, but videos:

Descending links for our prime contenders please:
(1) Sir Wiggalot: http://www.steephill.tv/players/720...talia&id=wiggins-falls-giro-153344958&yr=2013
(2) Froome Froome: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7DCe4QVO0PE
(3) Schleckette: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubEfM5npOvo
(4) The Elder: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mbyc0gFvsEI
(5) He of the Misted Glasses Zulle
(6) Ivan the Terrible
(7) (and for comparisons): Cojones Nibali: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xPXIdGy1iM0 and Cancellara: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RxXqQqAc2pA

 

[shinoda13]

I think some of you exaggerate about Andy being a bad descender. I recall stage 15 in 2010 Tour when he went all out on the descent from Port de Bales. On the descent he even took time from the group ahead of him which included Contador and Sanchez. He is a normal descender who like many others don't like to risk his health when the road is wet and slippery.

 

[airstream]

I think some of you exaggerate about Andy being a bad descender. I recall stage 15 in 2010 Tour when he went all out on the descent from Port de Bales. On the descent he even took time from the group ahead of him which included Contador and Sanchez. He is a normal descender who like many others don't like to risk his health when the road is wet and slippery.

who cares if the thread was open to bash intentionally? A few people are interested in truth here. Abnormal forum in terms of malevolence.

 

[BroDeal]

the issue for me still comes back to leadership. Basso is not a leader, never has been, just put in a position etc. Now watching Wiggins in adversity tells me he ain't much of a leader either.

David Millar already said Wiggins was not a leader.

Wiggins could not lead people on a small island to water.

 

[movingtarget]

David Millar already said Wiggins was not a leader.

Wiggins could not lead people on a small island to water.

The same thing has been said for a long time about Evans. Did not stop either of them winning the Tour.

 

[manafana]

wiggins and andy arnt bad descenders for their size.

A guy whos got 5kg on them and cant drop them in the descent is the shame.

 

[Hugo Koblet]

You never saw Zulle descend in the rain? That was comedy gold, almost every time.

Last time I saw someone riding like this was when Hoogerland went in the fence. He had a good reason back then, what is Brad's? Just chicken?

The three of them are on par for today.

To be fair, maybe he totally had a block, is possible. Then we should not be joking about it. But it was absolutely strange to see.

Zülle wore glasses which severely hindered his performance in rainy conditions. It was pretty common to attack him when it rained because he simply couldn't see anything. It was particularly evident when he was descending.

 

[Franklin]

Ok everyone, to do a fit comparison, we don't need waving of arms or words, but videos:

Descending links for our prime contenders please:
(1) Sir Wiggalot: http://www.steephill.tv/players/720...talia&id=wiggins-falls-giro-153344958&yr=2013
(2) Froome Froome: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7DCe4QVO0PE
(3) Schleckette: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubEfM5npOvo
(4) The Elder: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mbyc0gFvsEI
(5) He of the Misted Glasses Zulle
(6) Ivan the Terrible
(7) (and for comparisons): Cojones Nibali: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xPXIdGy1iM0 and Cancellara: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RxXqQqAc2pA

1) I'm not 100% convinced that was bad skill. It was pouring. If it's that wet a tiny pebble can make the difference between grip and aquaplaning. We need to see more evidence.
2) Not a descent and the guy with the papers should not stand there. I do say that froome takes an odd angle for that corner, which makes the misstake by the clerk a tad understandable. On a different note, the Chicken there made my heart cringe. Michael has great bike handling skills, but he was completely cooked.
3) Heh
4) Well, wrong line, so there's a measure of skill. The corner was not easy to estimate, so Schleck simply went too fast.
5) ^) No evidence yet ^^
7) -Nibbles here is simply mad. It rains and he takes big risks. Cojones indeed.
-Cancellara, not that impressive. Dry, well known col, no other riders near. He's a superbe descender for sure, but if you want legendary skills I nominate Il Falco!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lfYwImKw6R8

The reaction of the public on the sidewalk is fantastic.

But really, Bad descending skills should be visible in dry/almost dry conditions. A spill in pouring rain can be bad luck. Consecutive evidence of spills in rain would be helpful

Also, I would expect guys like Wiggins who are good in short TT's to be okay descenders. Unless he's simply scared I can't imagine him being bad at this discipline (but I never paid much attention to his descending skills). Most TT guys are good bike handlers, with the obvious exceptions. Froome does come to mind, but perhaps I'm unfair here.

 

[Franklin]

wiggins and andy arnt bad descenders for their size.

A guy whos got 5kg on them and cant drop them in the descent is the shame.

That depends on the descent. Sure, in a Tourmalet like Autobahn descend the big strong guys have an advantage, but winding steep descents even the odds considerably.

Weight helps, but there's much more to it. There has been a long history of good descenders who were thin and light. Winnen, Hampsten, Pantani, Virenque (he was really good), Garzelli, etc. etc.

 

[del1962]

That depends on the descent. Sure, in a Galibier like Autobahn decend the big strong guys have an advantage, but winding steep descents even the odds considerably.

Weight helps, but there's much more to it. There has been a long history of good descenders who were thin and light. Winnen, Hampsten, Pantani, Virenque (he was really good), Garzelli, etc. etc.

Do you think being taller makes you less likely to be a good descender?

 

[Franklin]

Do you think being taller makes you less likely to be a good descender?

Nope, I think it has to do with vision, nerves, reflexes... in other words, it's complicated. I'm sure I can find tall good descenders. For example Il Falco wasnt small. Fabian, Thor, fantastic descenders. And LLS did some good stuff last year as well. So nope, being tall doesn't seem to be a big disadvantage either.

On a side note, WTF is wrong with my recollections. First I said Galibier, which is 1. the wrong mountainrange and 2. not easy. I did a speed edit into the Aubisque, but I was sure that was wrong as well. Of course I meant the fastest one, the Tourmalet

But yes, on the Tourmalet a big guy should usually beat the snot out of a light guy

 

[BroDeal]

Weight helps, but there's much more to it. There has been a long history of good descenders who were thin and light. Winnen, Hampsten, Pantani, Virenque (he was really good), Garzelli, etc. etc.

Yup. Check out Cunego (chased by Sagan) in the 2011 Tour of Switzerland on a narrow road with variable wetness and surface conditions. It should be on Youtube.

 

[shades1]

problem is with schleck is that he is descending alone a lot of the time when he goes off on one of his mega attacks and really could do with some team around him , the galibier stage he won he managed to hook up with montfort which was a massive bearing on that stage win .

wiggins will always have skyborg around him most of the time so is far more protected .

it takes a lot of balls to be a great descender and there are very few . a huge percentage of the peleton are no better than anyone else so its a little unfair to call them both bad .

 

[burning]

snipped

-Cancellara, not that impressive. Dry, well known col, no other riders near. He's a superbe descender for sure, but if you want legendary skills I nominate Il Falco!

His descent at MSR 2012 was definitely better, Nibali was killing himself to hold his wheel

 

[the asian]

Ok, Dame Wiggins is now officially a worse descender than Baby Schleck.
a few more descents like that in the Giro and he will overtake Lady Frank as the worst descender.

 

[airstream]

Ok, Dame Wiggins is now officially a worse descender than Baby Schleck.
a few more descents like that in the Giro and he will overtake Lady Frank as the worst descender.

Hatred tends to kill people from the inside, even when they try to cover it with humor.

 

[movingtarget]

Hatred tends to kill people from the inside, even when they try to cover it with humor.

This site must be wall to wall with zombies then. Funny how some think Nibali has already won the Giro with two weeks to go and no serious ascents attempted yet .

 

[Dazed and Confused]

May have to revise my views on the subject.
Sir Wiggo is inching closer to Schleck level as the Giro moves forward.

 

[airstream]

This site must be wall to wall with zombies then. Funny how some think Nibali has already won the Giro with two weeks to go and no serious ascents attempted yet .

Many people are too emotional in their preferences. If they dislike Sky or Schleck, that's forever, and they inspiringly create millions of polls to vote against them and always imply ''. People you described are way more happy that Wiggins won't win the Giro (as they hope) than the fact that Nibali will win it.