Giro d'Italia Worst Giro d'Italia edition in the 21st century?

[Escarabajo]

Now that it's over, this one was the worst. A movie in which nothing happened until the final fifteen minutes. The design was bad but it shouldn't get all the blame, some of it must go to the teams and riders; you can't make people attack if they don't want to. Pogacar would have set this thing on fire. I can't even write that with Remco gone, they fought not to lose: at Lago Laceno and on the Gran Sasso, he was there...

I will point at the positives, at least for me:

- I like the finish in Rome: all roads lead to Rome after all - you can't make that up
- It's Il Giro d'Italia, and the national champion won a stage
- It's Il Giro d'Italia, and an Italian won a sprint stage - and the points jersey
- I'm now a fan of Ben Healy and Derek Gee - they're not afraid to try and try again
- In his last Giro, Thibaut Pinot wasn't a spectator, he fought and finished super strong

I'll give it an 8. But it sucked...

You made my day!!!

 

[Cookster15]

I agree 2023 was the worst but with a less backended route ending with that MTT there is no way the teams would have raced this Giro so conservatively. This year was just a slightly more extreme (worse) version of 2022 (special mention to 2012).

In 2023 the top three riders and their teams were not confident that a high risk attack would not backfire in that MTT. We also saw on stage 20 that the top three riders that day were also the strongest in GC contention.

In 2022, Hindley, Carapaz and Landa all tested each other in the final week but each discovered that they did not have enough advantage to make any attack stick - with the Fedaia looming. So Bora schemed a great ambush - even if we had to wait until 3km from the summit.

Alberto Contador is a rare exception but even he had physiological talent which made his wins possible. It’s not simply courage. We can’t expect riders like Contador or even Nibali to be the norm.

So I just hope the organisers put more emphasis on the first two weeks of the Giro. Teams and riders will not be able to race conservatively.

 

[The fridge in the blue trees]

Mostly the course.

Checked, I gave it a 5, which still seems correct. Not sure if I wrote something, not going to reread the whole thread.... But if I did probably something similar to this: The mountain stages all are nice enough, that's why it's not a 4. But the way they were put together, positioned, problematic. And of course each mountain stage itself has problems too. Gran Sasso 4 km, not much going to happen. but that's actually still ok at this point in the race. Crans Montana the placement already bad, plus Crans itself is not that hard a climb, so while in the third week action on the Croix de Coeur could happen, as first real mountain test it was not going to have much racing there. All Crans Montana. Bondone, lots of climbs, but logic to wait for the final climb really. Regardless of the GC situation. Zoldo good, nothing to complain about the stage itself, but the placement? Queen stage, 3 Cime the next day? More often than not, not too much is going to happen. So everybody waits for Tre Cime, but a) Monte Lussari! Not going to go on 50 km raids with that looming. b) Tre Cime with its steepness logically makes riders wait for that. Instead of having the Giau as decisive climb. Then the Monte Lussari, which is ok, don't need somethign like that too often, rather have a Mortirolo ITT, then a super-mega-ultra steep one really. Still hard enough.

Then of course the wind on Gran Sasso and Crans didn't help at all. Having no TT rider ahead before Crans neither. Having to cut the Gran San Bernardo neither. Having 3 guys close together forCrans, Bondone, Zoldo, Tre Cime... of couse you wait. Ok, even I expected a bit more on the Giau, didn't expect it to be ridden that slowly.

I give it a 4, but since it's the Giro... still liked it. (So doing the opposite of Tonton...)

Little of that is the riders fault, having Remco out, who would have presumably forced others to be more offensive, having Tao out, who looked very strong and would have given Ineos a real second option is not the riders fault. It just happens. With such a tight GC after the TT, and he top guys being matched pretty evenly, riding the way they did was the logical way. Nobody in his right mind would have attacked early on the Bondone stage with this situation. Nobody in his right mind would have tried anything on the Giau with Tre Cime and the ITT coming up. Ok, they could have ridden it faster though, especially Jumbo since that really looked like a good stage for Roglic to get a stage. But finally the "win" there wasn't that clear, Thomas had dropped him for a short while.

Positive, the escapes were interesting, the first week actually designed well, it's after that the problems with the course started. The young Israel riders, not only Gee, also Frigo, Berwick and Riccitello a big plus. Healy too. De Marchi who keeps trying to get that stage. Zana very positive too, after Masnada basically is disappearing, Zana showed that Italy still could have a GC rider in the coming years. Pinot still there, very nice. Negative of course Pozzovivo out, down to 3,5 for this Giro.

Bad course, a bit of bad luck with wind and covid and crashes then made it even less spectacular than Vegni probably hoped, but he wasn't going for a wild spectacle before Zoldo with this design anyway, The Giro started in Crans, the decisive phase on Zoldo, the highlight the Tre Cime and Lussari climbs.

 

[Pleney]

This Giro made me realize that a riders value and their paycheck doesn't match up.
To some extent, old Horner and Armstrong provided more entainment this giro than the actual race did😶
Milan, Gee, Healy and Pinot were the entertainers - Roglic managed to be more boring than Thomas👍 JVs only move was a mechanical experiment that backfired because they half-arsed said move 🤣

 

[SafeBet]

I see the wind has been mentioned a few times but let me get this straight: it was an excuse.

My podcast partner was on both Gran Sasso and Crans Montana and the wind wasn't significant.

 

[stefank]

Anybody venturing an opinion in this thread who hasn't seen all editions of the Giro is a fraud.

 

[staubsauger]

The problem with the 3 Merlons stage was the atrocious start of the stage which made it almost impossible for a pure climber like Rubio to even get into the breakaway. Apart from Buitrago who somehow made it and consequently had a walk in the park to win.

That even canceled the fight for the mountains jersey on the big Dolomites stage.

Put Duran before Valparola and a whole other race gets going!

 

[hrotha]

Anybody venturing an opinion in this thread who hasn't seen all editions of the Giro is a fraud.

I didn't watch a single stage of this Giro and I'm still rating it a 2

 

[Red Rick]

I see the wind has been mentioned a few times but let me get this straight: it was an excuse.

My podcast partner was on both Gran Sasso and Crans Montana and the wind wasn't significant.

Could believe that for Crans Montana, but for Gran Sasso the climbing times are just too terrible for me to believe there was no headwind. Pretty sure the break did lower W/kg than I expect from Cavendish in the MTT when he knows he has 50% on the time limit.

 

[Max Rockatansky]

+ Cunego & Saeco out maneuvering Popovych
+ Simoni's long-range attack with Honchar & De Nardi chasing all day.
+ Popovych gaining pink in the TT
+ Fred Rodriguez beating Petacchi in a sprint!

Yeah. And Petacchi still won !!!NINE!!! stages. Robbie McEwen and Fred Rodriguez took the other two sprints. That eleven sprint stages out of 21. In a Giro.

And Fabian Wegmann won the climbers jersey.

First two mountain arrivals were unipuerto climbs to Corno alle Scale and Montevergine di Mercogliano.

The deciding mountain stages had 153k, 118k (Tonale, Gavia, Bormio 2000) and 122k (Mortirolo, Vivione, Presolana).

And still this was an entertaining race because of the things mentioned above. That special duell between Cunego & Simoni + them facing to time trial monsters Popo & Honchar. That was great stuff.

But when I imagine this route being presented today and people commenting here on it. Would have been a massacre out of this world. Worst ever.


I am quite ambiguous about the birthday edition from 2009. This edition also ended in Rome. However, it did not lead there with a transfer, but took the way via the stages. It gave us the best time trial since St.Etienne 1997 and a memorable seven hour stage over Nerone & Catria to Monte Petrano.

The race was accompanied by rider protests over a stage in Milan and over a bad weather descent from Passo del Maloggia. It was also the first race to take place on social media thanks to Lance Armstrong. That raised awareness, but also had quite a level of whining about the evil Italian roads and Zomegnan not bowing down to King Lance. Or that you have to be able to do more in a time trial than just ride straight ahead.

Many fans hated this edition because it basically ignored the Dolomites and also included only one stage through the Western Alps.

Like this year, this Giro was accompanied by a lot of incompetence in the organization. Actually, one planned an arrival at the top of the blockhouse. This had to be shortened. Likewise, the stage from Cunego to Pinerolo had to be changed. This then led to the fact that the Cima Coppi of this Giro was in Sestriere.

 

[staubsauger]

The 2009 Giro d'Italia IMHO is the prime example for the phrase "The riders are making the race". Menchov versus Di Luca was a nice duel. Pellizotti won at Blockhaus, smashing Armstrong from his wheel and actually beat Sastre for the 3rd place despite the Spaniards 2 nice stage wins.

 

[SafeBet]

Could believe that for Crans Montana, but for Gran Sasso the climbing times are just too terrible for me to believe there was no headwind. Pretty sure the break did lower W/kg than I expect from Cavendish in the MTT when he knows he has 50% on the time limit.

There was no wind in the final 4 km, which is the only portion of the climb where any attack would be worth.

 

[perico]

Backloading weeks can be a deterrent, yes.
Like I have already discussed in other threads and several cycling commentators and webpages noticed, the backloading and the MTT were designed to counterbalance Remco's likely dominance in the previous two weeks given the amount of TTs. The fact that he left because of covid-19 speaks more about designing a route having only rider's features in mind.

I have always been against designing routes to attract certain riders. The race is bigger than the rider.

 

[wickedw]

Backloading weeks can be a deterrent, yes.
Like I have already discussed in other threads and several cycling commentators and webpages noticed, the backloading and the MTT were designed to counterbalance Remco's likely dominance in the previous two weeks given the amount of TTs. The fact that he left because of covid-19 speaks more about designing a route having only rider's features in mind.

I'm not so convinced that this route was designed with Remco in mind, though naturally the amount of TT kms are a bonus for him. In reality the TT's, specifically the first 2 are made for Ganna, you know that top italian TTer. The same guy who has won every TT in the giros he participated in, until this one. If it wasn't for Remco these TT's could potentially have put Ganna in pink for almost 2 weeks after all.. Sounds something an Italian organizer might be interested in. I could be wrong.

The last climbing TT, on the border with Slovenia, looks more like an invitation to Pog rather than Remco. Instead they got the second best Slovenian rider, and he won it there.

This Giro, like many others before it, just had an awful route. It's not something specific to this last one, they do it regularly. They want spectacle in the last week and they rarely get it. And let's face facts: if they did get it then the director would likely have missed it.

 

[Valv.Piti]

Yeah. And Petacchi still won !!!NINE!!! stages. Robbie McEwen and Fred Rodriguez took the other two sprints. That eleven sprint stages out of 21. In a Giro.

And Fabian Wegmann won the climbers jersey.

First two mountain arrivals were unipuerto climbs to Corno alle Scale and Montevergine di Mercogliano.

The deciding mountain stages had 153k, 118k (Tonale, Gavia, Bormio 2000) and 122k (Mortirolo, Vivione, Presolana).

And still this was an entertaining race because of the things mentioned above. That special duell between Cunego & Simoni + them facing to time trial monsters Popo & Honchar. That was great stuff.

But when I imagine this route being presented today and people commenting here on it. Would have been a massacre out of this world. Worst ever.


I am quite ambiguous about the birthday edition from 2009. This edition also ended in Rome. However, it did not lead there with a transfer, but took the way via the stages. It gave us the best time trial since St.Etienne 1997 and a memorable seven hour stage over Nerone & Catria to Monte Petrano.

The race was accompanied by rider protests over a stage in Milan and over a bad weather descent from Passo del Maloggia. It was also the first race to take place on social media thanks to Lance Armstrong. That raised awareness, but also had quite a level of whining about the evil Italian roads and Zomegnan not bowing down to King Lance. Or that you have to be able to do more in a time trial than just ride straight ahead.

Many fans hated this edition because it basically ignored the Dolomites and also included only one stage through the Western Alps.

Like this year, this Giro was accompanied by a lot of incompetence in the organization. Actually, one planned an arrival at the top of the blockhouse. This had to be shortened. Likewise, the stage from Cunego to Pinerolo had to be changed. This then led to the fact that the Cima Coppi of this Giro was in Sestriere.

Great post. I don't remember all that stuff, but it indeed was quite a strange race and a very strange route tbh.

 

[Red Rick]

There was no wind in the final 4 km, which is the only portion of the climb where any attack would be worth.

Power estimates were for the final 4 km. Bais did like 4.8 W/kg for 14 minutes by estimates.

 

[jaylew]

Is this in lieu of the usual "rate the (enter GT)" thread?

 

[Tonton]

Is this in lieu of the usual "rate the (enter GT)" thread?

It goes to show how bad it was...didn't get a thread...

 

[topcat]

I don’t wanna talk
Bout this thing we’ve been through
Though it’s hurting me
The giro’s history
Building them a road
Ok, they built the wrong one
Nothing more to say
Rain got in the way
The wheelsuckers take it all
The viewers are appalled
Primoz Roglic the victory
That’s his legacy

 

[RedheadDane]

Are you sure there aren't just a little bit of "recency (anti) bias" in the poll? Most people voting this year's edition, coz it's the one most people remember.

 

[Armchair Cyclist]

I don’t wanna talk
Bout this thing we’ve been through
Though it’s hurting me
The giro’s history
Building them a road
Ok, they built the wrong one
Nothing more to say
Rain got in the way
The wheelsuckers take it all
The viewers are appalled
Primoz Roglic the victory
That’s his legacy

I suspect that if I knew which song this is parodying I would have given a like on the post. But I am old enough to have liked Wyndbrook's post in the stage 21 thread, so I will just look on it in bemusement.

 

[topcat]

I suspect that if I knew which song this is parodying I would have given a like on the post. But I am old enough to have liked Wyndbrook's post in the stage 21 thread, so I will just look on it in bemusement.

The winner takes it all- Abba
Disco’s back. When did it ever leave?

 

[Armchair Cyclist]

Admission: I haven't read all the thread.

I suspect there is an element to which the organisers will feel that drama and therefore publicity were served on Saturday, and that backloading has been, in their terms, rewarded. Apart from this community of freakish obsessives (self included), Satruday will have seemed like a pinnacle of last minute resolution, and therefore this Giro (if only those few minutes of it) might stick in the memory for longer. I never hear anyone talk much about the first 20 stages of the 1989 Tour de France.

But what (leaving aside that Roglic was less fit then than on Saturday: not something the organisers could have known in advance)if they key MTT had been earlier in the week? Would we not have simply had a Jumbo train keeping Thomas and Almeida (not the most attacking of riders, and each with reason to be quite content with a podium) under control, and confident that Roglic couold boost his time advantage with ountain sprints if necessary? Would it really have made for a more exciting race?

 

[Armchair Cyclist]

The winner takes it all- Abba
Disco’s back. When did it ever leave?

I'm old enough to know that one: should have recognised it.
OK, like issued.

 

[Netserk]

Are you sure there aren't just a little bit of "recency (anti) bias" in the poll? Most people voting this year's edition, coz it's the one most people remember.

No. And last year is still fresh, so it's easy to compare the two.