104TH LIÈGE-BASTOGNE-LIÈGE 1.UWT April 22nd, 2018

[Akuryo]

Re: Re:

Some random observations:

- Nieves first race back and gets 42th. What a class rider, great for Orica and for the Giro where they will turn up with a top-notch team. They could be the team to animate the race if Chaves feels well.
- Also related to the Giro, Poels is looking pretty weak. I doubt he will be great at least the 2 first weeks, but Froome also really only needs him from stage 14 (Zonc) and onwards. I think its a good sign tho, especially because Rosa and Cruz are very up and down climbers.
- Formolo is ready to make his big breakthrough in the Giro this year.
- Quick Step is by far the best team in the world in 2018, even after the departure of Kittel and Martin among others. Great team which is really easy to root for, most of their riders are pretty likeable (who doesn't like Jungels for example?). Thats without Gav. Jungels could surprise in the Tour, but look out for Enric Mas in the Vuelta as well. With Gaviria, Alaphilippe and Jungels in the Tour they could be quite interesting to follow there as well - all could get a breakthrough!
- Betancur needs to get this **** together for the Giro.....
- Sky is having a downright horrible spring, but good to see Henao being somewhat respectable again.

enric mas is riding the giro, so watch out then already

Source for that? If its PCS, I wouldnt be so sure. They also have De Plus on the list for Giro and he does not have a single race day in 2018 so far...

 

[skippo12]

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To the one that posted Jack Haig still worked with 400m to go - That half a km on Cote de Ans were only time Jack Haig worked at the front!

He also chased down some attacks in chase group to make the chase kept on dying.... instead of pulling or attacking themselves.
Usually mitchelton is pretty solid regarding tactics. Today they messed up. Actually pre race Haig said that his task was to make sure Kreuziger didnt have to do a thing until the last 2km, which is allready stupid since Kreuziger needs to attack before the final 2km.

Kreuziger rode invisible which is a shame for an attacker like him.

Yep, pretty embarrassing finale by Sunweb, Mitchelton and Bahrain. All had riders spare and contributed nothing while Jungels extended his lead. However bad your legs are, you simply have to try to bring back the attacker at that stage if you have two riders in a reduced group.

Seems like the tactics for most teams in the Ardennes this year was just ride against Valverde!

Not really...during Fleche Wallone Lotto and for whatever reason Bora did most of the work chasing Schachmann, Nibali and Haig. Movistar was cooked and only had Landa left but other teams chased the break and Valverde lost the uphill sprint against Ala.
Last Sunday it was more about racing against Sagan than against Valverde...Valverde couldn`t drop Sagan uphill and never did any work to chase Kreuziger and Valgren.
Today Movistar was horrible and Valverde had a bad day himself. Quickstep had the numbers and played their cards perfectly.
Do you guys think that Pozzo should have chased Jungels on the flat? If you are the big favorite you have some responsibility...Valverde for whatever reason wasn`t able to deliver today.

 

[Eyeballs Out]

The one team that maybe had the rouleur to put Jungels within reach on St Nicolas (and the obvious benefit if they could) was Lotto but, well, it's a question of whether you can persuade Wellens to sacrifice for Vanendert

 

[Valv.Piti]

Wait, Haig is actually also riding the Giro. Orica really is guns blazing, Nieve is doing great already and Haig has taken a step up. Lets see if their captains has what it takes!

 

[Koronin]

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Wait, Haig is actually also riding the Giro. Orica really is guns blazing, Nieve is doing great already and Haig has taken a step up. Lets see if their captains has what it takes!

Now can their captains actually take advantage of how well their teammates are riding? If they can will be a lot of fun to watch at the Giro.

 

[jaylew]

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most of their riders are pretty likeable (who doesn't like Jungels for example?).

Jungles seems to me the kind of rider that doesn't engender strong emotions one way or the other.

 

[GuyIncognito]

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most of their riders are pretty likeable (who doesn't like Jungels for example?).

Jungles seems to me the kind of rider that doesn't engender strong emotions one way or the other.

Boring is exactly what you'd expect from someone named Bob.

 

[MatParker117]

Re: Re:

To the one that posted Jack Haig still worked with 400m to go - That half a km on Cote de Ans were only time Jack Haig worked at the front!

He also chased down some attacks in chase group to make the chase kept on dying.... instead of pulling or attacking themselves.
Usually mitchelton is pretty solid regarding tactics. Today they messed up. Actually pre race Haig said that his task was to make sure Kreuziger didnt have to do a thing until the last 2km, which is allready stupid since Kreuziger needs to attack before the final 2km.

Kreuziger rode invisible which is a shame for an attacker like him.

Yep, pretty embarrassing finale by Sunweb, Mitchelton and Bahrain. All had riders spare and contributed nothing while Jungels extended his lead. However bad your legs are, you simply have to try to bring back the attacker at that stage if you have two riders in a reduced group.

Seems like the tactics for most teams in the Ardennes this year was just ride against Valverde!

Not really...during Fleche Wallone Lotto and for whatever reason Bora did most of the work chasing Schachmann, Nibali and Haig. Movistar was cooked and only had Landa left but other teams chased the break and Valverde lost the uphill sprint against Ala.
Last Sunday it was more about racing against Sagan than against Valverde...Valverde couldn`t drop Sagan uphill and never did any work to chase Kreuziger and Valgren.
Today Movistar was horrible and Valverde had a bad day himself. Quickstep had the numbers and played their cards perfectly.
Do you guys think that Pozzo should have chased Jungels on the flat? If you are the big favorite you have some responsibility...Valverde for whatever reason wasn`t able to deliver today.

Sagan's in play for this next year as well, flat finish in the centre of Liege apparently.

 

[Leinster]

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The one team that maybe had the rouleur to put Jungels within reach on St Nicolas (and the obvious benefit if they could) was Lotto but, well, it's a question of whether you can persuade Wellens to sacrifice for Vanendert

But Wellens did sacrifice for Vanendert, and Vanendert did launch, and he didn't have the engine to close on Jungels.

Maybe if Sunweb had been working for Dumoulin, instead of having Dumoulin work for the chance of Matthews or Oomen surviving to the finish, he could have done something.

 

[Breh]

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Nice ride by Jungels. Quick Step has been terrific, their best spring ever according to Lefevere.

Whats the story with Zakarin, Barguil & Majka ..have they become invisible

They usually are aren't they, at least until the grand tours start.

Kamaz?!

He's got a pretty decent one-week race palmarès including GC top 10s in San Luís, País Vasco, Pologne, Algarve, Paris-Nice (twice), Catalunya and Romandie, and a win at the latter as well. Isn't he targeting the Tour this year? After doing Giro-Vuelta last year presumably he's not supposed to be in such strong early season form as the last two years, or perhaps he's just not having a good year.

Yes, he's going to tackle Tour+Vuelta this year and has stated his spring form will be somewhat subpar.

 

[Eyeballs Out]

Re: Re:

The one team that maybe had the rouleur to put Jungels within reach on St Nicolas (and the obvious benefit if they could) was Lotto but, well, it's a question of whether you can persuade Wellens to sacrifice for Vanendert

But Wellens did sacrifice for Vanendert, and Vanendert did launch, and he didn't have the engine to close on Jungels.

Maybe if Sunweb had been working for Dumoulin, instead of having Dumoulin work for the chance of Matthews or Oomen surviving to the finish, he could have done something.

In the 14 km between Jungels getting clear and St Nicolas it was stop-start attacking for the first half of it and that was a big reason why Jungels got as much time as he did. Wellens attacked and chased down attacks but that contributed nothing towards chasing Jungels. He also rode hard on the front for about 100m of St Nicolas but it was too late by then. What it required was a good engine to get on the front and ride a consistent tempo in the valley. Then there would likely be no attacks. Eventually Vilella did this but he was doing very well just to be in that group let alone have much left and Jungels was 40 seconds clear by then. 50 seconds clear by St Nicolas and uncatchable. Had he been 20 seconds clear then Vanendert might have been able to bridge alone

Had Matthews made that group then Dumoulin would have driven between the climbs but fortunately for Jungels, Matthews didn't have it (perhaps not surprisingly given his interrupted season)

 

[armchairclimber]

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I'm willing to delete my account if Michael Matthews doesn't win it (if it comes down to a sprint). I'm 100% sure that they can't beat him. He was 4th after having worked (for a change) for Barguil.

There is no way on earth that Bala/Ala can outsprint him this year. The final is simply not hard enough.

Don't go though.

 

[Flamin]

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The one team that maybe had the rouleur to put Jungels within reach on St Nicolas (and the obvious benefit if they could) was Lotto but, well, it's a question of whether you can persuade Wellens to sacrifice for Vanendert

But Wellens did sacrifice for Vanendert, and Vanendert did launch, and he didn't have the engine to close on Jungels.

Maybe if Sunweb had been working for Dumoulin, instead of having Dumoulin work for the chance of Matthews or Oomen surviving to the finish, he could have done something.

In the 14 km between Jungels getting clear and St Nicolas it was stop-start attacking for the first half of it and that was a big reason why Jungels got as much time as he did. Wellens attacked and chased down attacks but that contributed nothing towards chasing Jungels. He also rode hard on the front for about 100m of St Nicolas but it was too late by then. What it required was a good engine to get on the front and ride a consistent tempo in the valley. Then there would likely be no attacks. Eventually Vilella did this but he was doing very well just to be in that group let alone have much left and Jungels was 40 seconds clear by then. 50 seconds clear by St Nicolas and uncatchable. Had he been 20 seconds clear then Vanendert might have been able to bridge alone

Had Matthews made that group then Dumoulin would have driven between the climbs but fortunately for Jungels, Matthews didn't have it (perhaps not surprisingly given his interrupted season)

Indeed. It probably wasn't his task since Lotto went into the race with 3 leaders (or 2, with Tiesj a step below), but what Wellens did was by no means a fully committed job as a domestique. Though unless Vanendert is a good friend, I wouldn't do it either in his place if I wasn't told to. I mean, Vanendert is a pretty mediocre rider apart from that one week, and he did nothing at all for Wellens in Amstel.

 

[Blanco]

Re: Re:

The one team that maybe had the rouleur to put Jungels within reach on St Nicolas (and the obvious benefit if they could) was Lotto but, well, it's a question of whether you can persuade Wellens to sacrifice for Vanendert

But Wellens did sacrifice for Vanendert, and Vanendert did launch, and he didn't have the engine to close on Jungels.

Maybe if Sunweb had been working for Dumoulin, instead of having Dumoulin work for the chance of Matthews or Oomen surviving to the finish, he could have done something.

In the 14 km between Jungels getting clear and St Nicolas it was stop-start attacking for the first half of it and that was a big reason why Jungels got as much time as he did. Wellens attacked and chased down attacks but that contributed nothing towards chasing Jungels. He also rode hard on the front for about 100m of St Nicolas but it was too late by then. What it required was a good engine to get on the front and ride a consistent tempo in the valley. Then there would likely be no attacks. Eventually Vilella did this but he was doing very well just to be in that group let alone have much left and Jungels was 40 seconds clear by then. 50 seconds clear by St Nicolas and uncatchable. Had he been 20 seconds clear then Vanendert might have been able to bridge alone

Had Matthews made that group then Dumoulin would have driven between the climbs but fortunately for Jungels, Matthews didn't have it (perhaps not surprisingly given his interrupted season)

They didn;t need Dumoulin, there were two Lotto's, two Astana's, two Mitchelton and two Bahrain riders. If only two of them were willing to work Jungels would've been catched. But as I said earlier everyone in the Ardennes are afraid of Valverde, and in this particular case of Alaphilippe too.

 

[Blanco]

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I'm willing to delete my account if Michael Matthews doesn't win it (if it comes down to a sprint). I'm 100% sure that they can't beat him. He was 4th after having worked (for a change) for Barguil.

There is no way on earth that Bala/Ala can outsprint him this year. The final is simply not hard enough.

Don't go though.

Yeah, he had his mouth full of Thomas and Dumoulin also... Not a sign of him after the race, though...

 

[RedheadDane]

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I'm willing to delete my account if Michael Matthews doesn't win it (if it comes down to a sprint). I'm 100% sure that they can't beat him. He was 4th after having worked (for a change) for Barguil.

There is no way on earth that Bala/Ala can outsprint him this year. The final is simply not hard enough.

Don't go though.

Yeah, he had his mouth full of Thomas and Dumoulin also... Not a sign of him after the race, though...

To be fair, it was if it comes down to a sprint, which I wouldn't say it did.

 

[gregrowlerson]

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Jungels, I love you.

Me too

 

[armchairclimber]

Re: Re:

I'm willing to delete my account if Michael Matthews doesn't win it (if it comes down to a sprint). I'm 100% sure that they can't beat him. He was 4th after having worked (for a change) for Barguil.

There is no way on earth that Bala/Ala can outsprint him this year. The final is simply not hard enough.

Don't go though.

Yeah, he had his mouth full of Thomas and Dumoulin also... Not a sign of him after the race, though...

To be fair, it was if it comes down to a sprint, which I wouldn't say it did.

This is true, though he wouldn't have been in a position to contend for the sprint, even for 4th place, whereas Ala and Bala were.

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

Still, a lot of people come down hard on people who expected Matthews. It really isn't that far fetched, he was 4th last year in LBL. This year he looked set for a good result after 5th in FW, a course that suits him less than this.
It wasn't far fetched that he was a really good candidate for LBL. But on the day he just didn't have the right legs. No need to come storm in here "SEE, MATTHEWS IS NO FAVORITE", like some do..

 

[El Pistolero]

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Still, a lot of people come down hard on people who expected Matthews. It really isn't that far fetched, he was 4th last year in LBL. This year he looked set for a good result after 5th in FW, a course that suits him less than this.
It wasn't far fetched that he was a really good candidate for LBL. But on the day he just didn't have the right legs. No need to come storm in here "SEE, MATTHEWS IS NO FAVORITE", like some do..

Last year was ridden too softly.

 

[Leinster]

Re: Re:

Still, a lot of people come down hard on people who expected Matthews. It really isn't that far fetched, he was 4th last year in LBL. This year he looked set for a good result after 5th in FW, a course that suits him less than this.
It wasn't far fetched that he was a really good candidate for LBL. But on the day he just didn't have the right legs. No need to come storm in here "SEE, MATTHEWS IS NO FAVORITE", like some do..

Last year was ridden too softly.

Which is why Matthews was 4th.

And all expectations were that this year would be ridden similarly. So no reason to not think Matthews would be in the finale.

And right up to 20km to go, it looked like it would go that way, until Jungels attacked and everything went into surge-stop chase mode.

 

[Frankschleck]

Re: Re:

I'm willing to delete my account if Michael Matthews doesn't win it (if it comes down to a sprint). I'm 100% sure that they can't beat him. He was 4th after having worked (for a change) for Barguil.

There is no way on earth that Bala/Ala can outsprint him this year. The final is simply not hard enough.

Don't go though.

Yeah, he had his mouth full of Thomas and Dumoulin also... Not a sign of him after the race, though...

To be fair he was right with nibali not having a chance.

 

[Zoetemelk-fan]

Just seen the "show". Glad that my Fast-Forward button on my VHS-recorder is still working :lol:

Apart from that: Congrats to Bob Jungels. Deserved victory to the one who took the initiative.

So maybe he was just a paranthesis in the QuickStep plan, but he proved to be too strong.