2015 Tour de France Start List

[Anderis]

Re: Re:

I said HIGH mountains, not 3 hills

I think you underestimate this stage. Apart from Kadri from breakaway, only true climbers were in top20 that stage. No Gerranses, Kwiatkowskis, Gallopins etc.

 

[Miburo]

Re: Re:

I said HIGH mountains, not 3 hills

I think you underestimate this stage. Apart from Kadri from breakaway, only true climbers were in top20 that stage. No Gerranses, Kwiatkowskis, Gallopins etc.

Irrelevant, i said high mountains. Your example didn't provide that.

 

[Anderis]

Re: Re:

Irrelevant, i said high mountains. Your example didn't provide that.

Ok, you have a point if you want to see things this way.

 

[HelloDolly]

Re: Re:

I said HIGH mountains, not 3 hills

I think you underestimate this stage. Apart from Kadri from breakaway, only true climbers were in top20 that stage. No Gerranses, Kwiatkowskis, Gallopins etc.

Irrelevant, i said high mountains. Your example didn't provide that.

Roche came 12th in the 2012 Tour and was in the top 15 in nearly all high mountain stages.
same with 2010 Vuelta,2012 Vuelta and 2013 Vuelta and 2010 Tour (his second Tour). (He was injured in 2011) ...so to say he cannot come in top 20 in high mountains is not strictly true. He didn't perform well at TCS but that has alot to do with where he was rather than how 'useless he is' as people on this forum are so quick to snigger (same with Ivan Basso who has been over trained to within a inch of his life)

I see though you are determined to think he is no good so I guess there is no point in the debate

 

[TMP402]

Re: Re:

In the high mountains he'll never be up there with froome when there's 20 guys left which is the point you were making.

He was up there with less than 20 guys left at the Dauphine on 2 stages (and he was ill)

I guess Basso, Rogers & Kreuz will be up there with < 20 guys as they were at the Giro

Dauphine isn't the same as high mountain in the tour, seems kinda obvious.

Besides i never said anything about the guys from saxo, an irrelevant point you made there.

He was 13th on the Pra-Loup Dauphine stage that is literally a copy of a Tour stage this year.

 

[Miburo]

Re: Re:

In the high mountains he'll never be up there with froome when there's 20 guys left which is the point you were making.

He was up there with less than 20 guys left at the Dauphine on 2 stages (and he was ill)

I guess Basso, Rogers & Kreuz will be up there with < 20 guys as they were at the Giro

Dauphine isn't the same as high mountain in the tour, seems kinda obvious.

Besides i never said anything about the guys from saxo, an irrelevant point you made there.

He was 13th on the Pra-Loup Dauphine stage that is literally a copy of a Tour stage this year.

You can't be serious right? jesus lol

 

[TMP402]

Re: Re:

In the high mountains he'll never be up there with froome when there's 20 guys left which is the point you were making.

He was up there with less than 20 guys left at the Dauphine on 2 stages (and he was ill)

I guess Basso, Rogers & Kreuz will be up there with < 20 guys as they were at the Giro

Dauphine isn't the same as high mountain in the tour, seems kinda obvious.

Besides i never said anything about the guys from saxo, an irrelevant point you made there.

He was 13th on the Pra-Loup Dauphine stage that is literally a copy of a Tour stage this year.

You can't be serious right? jesus lol

It was richly comic, wasn't it? One of my best jokes of the year.

 

[Zinoviev Letter]

I'm increasingly baffled by this argument. Roche has finished top 20 in a very large number of mountain stages. He's a 15th to 5th sort of fringe GC rider. He is no worldbeater and never will be, but the idea that he can't stick around on a mountain stage until there are 20 riders left is simply bizarre. If he isn't around at that stage in this Tour it will mean that either he's out of shape, which is unlikely given that he's been training with Froome, or that Sky have stuck him on the front at an earlier point. The latter is entirely possible given that they have an entire mountain train full of domestiques who could be, or already have been, fringe GC men.

One of the advantages to having so many of those kind of riders is that even though some of them are a bit flakey, and might go missing on any given day, one of them at least should have good legs on any given stage. In Sky's train Porte is clearly Froome's number 2, but he also usually goes missing completely at least once per GT.

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

still roche has to be the most overrated rider on these anglophone forums.

 

[blackmamba]

Re:

still roche has to be the most overrated rider on these anglophone forums.

That also includes the british fanboys and what they think about sky, apperently sky has been dominating the GT's in the last 5 years.......

Funny how the entire sky team/with riders only have won 2 GT's ( in 5 years !!!) while contador alone has won 2 in less than 1 year

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

Re: Re:

still roche has to be the most overrated rider on these anglophone forums.

That also includes the british fanboys and what they think about sky, apperently sky has been dominating the GT's in the last 5 years.......

Funny how the entire sky team/with riders only have won 2 GT's ( in 5 years !!!) while contador alone has won 2 in less than 1 year

yes, sky is incredibly overrated. especially their train. it was something special somewhat in 2012, but now it's not at all. last years tour especially was laughable at best. now also this year I hear everyone cry about sky. for instance poels at sky is all of a sudden amazing climber and before this year nobody ever talked about him on this forum pretty much, yet he was the same rider. konig since this year is being talked about as a new pantani, well we all saw how amazing he was at the giro. kiriyenka?? has only gotten worse at sky, yet is more talked about then when he used to be a lot better at movistar/caisse. and richie porte??!! how many gt podiums or even top 5's has he done yet?

but probably the worst of them all is kennaugh. he's a 2 time british champion and for the rest pretty much sucked always. yet on this forum he's seen as a future gt contender, yet he has no results of any meaning.

 

[blackmamba]

Exactly. Just like before the giro all of a sudden RIchie Porte was suppose to win the giro and it was all this talk from em all the time how richie this how richie that (THE GUY HAS ONLY FINISHED TOP 10, TOP 10 FFS JUST ONCE IN A GT) and now all of a sudden was suppose to win a GT just like that..........that was when i realized its hopeless and gave up trying to even comment on the stuffs cause it literally made 0 sence for people with half a brain. Now again its just same story different page, at this point it just cracks me up tbh

 

[Zinoviev Letter]

Re:

still roche has to be the most overrated rider on these anglophone forums.

Does anyone really rate him as more than the kind of fringe GC man who will finish a GT he's in shape for somewhere between 15th and 5th? I can't remember anyone arguing in recent times that he's ever going to be more than that. Nobody talks about him a future GT winner, or anything silly like that. He is what he is, a good rider with limits that mean he'll be a useful domestique or a fringe GC man.

Of all the Sky riders who have shown any climbing ability at all, he's probably the least hyped. Other than perhaps Deignan or Nieve.

 

[Miburo]

Re: Re:

still roche has to be the most overrated rider on these anglophone forums.

That also includes the british fanboys and what they think about sky, apperently sky has been dominating the GT's in the last 5 years.......

Funny how the entire sky team/with riders only have won 2 GT's ( in 5 years !!!) while contador alone has won 2 in less than 1 year

yes, sky is incredibly overrated. especially their train. it was something special somewhat in 2012, but now it's not at all. last years tour especially was laughable at best. now also this year I hear everyone cry about sky. for instance poels at sky is all of a sudden amazing climber and before this year nobody ever talked about him on this forum pretty much, yet he was the same rider. konig since this year is being talked about as a new pantani, well we all saw how amazing he was at the giro. kiriyenka?? has only gotten worse at sky, yet is more talked about then when he used to be a lot better at movistar/caisse. and richie porte??!! how many gt podiums or even top 5's has he done yet?

but probably the worst of them all is kennaugh. he's a 2 time british champion and for the rest pretty much sucked always. yet on this forum he's seen as a future gt contender, yet he has no results of any meaning.

Reminds me of these guys saying quintana is the next pantani when he was only 3 days the best climber against the best climbers of the world.

 

[Christian]

Re:

Exactly. Just like before the giro all of a sudden RIchie Porte was suppose to win the giro and it was all this talk from em all the time how richie this how richie that (THE GUY HAS ONLY FINISHED TOP 10, TOP 10 FFS JUST ONCE IN A GT) and now all of a sudden was suppose to win a GT just like that..........that was when i realized its hopeless and gave up trying to even comment on the stuffs cause it literally made 0 sence for people with half a brain. Now again its just same story different page, at this point it just cracks me up tbh

Wow, I hadn't realized that. And that was even with Saxo Bank when he got pretty lucky with that huge breakaway!

 

[Zinoviev Letter]

Re: Re:

Wow, I hadn't realized that. And that was even with Saxo Bank when he got pretty lucky with that huge breakaway!

The Porte argument has been "he's shown that he can climb with all but the very best and TT very strongly" versus "he's a flake who can't keep it together for three weeks". Both statements are basically true thus far.

 

[May0maniac]

Re: Re:

I said HIGH mountains, not 3 hills

I think you underestimate this stage. Apart from Kadri from breakaway, only true climbers were in top20 that stage. No Gerranses, Kwiatkowskis, Gallopins etc.

Terpstra was 14th, was he in the breakaway?

 

[HelloDolly]

So this forum is full of talk about overhyped SKY riders ? such blatant bias bull
Hardly any mention of Kennaugh or Poles on this form and only mention of Porte and Roche is to ridicule them
every second post is about Alberto Contador and how he looked in photo A as opposed to photo B, etc
Or how Rafal Majka is going to be second in the Tour de France

I guess if you are blind except to your one world view you are bound to spout this sort of rubbish

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re: Re:

I said HIGH mountains, not 3 hills

I think you underestimate this stage. Apart from Kadri from breakaway, only true climbers were in top20 that stage. No Gerranses, Kwiatkowskis, Gallopins etc.

Terpstra was 14th, was he in the breakaway?

Yeah

 

[Gigs_98]

Re: Re:

still roche has to be the most overrated rider on these anglophone forums.

That also includes the british fanboys and what they think about sky, apperently sky has been dominating the GT's in the last 5 years.......

Funny how the entire sky team/with riders only have won 2 GT's ( in 5 years !!!) while contador alone has won 2 in less than 1 year

yes, sky is incredibly overrated. especially their train. it was something special somewhat in 2012, but now it's not at all. last years tour especially was laughable at best. now also this year I hear everyone cry about sky. for instance poels at sky is all of a sudden amazing climber and before this year nobody ever talked about him on this forum pretty much, yet he was the same rider. konig since this year is being talked about as a new pantani, well we all saw how amazing he was at the giro. kiriyenka?? has only gotten worse at sky, yet is more talked about then when he used to be a lot better at movistar/caisse. and richie porte??!! how many gt podiums or even top 5's has he done yet?

but probably the worst of them all is kennaugh. he's a 2 time british champion and for the rest pretty much sucked always. yet on this forum he's seen as a future gt contender, yet he has no results of any meaning.

1.) I think most people complain more about the way sky races than about them dominating gt´s. For example in last years vuelta sky completely controlled the stages, froome wanted to win, and although that didnt work it was boring. Or in this giro when porte didnt made real attacks in the first week although I think he was the second strongest rider back then.
2.) the sky train normally only appears in races in which froome participates in (or wiggins in 2012) which means that since 2012 there had only been 3 tdf´s and froome crashed out in one of them. The other two were dominated in exactly the way many people complain about

 

[blackmamba]

Re:

So this forum is full of talk about overhyped SKY riders ? such blatant bias bull
Hardly any mention of Kennaugh or Poles on this form and only mention of Porte and Roche is to ridicule them
every second post is about Alberto Contador and how he looked in photo A as opposed to photo B, etc
Or how Rafal Majka is going to be second in the Tour de France

I guess if you are blind except to your one world view you are bound to spout this sort of rubbish

and ofc you call it rubbish bull since you have no idea what your talking about......tell me hasnt sky only won 2 GT's last 5(!!) years? and contador 2 in less than 12 months alone? and is it true porte has only finished top 10 ONCE in his entire life? (when its that many times you cant say oh it was beaceuse of this and beacuse of that NO its a pattern the guy doesnt have it in him simple the end move on)

Whats rubbish about it please explain it to me? atleast we can justify it with real life events and not just fairytales and silly thoughts inside your head, instead base it on facts a word you should look up.

 

[TMP402]

Re:

Exactly. Just like before the giro all of a sudden RIchie Porte was suppose to win the giro and it was all this talk from em all the time how richie this how richie that (THE GUY HAS ONLY FINISHED TOP 10, TOP 10 FFS JUST ONCE IN A GT) and now all of a sudden was suppose to win a GT just like that..........that was when i realized its hopeless and gave up trying to even comment on the stuffs cause it literally made 0 sence for people with half a brain. Now again its just same story different page, at this point it just cracks me up tbh

Please at least attempt proper English.

 

[TMP402]

Re: Re:

still roche has to be the most overrated rider on these anglophone forums.

That also includes the british fanboys and what they think about sky, apperently sky has been dominating the GT's in the last 5 years.......

Funny how the entire sky team/with riders only have won 2 GT's ( in 5 years !!!) while contador alone has won 2 in less than 1 year

yes, sky is incredibly overrated. especially their train. it was something special somewhat in 2012, but now it's not at all. last years tour especially was laughable at best. now also this year I hear everyone cry about sky. for instance poels at sky is all of a sudden amazing climber and before this year nobody ever talked about him on this forum pretty much, yet he was the same rider. konig since this year is being talked about as a new pantani, well we all saw how amazing he was at the giro. kiriyenka?? has only gotten worse at sky, yet is more talked about then when he used to be a lot better at movistar/caisse. and richie porte??!! how many gt podiums or even top 5's has he done yet?

but probably the worst of them all is kennaugh. he's a 2 time british champion and for the rest pretty much sucked always. yet on this forum he's seen as a future gt contender, yet he has no results of any meaning.

At least Henao's in the team.

 

[djpbaltimore]

Re:

Exactly. Just like before the giro all of a sudden RIchie Porte was suppose to win the giro and it was all this talk from em all the time how richie this how richie that (THE GUY HAS ONLY FINISHED TOP 10, TOP 10 FFS JUST ONCE IN A GT) and now all of a sudden was suppose to win a GT just like that..........that was when i realized its hopeless and gave up trying to even comment on the stuffs cause it literally made 0 sence for people with half a brain. Now again its just same story different page, at this point it just cracks me up tbh

Go back to the poll and look how few people thought that Porte would win the race. There is a 'fact' for you, so quit re-writing history to suit your biased rants. And BTW, it is usually good form to use spell check when you are trying to insult people's intelligence, so it doesn't make you look like a fool afterwards.

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=29359

 

[Singer01]

Re:

Exactly. Just like before the giro all of a sudden RIchie Porte was suppose to win the giro and it was all this talk from em all the time how richie this how richie that (THE GUY HAS ONLY FINISHED TOP 10, TOP 10 FFS JUST ONCE IN A GT) and now all of a sudden was suppose to win a GT just like that..........that was when i realized its hopeless and gave up trying to even comment on the stuffs cause it literally made 0 sence for people with half a brain. Now again its just same story different page, at this point it just cracks me up tbh

For someone who criticize's people for only having half a brain, your writing is woeful (if English isn't your first language then I withdraw and apologize).