2016 Vuelta a España, stage 15: Sabiñánigo > Aramón Formigal

[Tonton]

Re: Re:

Once more, that was effing awesome. Contador, Quintana, Froome. The Erviti salvos, and Chaves playing his bit at the start, the middle, and the end. Castroviejo just emptied himself completely; I don't know how that guy wakes up before noon tomorrow. Contador screaming at his teammates; every once in a while alpha management really pays off. Astana putting up the most spirited defense of a ninth place outside of the hunger games; I look forward to whatever reason is offered for Froome starting the Tour of Almaty. Quintana manning up and taking it too the line. Brambi, even. Again, how many times has the guy who went of solo at mile one won a Grand Tour stage? It had to be today. Proper epic.

Great post, the bolded in particular is brilliant. Nice .

 

[samhocking]

I just watched it back a few times to get the full picture of what happened. At 115.7km Brambilla attacks out of the line but about 5 seconds before that there's an overhead shot and what looks like a clash of bars or wheels or something and a big compression in the bunch just ahead of Froome causes the wheel to be lost and a 10m gap opens up immediately. The camera footage then goes back to Brambilla for 10 seconds or so, then when it goes back to the overhead bunch shot that 10m gap is now 30m, no doubt Tinkoff see this on the TV and Contador attacks immediatly. Without race radios, this move wouldn't have happened, which says something for not banning them anyway. Radios at least make moves like this possible on days you don't think much is going to happen, it allows something to be created from a TV shot. Fantastic racing today, proper race now on for 3rd too with Chaves.

 

[movingtarget]

Contador. You have to hand it to him. Always the opportunist and never looks for an easy day but Quintana was also a powerhouse in the break. He looks so strong at the moment.

 

[victorschipolrijk]

Re:

Contador at the finish roughly; "for me it was making a great stage for the spectators foremost , i said to Nairo for me the gc is secondary because im so far behind, and lets work together because today you can win the vuelta. A great than you to the Colombian fans, im not COlombian but the support from them on the road and on social media is amazing"

too bad he couldnt follow in the last k for the stage win

quintana sooo strong riding the group off his wheel

Really????
Where did you hear that?????
Do you have a link????

I saw the interview after finishing the stage, and Contador did not make any mention of Colombia or colombians.

It'd be nice if you can provide any link.

 

[Bogotano]

Re: Re:

Contador at the finish roughly; "for me it was making a great stage for the spectators foremost , i said to Nairo for me the gc is secondary because im so far behind, and lets work together because today you can win the vuelta. A great than you to the Colombian fans, im not COlombian but the support from them on the road and on social media is amazing"

too bad he couldnt follow in the last k for the stage win

quintana sooo strong riding the group off his wheel

Really????
Where did you hear that?????
Do you have a link????

I saw the interview after finishing the stage, and Contador did not make any mention of Colombia or colombians.

It'd be nice if you can provide any link.

Saw it on the Colombian television that was broadcasting the stage, not sure if they asked him specifically about it, or if he new the reporters were Colombian, because it cut straight to his answer

edit link;
http://www.revistamundociclistico.com/ruta/21842-ha-sido-una-linda-etapa-una-de-esas-que-queda-en-la-aficion-hoy-nairo-quintana-ha-dado-un-paso-importante-en-la-vuelta-alberto-contador.html

 

[MacBAir]

Re: Re:

Cioni seems to suggest Froome was delayed by a crash at end of the neutralised zone just as Brambilla & then Contador attacked. Too early for live video, but it at least explains why he dropped to near the back and then Contador attacked.

I didn't watch it myself (the start caught me completely off my guard), but didn't Froome close a first gap, only for a second one to be opened afterwards?

Froome didn't see to make contact to the first group. He did a huge push to come back to the chasing group. Alberto just kept going and going on the descent and flat.

 

[Bolder]

Re:

What a wonderful result for cycling. Woke up last night and found Quintana was in the break. Woke up this morning and found he made it stick and with a Vuelta winning lead unless he falls off.

Congratulations Movistar and Nairo! So much for putting all faith in the power meter gods. Sky have never been very good at tactics and their lack of race nous looks like it will cost them a Grand Tour. Great stuff.

I really don't think it was a tactical issue -- Sky was worn out from previous efforts, and the attack was perfectly timed. How long did that gap hold at 2 minutes or so? I'm not a huge Froome fan but I still think what we're seeing is a dropoff in his form rather than Qintana getting better (and I'm cheering for Nairo to win btw).

Now, Orica -- jeez, they won the tactics on Stage 14, and mostly for naught. Having ridden in Spain when it's hot, I can't even imagine being able to recover with 3 days' rest, let alone the next day...

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

Re: Re:

Contador again outpaced. Surreal.

Did the lion's share of the work driving the break.

maybe in your little fantasy world

 

[samhocking]

Look at the footage around 114km on. TV bike is alongside Froome showing just how far back he is and that the peloton is already clearly strung out as riders are trying to get off the front before Brambilla. Then shows Brambilla attacking from TV bike. TV director then switches to helicopter camera and there's a big compression about 1/3rd back in the line from a clash of bars or wheels it looks like and immediately a 10m gap opens up. TV then goes back to Brambilla who's now hot a few seconds on the peloton and out on his own, then back to helicopter tv and the 10m gap is now more like 20m and obvious the elastic has snapped for Froome. Literally 5 seconds after that gap is shown, Contador attacks. This was a classic TV footage and race radio move in full-effect. Wouldn't have been possible without the DS watching TV in the car because Contador would never have known about the compression and gap or been able to take advantage of the already snapped elastic back to Froome. One reason I don't want race radio banned. It allows for great attacking racing, just not possible without a DS watching the live TV footage.

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

Re:

Cioni seems to suggest Froome was delayed by a crash at end of the neutralised zone just as Brambilla & then Contador attacked. Too early for live video, but it at least explains why he dropped to near the back and then Contador attacked.

bull**** as can be seen on the contador attack video. froome was just badly posditioned in that descend and surprised

 

[laurensde+]

Re: Re:

I look forward to whatever reason is offered for Froome starting the Tour of Almaty.

Excellent.

 

[samhocking]

Re: Re:

Cioni seems to suggest Froome was delayed by a crash at end of the neutralised zone just as Brambilla & then Contador attacked. Too early for live video, but it at least explains why he dropped to near the back and then Contador attacked.

bull**** as can be seen on the contador attack video. froome was just badly posditioned in that descend and surprised

Steven de jongh interview confirms Cioni that he also knew of the Lotto rider crash delaying Froome and Sky's poor positioning after and then he goes onto confirm he knew Froome was far back because he was watching it on TV and saw the gap after the compression from the clash of bars/wheels at 115.7km. He then confirms he told the riders Froome was in trouble and to attack Froome.

 

[dusty red roads]

Except that there was no live pictures that point so no DS saw it. Check out Orica's Backstage Pass - Neil Stephens mentions a crash and also that they didn't have any pictures so couldn't see what was going on when Brambilla and Contador were attacking.

 

[samhocking]

The Spanish coverage was live. I've just watched it. It was live during neutralised zone too. It's on youtube now.

 

[dusty red roads]

Any links to the interview? Orica had no live pictures, so surprised someone else would, but I guess stranger things have happened...

 

[BetOrLose]

So again Quintana goes against the unwritten rules like in the Giro

 

[samhocking]

Re:

Any links to the interview? Orica had no live pictures, so surprised someone else would, but I guess stranger things have happened...

Interview is on the post race podcast. Orica wouldn't have had access to TDP stream, just the packaged highlights from ASO & onboard I would imagine. TDP complete footage from startline onwards is at Vuelta a España 2016 15ª Etapa (Sabiñánigo - Formigal) PARTE 1 on youtube.

 

[King Boonen]

Capitalising on crashes again..?

 

[Hakkapelit]

Re:

Look at the footage around 114km on. TV bike is alongside Froome showing just how far back he is and that the peloton is already clearly strung out as riders are trying to get off the front before Brambilla. Then shows Brambilla attacking from TV bike. TV director then switches to helicopter camera and there's a big compression about 1/3rd back in the line from a clash of bars or wheels it looks like and immediately a 10m gap opens up. TV then goes back to Brambilla who's now hot a few seconds on the peloton and out on his own, then back to helicopter tv and the 10m gap is now more like 20m and obvious the elastic has snapped for Froome. Literally 5 seconds after that gap is shown, Contador attacks. This was a classic TV footage and race radio move in full-effect. Wouldn't have been possible without the DS watching TV in the car because Contador would never have known about the compression and gap or been able to take advantage of the already snapped elastic back to Froome. One reason I don't want race radio banned. It allows for great attacking racing, just not possible without a DS watching the live TV footage.

This assumes the TV-coverage has no delay whatsoever, which surely isn't the case...

 

[samhocking]

Capitalising on race radio and TV coverage in the cars from Tinkoff, no doubt. Banning race radio is one thing, but the real issue is TV in the cars if you think race radio should be banned, it has to be done with TV screen also. That's what the DS is using to tell riders to attack or not in stage racing at least.

Sky you assume was also watching the TDP stream, but they might not have, so it's a fair battle. Froome was out of position from the crash and then exposed with the elastic breaking and the race was too full-gas to get over that and bridge up to G1. Even with a team around him, I don't think it would have made much difference, the gap had already formed and everyone was full-gas. It was just full-gas in G1 and full-gas in G2 up the climb at least anyway.

 

[samhocking]

Re: Re:

Look at the footage around 114km on. TV bike is alongside Froome showing just how far back he is and that the peloton is already clearly strung out as riders are trying to get off the front before Brambilla. Then shows Brambilla attacking from TV bike. TV director then switches to helicopter camera and there's a big compression about 1/3rd back in the line from a clash of bars or wheels it looks like and immediately a 10m gap opens up. TV then goes back to Brambilla who's now hot a few seconds on the peloton and out on his own, then back to helicopter tv and the 10m gap is now more like 20m and obvious the elastic has snapped for Froome. Literally 5 seconds after that gap is shown, Contador attacks. This was a classic TV footage and race radio move in full-effect. Wouldn't have been possible without the DS watching TV in the car because Contador would never have known about the compression and gap or been able to take advantage of the already snapped elastic back to Froome. One reason I don't want race radio banned. It allows for great attacking racing, just not possible without a DS watching the live TV footage.

This assumes the TV-coverage has no delay whatsoever, which surely isn't the case...

About 3 seconds i believe. They might use a 7 second profanity delay, but I doubt it.

 

[Billie]

Froome got back again at 112,5 to go anyway

 

[veji11]

Re:

So again Quintana goes against the unwritten rules like in the Giro

Pfff. Pathetic comment.. Unwritten rules are not rules ? road cycling was never about waiting galantly for your rival until the last uphill finish, a GT used to be war everyday, where the Anquetils of the world would set the road on fire on a flat stage to destroy an opponent caught napping at the back of the peloton. The only thing that matters is to be ready for attacks at any given time. That's it.

 

[samhocking]

Re: Re:

So again Quintana goes against the unwritten rules like in the Giro

Pfff. Pathetic comment.. Unwritten rules are not rules ? road cycling was never about waiting galantly for your rival until the last uphill finish, a GT used to be war everyday, where the Anquetils of the world would set the road on fire on a flat stage to destroy an opponent caught napping at the back of the peloton. The only thing that matters is to be ready for attacks at any given time. That's it.

OK, i've heard the full Cioni interview now. The crash was out of the back of G1 on the descent where Contador was pushing it and that was the Lotto rider o nthe ground and held up G2 and Froome catching back. The race was lost on the climb though with the riders loosing the wheel after the clash of bars/wheels though. That's when Contador attacked and Steven de Jongh says in his interview. "We could see Froome was not there, Chaves was not there. You could see that, it was live on television, so you could see the composition of the race quite good, so we could inform the riders and then they all knew it was gonna be, yeah, a very hard day and spectacular day".

 

[samhocking]

An interesting interview with Scarponi from Frieb. Scarponi was heard raging on the team bus after it apparently fuming that he asked why Astana was working for Froome for 10th. Sounds like Astana really thought with Konig in Grupetto if they caught back G1, Scarponi could be in 5th.