2017 Worlds BERGEN, NORWAY, RR ELITE, SUN 24th 277KM!

[HelloDolly]

So why did Gilbert or GVA not go earlier ...even with Allaphillipe.....and same for Kwaito

What were they waiting for

Love Kiry...he was down the back most of race and next thing he catches Allaphillipe and drops him
Pity the TV missed he great attack...well done that man

 

[Der Effe]

Even though I don't like Sagan as a person, it is really weird to blame him. Blame the awful course, blame the Belgians who did f*ck all or blame the Czechs and to a lesser extent Polish for their ridiculous riding - that makes far more sense.

 

[jaylew]

Re: Re:

The race itself wasn't bad at all I don't think, much better than the previous two years. But the podium is pretty terrible, a vidication of wheelsucking. At least Norway did something I guess.

Uh...it's cycling. Virtually the entire sport is shaped around "wheelsucking" if this was an example of it. This was just normal racing - a sprint finish. This wasn't like a Gerrans-Cancellara at MSR situation.

Well, at least we witnessed history. Credit where credit is due - love him or hate him, Sagan is a marvel

Sure, but I'm allowed to say that I'd rather have had anybody else on the podium. This might lead to more teams in the future to just sit back and do this, which would just kill every single race. I'd rather riders who actually did something in the race to win. Sagan wasn't one of them.

Of course any team that has one of the top sprinters in the field will race for a sprint. It's not about leading other teams to do the same - you race to your riders' strengths. It's up to teams who don't have one of the fastest riders on a given parcours to attempt to change the outcome. This course wasn't too hard but it was hard enough for a bunch sprint not to have been guaranteed but it was up to the teams and riders who didn't have a Sagan, Matthews, or Kristoff. "Wheelsucking" had nothing to do with the result today unless you just call normal racing wheelsucking.

I too, am disappointed with the finish but you can't blame the riders who finished on the podium - you have to blame the other teams. If you want a rider who did something in the race to win, you just don't like sprints. I don't either for the most part - definitely not at Worlds.

 

[burning]

Re: Re:

He's gone from dumb aggressive rider who wastes all his energy too early to Gerrans v2 literally overnight.

Really? He's won wheelsucking since the start of his career. I've always said so. Glad more people realise it, now.

Can you spew some hate on your beloved Belgian heros? They did exactly nothing as well apart from Wellens going into a doomed attack, and they utterly failed in the sprint.

 

[Asero831]

what happened to Gavaria? Is he really a 2nd/3rd tier sprinter?

 

[alspacka]

Aside from all the polemic Sagan business, is there anyone who doesn't love Alaphilippe? I've yet to meet them

 

[Brullnux]

Re:

So why did Gilbert or GVA not go earlier ...even with Allaphillipe.....and same for Kwaito

What were they waiting for

Love Kiry...he was down the back most of race and next thing he catches Allaphillipe and drops him
Pity the TV missed he great attack...well done that man

GvA got dropped by Alaphillipe and then Moscon.

 

[Richeypen]

Re:

I usually cheer for the Colombian riders, but you have to appreciate what Sagan did here. I don't understand the hate towards him. Is it related with something else other than cycling?

His personality.

 

[movingtarget]

Re:

So why did Gilbert or GVA not go earlier ...even with Allaphillipe.....and same for Kwaito

What were they waiting for

Love Kiry...he was down the back most of race and next thing he catches Allaphillipe and drops him
Pity the TV missed he great attack...well done that man

I don't think they could go with Alaphillipe.

 

[DFA123]

Re: Re:

The Sagan hate is hilarious... He's one of the most attacking, exciting riders all year, but by all means keep complaining that he doesn't deserve it.

Surely no-one is saying that Sagan is an undeserving winner. Just that it would have been a lot more fun to see him win the jersey on a more selective course - like RVV or Strade Bianche - than in a bunch sprint for the second year in a row.

The ones calling him a wheelsucker surely are.

That's what anyones says when they think that a rider doesn't deserve to win.

Oh right, I took it more as a criticism of the course - that a rider could win without doing anything until the final km. If that's a criticism of Sagan then it's completely ridiculous - all attacking would have done is thrown away any chances on that course.

 

[d-s3]

Re: Re:

He's gone from dumb aggressive rider who wastes all his energy too early to Gerrans v2 literally overnight.

Really? He's won wheelsucking since the start of his career. I've always said so. Glad more people realise it, now.

I guess nobody cares all that much what you're saying.
You're so biased and your comments are so out of reality because of your Sagan-hate that I guess people just laugh at them

 

[Cance > TheRest]

Re: Re:

It's also what you get when the WC are designed for sprinters who can climb a bit for three years in a row. ...

Doha was had no hills. But otherwise yeah, the WCRR last few years was "classic" style race.

But Belgians, et all doing all of nothing today had something to do with it. Sagan won of luck today, he had one card and played that card well. But that Ala will be caught was anything but certain.

Sure, Sagan got it spot on and it's a great win for him. Personally I think it's a shame that the podium for the biggest race in cycling has been made up for three years in a row now, by guys who were virtually unseen the entire race until the last 3km. This should be cycling's showpiece event - but it's been way more tedious than most monuments for four years now because of crap courses.

I don't understand why you don't count Kwiatkowski's win in 2014 in that collection of world championships. Do you think that there's a huge difference between a race where the deciding attack comes with 3.5km to go and one where it's 7km to go?

 

[hrotha]

I'm not hating on Sagan, but I don't think this win in particular can be described as anything but "underwhelming", especially since a third win is historical. I'm not saying he should have done anything differently - it was a perfect race, tactically.

 

[bigcog]

Hopefully Yorkshire 2019 will have lots of brutal short pennine climbs.

 

[Tank Engine]

Re: Re:

Dont think it was a boring race at all tbh

Not a boring race. But a predictable end nonetheless. I feel like they could have done more to prevent a sprint, especially Belgium

Indeed. The penultimate lap was not used right.

Once they got over the penultimate climb and there was still a large peloton, it was odds on that it would be a
reduced bunch sprint.

I have no problems with the course. It gave riders with different characteristics a chance. Not a classic race, but not a borefest.

Kwiatek's plan to win? Pedal faster. The top of the climb was quite a way from the finish, which favours a sprinter who can climb.

I can understand that people don't like it when the guy that wins is invisible until the final 200-300m (Ok the cameras failed ), but Sagan pretty much played the only card he had today and he has lost big races more often by being wheelsucked than vice versa, so no problems there.

To be honest, those complaining about Matthews probably forgot about the tour. He was pretty active on the final climb. Did anybody really expect him to go earlier?

 

[Rollthedice]

No team on a parcours with 99% chances that will come to a reduced bunch sprint. What would you do if you are Sagan and want to win the race?

 

[d-s3]

Re:

Aside from all the polemic Sagan business, is there anyone who doesn't love Alaphilippe? I've yet to meet them

Should Sagan not be there, I'd be thrilled to see Alaphilippe to win. I like how he rides.

 

[Frankschleck]

Re: Re:

He's gone from dumb aggressive rider who wastes all his energy too early to Gerrans v2 literally overnight.

Really? He's won wheelsucking since the start of his career. I've always said so. Glad more people realise it, now.

Can you spew some hate on your beloved Belgian heros? They did exactly nothing as well apart from Wellens going into a doomed attack, and they utterly failed in the sprint.

Nah joke aside, sagan weelsucked today, but he usaully does not. Gva did the samething and couldn't win, Its not his fault he won.

 

[SKSemtex]

And you better be ready for more wheelsucking next year. With Oss and kennaugh and strong Bora we will see diferent Peter next year.

 

[Echoes]

Re: Re:

I guess nobody cares all that much what you're saying.

So what? I'm free to say whatever I want s long as it fit with the rules of the forum. Put on ignore if you don't like my posts.

 

[DingoGuesdon]

Re:

Aside from all the polemic Sagan business, is there anyone who doesn't love Alaphilippe? I've yet to meet them

it is because he does not win. Wait until he starts winning.

 

[Brullnux]

Re: Re:

The race itself wasn't bad at all I don't think, much better than the previous two years. But the podium is pretty terrible, a vidication of wheelsucking. At least Norway did something I guess.

Uh...it's cycling. Virtually the entire sport is shaped around "wheelsucking" if this was an example of it. This was just normal racing - a sprint finish. This wasn't like a Gerrans-Cancellara at MSR situation.

Well, at least we witnessed history. Credit where credit is due - love him or hate him, Sagan is a marvel

Sure, but I'm allowed to say that I'd rather have had anybody else on the podium. This might lead to more teams in the future to just sit back and do this, which would just kill every single race. I'd rather riders who actually did something in the race to win. Sagan wasn't one of them.

Of course any team that has one of the top sprinters in the field will race for a sprint. It's not about leading other teams to do the same - you race to your riders' strengths. It's up to teams who don't have one of the fastest riders on a given parcours to attempt to change the outcome. This course wasn't too hard but it was hard enough for a bunch sprint not to have been guaranteed but it was up to the teams and riders who didn't have a Sagan, Matthews, or Kristoff. "Wheelsucking" had nothing to do with the result today unless you just call normal racing wheelsucking.

I too, am disappointed with the finish but you can't blame the riders who finished on the podium - you have to blame the other teams. If you want a rider who did something in the race to win, you just don't like sprints. I don't either for the most part - definitely not at Worlds.

Absolutely. But I was picturing Matthews winning, and the ensuing reaction, and transporting it to Sagan winning. Objectively, without context, there is no difference. Sagan did nothing wrong, but it was disappointing.

 

[HelloDolly]

Well maybe GVA & Gilbert could not follow Allaphillipe but they still could have gone on an attack

I Kiry could do it ...surely these could

BTW Sagan has a great personality...he is kind & fun & a good person...some people on here talk sh**

 

[movingtarget]

Re: Re:

It's also what you get when the WC are designed for sprinters who can climb a bit for three years in a row. ...

Doha was had no hills. But otherwise yeah, the WCRR last few years was "classic" style race.

But Belgians, et all doing all of nothing today had something to do with it. Sagan won of luck today, he had one card and played that card well. But that Ala will be caught was anything but certain.

Sure, Sagan got it spot on and it's a great win for him. Personally I think it's a shame that the podium for the biggest race in cycling has been made up for three years in a row now, by guys who were virtually unseen the entire race until the last 3km. This should be cycling's showpiece event - but it's been way more tedious than most monuments for four years now because of crap courses.

I don't understand why you don't count Kwiatkowski's win in 2014 in that collection of world championships. Do you think that there's a huge difference between a race where the deciding attack comes with 3.5km to go and one where it's 7km to go?

Kwia's win was the best since Evans in 2009.

 

[alspacka]

Re:

what happened to Gavaria? Is he really a 2nd/3rd tier sprinter?

Needs to develop further for >250km, I guess