2022 National Championships

[Breezy1985]

One of his legs is apparently shorter than the other (I guess you can kind of tell from the picture, too).

One of his legs looks pretty long to me alright

 

[Samamba]

Ben Healy as expected in Ireland.

 

[Potomac]

PCS has USA TT results

National Championships United States - ITT 2022 Time trial results

Lawson Craddock is the winner of National Championships United States - ITT 2022, before Magnus Sheffield and George Simpson.

www.procyclingstats.com

 

[Big Doopie]

hoping for Van Wilder, Cavagna, Cattaneo and Lampaert to join Remco for Vuelta TTT. Good be sweet, and importantly a lot of them on an apparent similar TT level.

on a side note, the speeds in TTs keep climbing. i really think the UCI needs to do more to control the tech. or they have to be very choosy about the courses (more rolling than pure flat). at higher speeds, the dangers are greater (particularly in TTT). and at higher speeds, time differences are also less.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Only 9 participants in Polish ITT today, 2 of whom do not even currently compete on paid level (Marcin Białobłocki though was once 9th in WC back in his pro days). I guess it was due to ridiculously long course - 51km . I don't even bother mentioning who won for this time, because I could say that sun is bright as well.

Had I known it before, I surely would have signed up and later boast that I am among 10 best time trialists in my country.

Even I would make the top10 there even though I'm not a TT specialist.

 

[Zinoviev Letter]

Ben Healy as expected in Ireland.

Strong performance too, by over 1:30.

Darren Rafferty took the U23, which is good going at 18.

 

[Zinoviev Letter]

Do national TTs count for UCI points and WT relegation?

 

[Jumbo Visma Fan :)]

Do national TTs count for UCI points and WT relegation?

Yes.

 

[ppanther92]

As for Slovenian nationals. Today was ITT and Jan Tratnik won the title. Second was Mohorič and third Polanc.

Fun fact: the Austrian and Slovenian nationals were both held in Nove Mesto on the same course. Combined ranking:

1. Großschartner
2. Tratnik +0:17
3. Mohoric + 0:25
4. Kepplinger +0:52
5. Brändle +1:12
6. Poland +1:31

 

[Samu Cuenca]

Fun fact: the Austrian and Slovenian nationals were both held in Nove Mesto on the same course. Combined ranking:

6. Poland +1:31

I hadn't noticed that. You're also not the first one to think Poland was part of it as well

 

[ppanther92]

I hadn't noticed that. You're also not the first one to think Poland was part of it as well

c and d is reasonably close on a keyboard - I have an excuse

 

[CHGJ2000]

If it was a composite top 3 similar to team classification in Grand Tours I would take Belgium top 3 (Wout, Remco, Lampaert) by at least 1 min 30s over Italy top 3 (Ganna, Affini, Sobrero) on a 30-35km course.

I'd agree with that, although depends on the course certainly. The argument was more if you are talking about just how strong is the field of top echelon TT'ers in a country, Italy is the strongest (originally was a remark relating to a NC's field of a country while missing their top guys).

 

[ciranda]

I'd agree with that, although depends on the course certainly. The argument was more if you are talking about just how strong is the field of top echelon TT'ers in a country, Italy is the strongest (originally was a remark relating to a NC's field of a country while missing their top guys).

Let me just mention as a side note that in the ranking mentioned above there's four danish riders in the top twenty, like Italy, and ten in the top 100, three more than Italy.

 

[CHGJ2000]

Let me just mention as a side note that in the ranking mentioned above there's four danish riders in the top twenty, like Italy, and ten in the top 100, three more than Italy.

Yeah you could argue they're deeper, but unlike Italy and Belgium, don't have a proper top TT'er. Asgreen's great ofc, but nowhere close to the level of Ganna or Wout.

 

[Danskebjerge]

True, but Italy currently has probably the best TT field of any country on the men's side. Belgium's close though.

Judging by the Top 100 at Procyclingstats (and this seems like the most objective measurement in this context), Denmark and Netherlands are the strongest ITT nations, both with ten riders in the world's ITT top 100. France, Italy, Spain, UK and the other big nations have less. Belgium is not even close.

I'm not surprised by Denmark's position here. Denmark has always had many great tempo specialists even among the lesser known riders.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

Cattaneo has been more solid than Lampaert and Campenaerts over the last couple of seasons.,

And yet he is not superior to Van Wilder, even if he has not had the chance to show himself that often.

News flash - people don't generally agree with literally everything someone they side with in an argument says. I agree Moscon doesn't belong in the discussion, but of the other people listed, Affini and Cattaneo both have a better trackrecord in the past few years than Lampaert, especially in bigger TTs. Sobrero does too, unless we exclude his performances in the Giro or Tirreno on account of those being in Italy (and I don't think it's fair to treat those in the same way as a Belgium Tour TT). Bettiol is more up for debate, I would argue he has the edge over Lampaert but would agree to disagree on that (also depends on how you factor in his chronic illness). In any case, I absolutely agree that Italy has better depth behind their best two time-trialists, otherwise I wouldn't have waded into this argument...

(Edit: that second part doesn't make sense, I read BBT as BinckBank Tour instead of Baloise Belgium Tour)

So you didn't agree with him on that point, yet you chose to get into an argument with me based on a response to the point you didn't agree on with him. Makes sense.

Anyway, you are free to your opinion. I don't agree with it, and there is also very little to support those claims. There is no magical potion that has Lampaert finish close to Van Aert and Evenepoel in Belgium, while in fact he would otherwise be unable to compete in other TT's in other countries. He simply is used as a domestique in most bigger stageraces, and so unlike Cattaneo or Sobrero who often try to chase a top 10 spot in GC, there is no reason for him to go all out, considering his level is not good enough to beat the very top guys and he shouldn't waste energy needlessly. But it certainly would be enough to, jut like Cattaneo, get loads of top 10 spots. I think in a TTT or relay Belgium's top 5 would handily beat Italy's top 5. I don't think it would be close either. As soon as a TT is a bit on the long side, or if there is a tiny molehill in it, forget about Affini.

 

[Armchair cyclist]

Mohoric won the men's race in Slovenia.

Huh?

1	TRATNIK Jan	Bahrain - Victorious	50	15		0:35:22	48.860
2	MOHORIČ Matej	Bahrain - Victorious	30	7		0:08	48.676
3	POLANC Jan	UAE Team Emirates	20	2		1:14	47.213

 

[Devil's Elbow]

So you didn't agree with him on that point, yet you chose to get into an argument with me based on a response to the point you didn't agree on with him. Makes sense.

Er? I very clearly stated I agreed with the main point, just not with the claim that Moscon is better in TTs than Lampaert.

In any case, I absolutely agree that Italy has better depth behind their best two time-trialists, otherwise I wouldn't have waded into this argument...

and so unlike Cattaneo or Sobrero who often try to chase a top 10 spot in GC, there is no reason for him to go all out

Sobrero has finished in the top-20 of the GC of a professional race exactly once, in a race that didn't have a TT, so that is not the difference.

There is no magical potion that has Lampaert finish close to Van Aert and Evenepoel in Belgium, while in fact he would otherwise be unable to compete in other races in other countries

Lampaert and Van Aert have done exactly one TT together in Belgium in this timeframe, in 2019 (the NC) when Van Aert had only just started to show signs of becoming top-class while Lampaert was having the best season of his career (this was the week after his Suisse win), Van Aert won by 32 seconds on a 38-kilometre course anyway.

As soon as a TT is a bit on the long side, or if there is a tiny molehill in it, forget about Affini.

Affini managed ninth at the Worlds last year, which was over 40k, and third at the final Giro TT, which was over 30k. You could argue that isn't long compared to ten years ago but then I will argue that Lampaert hasn't made the top-10 of a 25k-plus TT since the 2018 Euros except for the NC, so there isn't much to suggest Lampaert is better at TTs that are 'a bit on the long side' - and Affini does his share of domestique work too so that isn't a mitigating factor for Lampaert there.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

Sobrero has finished in the top-20 of the GC of a professional race exactly once, in a race that didn't have a TT, so that is not the difference.

Lampaert and Van Aert have done exactly one TT together in Belgium in this timeframe, in 2019 (the NC) when Van Aert had only just started to show signs of becoming top-class while Lampaert was having the best season of his career (this was the week after his Suisse win), Van Aert won by 32 seconds on a 38-kilometre course anyway.

Affini managed ninth at the Worlds last year, which was over 40k, and third at the final Giro TT, which was over 30k. You could argue that isn't long compared to ten years ago but then I will argue that Lampaert hasn't made the top-10 of a 25k-plus TT since the 2018 Euros except for the NC, so there isn't much to suggest Lampaert is better at TTs that are 'a bit on the long side' - and Affini does his share of domestique work too so that isn't a mitigating factor for Lampaert there.

Van Aert had just started showing signs? He had just won the Dauphiné TT. That's not showing signs, that's rubbing your face in it. Showing signs was when he beat Martin in 2016. Jeez, why the hell am i even responding to this nonsense.
No, 40k is not long for WCC TT's and it was as flat as they get. As to the original statement, i think the gap between Italy's nr1 and nr2 is bigger than the gap between Belgium's nr2 and nr3. Ganna, Van Aert and Evenepoel are all world class TTers. and the gap between them and the rest of Belgium/Italy's best is large enough to completely render the discussion whether Lampaert could beat Affini or Cattaneo could beat Van Wilder by 10 seconds, irrelevant, because they would all finish a minute later than Ganna, Van Aert and Evenepoel. And The fact that Belgium has 2, and Italy just 1 worldclass TTer, quite easily trumps any battly for mere seconds between the mortals.

Affini, Italy's number 2, managed 9th... over a minute behind Belgium's number 2. And Italy's number 3, Sobrero, finished 2m 20s behind Evenepoel. Do you understand?

Er? I very clearly stated I agreed with the main point, just not with the claim that Moscon is better in TTs than Lampaert.

And yet, once more i will try to explain, my response was to him dismissing Lampaert, while proposing the likes of Moscon and Bettiol. Yet, instead of telling him Moscon is a non-factor, and even Bettiol is up for debate, you chose to attack my argument, which was a direct reply to his statement dismissing Lampaert and proposing the likes of Moscon/Bettiol to begin with. which you have since acknowledged you agree was not correct. I could try and type it slower if it's still not clear.

 

[jmdirt]

PCS has USA TT results

National Championships United States - ITT 2022 Time trial results

Lawson Craddock is the winner of National Championships United States - ITT 2022, before Magnus Sheffield and George Simpson.

www.procyclingstats.com

National Championships United States WE - ITT 2022 Time trial results

Leah Thomas is the winner of National Championships United States WE - ITT 2022, before Amber Neben and Lauren Stephens.

www.procyclingstats.com

 

[jmdirt]

Do national TTs count for UCI points and WT relegation?

I believe so.

 

[Pirazziattacks]

At first I was entertained, then I was just annoyed at the usual blowhard writing several essays in response to the totally uncontroversial statement that Italy has a very strong TT lineup. Remco and Belgian friends vs the world in every thread is excruciatingly dull, bring back the Contador and Schleck stans. At least they were entertaining in a slightly deranged way.

 

[RedheadDane]

Huh?

1	TRATNIK Jan	Bahrain - Victorious	50	15		0:35:22	48.860
2	MOHORIČ Matej	Bahrain - Victorious	30	7		0:08	48.676
3	POLANC Jan	UAE Team Emirates	20	2		1:14	47.213

Yeah, dunno what happened there. Mohoric was definitely the one who showed up when I posted.
And eight seconds isn't even that close...

And in Switzerland, apparently they had just ten riders signed up, and half of them didn't even start...

1	SUTER Joel	UAE Team Emirates	50	15		0:47:00	48.511
2	SCHMID Mauro	Quick-Step Alpha Vinyl Team	30	7		0:29	48.017
3	BOHLI Tom	Cofidis	20	2		1:58	46.562
4	FROIDEVAUX Robin	Tudor Pro Cycling Team	15			3:26	45.208
5	VOGEL Alex	Tudor Pro Cycling Team	10			3:57	44.750
DNS	JOLIDON Cédric					-
DNS	KÜNG Stefan	Groupama - FDJ				-
DNS	JACOBS Johan	Movistar Team				-
DNS	HOLLENSTEIN Reto	Israel - Premier Tech				-
DNS	BISSEGGER Stefan	EF Education-EasyPost				-

 

[Patrysbgc]

The Italian u23 ITT also only had 14 riders, a joke for a cycling country like Italy.

Well, when I reminisce Dolomites I think I know why hardly nobody in Italy wants to waste his time for pan flat rides

 

[Carrick-On-Seine]

Early start in Eritrea. Biniam Girmay takes ITT.