Teams & Riders Alberto Contador Discussion Thread

[Tonton]

Yes, it's Alberto Contador that we're talking about, so The Clinic's shadow is all over us. BTW, for those of you too young to remember, BigMig was an ET on a bike, something that only Wonderboy can compare with. Why do you think Libertine Seguros picked him first in the Fantasy Doping Draft? Luxembourg ITT anyone? Bertie is not in the same league. He's in the Ulle, Froome category IMO.

But looking forward, as it relates to the upcoming TdF, yes he's in the Froome category. The only one who can beat Dawg. Nairito won't go on an all-out attack mode like a Pantani, Nibali chickens out, end of story. Only Contador (or bad luck, or a nosy custom agent) can beat Froome in July.

I hope they all Beloki out of the race and Pinot wins .

 

[burning]

Yes, it's Alberto Contador that we're talking about, so The Clinic's shadow is all over us. BTW, for those of you too young to remember, BigMig was an ET on a bike, something that only Wonderboy can compare with. Why do you think Libertine Seguros picked him first in the Fantasy Doping Draft? Luxembourg ITT anyone? Bertie is not in the same league. He's in the Ulle, Froome category IMO.

But looking forward, as it relates to the upcoming TdF, yes he's in the Froome category. The only one who can beat Dawg. Nairito won't go on an all-out attack mode like a Pantani, Nibali chickens out, end of story. Only Contador (or bad luck, or a nosy custom agent) can beat Froome in July.

I hope they all Beloki out of the race and Pinot wins .

Are you still mad that I sniped your beloved French?

Here is how I would rank the GT riders considering absolute power:

Indurain


Riis/Ulle/Texan/Contador/Pantani
Berzin/Dawg/Basso/Rominger

 

[IndianCyclist]

In terms of raw power without assistance
Indurain = Cance = Ullrich = Wiggins = Martin ~ 480 w
Contador = Froome ~ 430
in terms of power/weight
Contador = Froome = Quintana = Pantani @ 6.2 w/kg (ref wt 70kg)
Ullrich = Wiggins @ 6.1
Indurain @ 5.9

But there are no 80+ kg GT riders. For a GT 50-72 kg is required @ 6.2 w/kg
Indurain would have won TT by 1-3 mins but IMO Contador would have dropped Indurain like a stone in the mountains by 2-5 mins per stage and won

 

[Brullnux]

Re:

In terms of raw power without assistance
Indurain = Cance = Ullrich = Wiggins = Martin ~ 480 w
Contador = Froome ~ 430
in terms of power/weight
Contador = Froome = Quintana = Pantani @ 6.2 w/kg (ref wt 70kg)
Ullrich = Wiggins @ 6.1
Indurain @ 5.9

But there are no 80+ kg GT riders. For a GT 50-72 kg is required @ 6.2 w/kg
Indurain would have won TT by 1-3 mins but IMO Contador would have dropped Indurain like a stone in the mountains by 2-5 mins per stage and won

2-5 minutes? Are you sure? The most accurate way of comparing them is times on climbs, and BigMig is pretty similar to Bertie on most of them.

Pantani still best climber, wonderboy best overall.

Edit: although I agree with Flo.

 

[LaFlorecita]

It's very simple, Indurain wouldn't be able to compete today, at 80kg and with stricter doping rules. So if he would race today, he wouldn't be 80kg but also very skinny and we can't say if he would be better or worse than Contador. Same goes for Contador, if we teleport him to the 90s he wouldn't be able to compete, but then if he had raced in those years he would have been a different rider. So bottom line is we can't compare riders from different eras, so why the hell is this discussion still going?

 

[PremierAndrew]

It's very simple, Indurain wouldn't be able to compete today, at 80kg and with stricter doping rules. So if he would race today, he wouldn't be 80kg but also very skinny and we can't say if he would be better or worse than Contador. Same goes for Contador, if we teleport him to the 90s he wouldn't be able to compete, but then if he had raced in those years he would have been a different rider. So bottom line is we can't compare riders from different eras, so why the hell is this discussion still going?

Because the season hasn't really started yet, so there's not much else to talk about

 

[dacooley]

even if parcours, length of the stages and clinic background were the same, what would've happened in a battle of contador and indurain is anyway a pure speculation.

 

[LaFlorecita]

It's very simple, Indurain wouldn't be able to compete today, at 80kg and with stricter doping rules. So if he would race today, he wouldn't be 80kg but also very skinny and we can't say if he would be better or worse than Contador. Same goes for Contador, if we teleport him to the 90s he wouldn't be able to compete, but then if he had raced in those years he would have been a different rider. So bottom line is we can't compare riders from different eras, so why the hell is this discussion still going?

Because the season hasn't really started yet, so there's not much else to talk about

Ah of course time for Alberto to post a picture on twitter again, so we can go back to speculating about his weight

 

[Tonton]

Are you still mad that I sniped your beloved French?

I still haven't got over it .

 

[jens_attacks]

Re:

even if parcours, length of the stages and clinic background were the same, what would've happened in a battle of contador and indurain is anyway a pure speculation.

until the tour de france-clone version, that is.

 

[KyoGrey]

Wow, there surely is some misunderstanding about Indurain's strengths in some posts.

Indurain's prowess was based on an absurdly high aerobic capacity, that combined with his power and endurance allowed him to be with the best in the mountains.

Indurain on top top form was 77-78 kg. And he was able to beat all type of rider builds, from Bugno, Chiapucci to to Rominger, Zulle to Virenque, Ugrumov or even cope with 20 kg lighter Pantani, who we all accept to be at least on par with Contador when climbing.

It really doesn't matter if he wasn't able to produce a peak of 6,2 W/kg for 20-30 min like Froome or Contador due to his weight. He would just grind you for 1 hour 15 min at an excruciating and constant 5,9 W/kg.

One could even make a bold case that Indurain could have won like half of his GT's even if there wasn't any ITT.

Please let's not talk about him as if he was fat.

 

[LaFlorecita]

It seems you are the one who is misunderstanding these posts. Most would agree that Indurain would beat Contador (and all other current GC riders). The point is (as has been pointed out 20 times) you can't compare riders from different eras. If Indurain had been born in 1985 he would have been a different rider and if Contador had been born in 1965 he would have been a different rider. Any comparison is based on nothing but speculation. We don't know what Indurain would be able to achieve in present day racing conditions.

 

[LaFlorecita]

From Alberto's comments it doesn't sound like he will ride la Vuelta
http://www.tinkoffteam.com/news/alberto-contador-vuelta-will-always-special-race/

 

[Carols]

I think half of these posts belong in the Indurain thread . Big Mig was awesome and he had his time in the sun and I loved every minute of it. Some thought he was boring, I appreciated his multi faceted skill set. He was unsurpassed in the ITT, he could climb and he was a wily racer. He was a Beast!!!

As the sun sets on the era of Contador I feel no need to compare the 2. They were/are both the best stage race riders of their times.

You just can't compare riders from different eras, it is always strictly speculation and bias at work.

 

[Tonton]

Great post. To me, the real debate should be: does Contador have enough left to beat Froome at the '16 TdF? He wasn't that great at last year's Giro, his best form as of recently was in the spring of '14 IMO. Two years. I think that he can do it.

 

[Carols]

Great post. To me, the real debate should be: does Contador have enough left to beat Froome at the '16 TdF? He wasn't that great at last year's Giro, his best form as of recently was in the spring of '14 IMO. Two years. I think that he can do it.

That is the Big question for 2016. Can Alberto regain his spring 2014 form and will he have a strong team able to support him? My opinion is he will find the form. The team I'm not that sure of, they seem to let him down quite often . His 2015 Giro would have been much more impressive if he'd had a team!

I think he'll be ready to slay dawgs for a living this July

 

[Mr.White]

Re:

I think half of these posts belong in the Indurain thread . Big Mig was awesome and he had his time in the sun and I loved every minute of it. Some thought he was boring, I appreciated his multi faceted skill set. He was unsurpassed in the ITT, he could climb and he was a wily racer. He was a Beast!!!

As the sun sets on the era of Contador I feel no need to compare the 2. They were/are both the best stage race riders of their times.

You just can't compare riders from different eras, it is always strictly speculation and bias at work.

You can compare them, compare their results, influence, dominance over the period of their own careers. You just can't compare who would beat who in some imaginary time and some imaginary races!!!

 

[Carols]

Re: Re:

I think half of these posts belong in the Indurain thread . Big Mig was awesome and he had his time in the sun and I loved every minute of it. Some thought he was boring, I appreciated his multi faceted skill set. He was unsurpassed in the ITT, he could climb and he was a wily racer. He was a Beast!!!

As the sun sets on the era of Contador I feel no need to compare the 2. They were/are both the best stage race riders of their times.

You just can't compare riders from different eras, it is always strictly speculation and bias at work.

You can compare them, compare their results, influence, dominance over the period of their own careers. You just can't compare who would beat who in some imaginary time and some imaginary races!!!

Sorry for not being clearer. I thought the bolded was exactly what was happening and therefore was implied.

 

[KyoGrey]

Re:

It seems you are the one who is misunderstanding these posts. Most would agree that Indurain would beat Contador (and all other current GC riders). The point is (as has been pointed out 20 times) you can't compare riders from different eras. If Indurain had been born in 1985 he would have been a different rider and if Contador had been born in 1965 he would have been a different rider. Any comparison is based on nothing but speculation. We don't know what Indurain would be able to achieve in present day racing conditions.

Oh, it could be that I am being too dramatic. It's just that posts like this...

I would say Bertie in top form would be way to much for Mig. IMO Only Chicken ,Schleck, Evans, Froome would stay in touching distance with a top form Bertie on a queen stage.
I think a early Armstrong was unbeatable followed by a eyeballs out Pantani from videos I have seen of him.
Before that era I have no idea its a job for the clinic to discuss.

...are so wrong that they tear my heart. I'm sorry. Cheers.

 

[rune1107]

http://sport.tv2.dk/2016-01-09-contador-maaske-tager-jeg-ogsaa-vueltaen

Contador considering to do the Vuelta. It would definitely be a glorious ending to his career, if he could do the Tour-Olympics-Vuelta triple.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re:

http://sport.tv2.dk/2016-01-09-contador-maaske-tager-jeg-ogsaa-vueltaen

Contador considering to do the Vuelta. It would definitely be a glorious ending to his career, if he could do the Tour-Olympics-Vuelta triple.

His comments on the team website (on the previous page) don't really read like he's really considering it, sounds more like the usual "I'm not ruling it out"

 

[damian13ster]

He will ride it only after losing the Tour, to salvage his season. Other than that I doubt he will try

 

[Angliru]

Re:

I think half of these posts belong in the Indurain thread . Big Mig was awesome and he had his time in the sun and I loved every minute of it. Some thought he was boring, I appreciated his multi faceted skill set. He was unsurpassed in the ITT, he could climb and he was a wily racer. He was a Beast!!!

As the sun sets on the era of Contador I feel no need to compare the 2. They were/are both the best stage race riders of their times.

You just can't compare riders from different eras, it is always strictly speculation and bias at work.

I'm in full agreement. Good post.

 

[Angliru]

Re: Re:

It seems you are the one who is misunderstanding these posts. Most would agree that Indurain would beat Contador (and all other current GC riders). The point is (as has been pointed out 20 times) you can't compare riders from different eras. If Indurain had been born in 1985 he would have been a different rider and if Contador had been born in 1965 he would have been a different rider. Any comparison is based on nothing but speculation. We don't know what Indurain would be able to achieve in present day racing conditions.

Oh, it could be that I am being too dramatic. It's just that posts like this...

I would say Bertie in top form would be way to much for Mig. IMO Only Chicken ,Schleck, Evans, Froome would stay in touching distance with a top form Bertie on a queen stage.
I think a early Armstrong was unbeatable followed by a eyeballs out Pantani from videos I have seen of him.
Before that era I have no idea its a job for the clinic to discuss.

...are so wrong that they tear my heart. I'm sorry. Cheers.

@Ray
Evans could at no point his career climb with a top form Contador. Andy could occasionally and Froome has been the only rider to match or surpass a top form Contador in the mountains (with
the exception of Rassmussen). Many have said Ricco could but I don't agree.

 

[Angliru]

He will ride it only after losing the Tour, to salvage his season. Other than that I doubt he will try

Then that means no Vuelta.