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Teams & Riders Alberto Contador Discussion Thread

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No, of course not. I'm sure he can reach a decent level next year, not as good as this year but without crashes it should be enough to get a top-5 at the Tour. It's the best we can hope for right now, he won't go for the Giro.[/quote]

Exactly. i think it's the common sense suggested it. Anyway don't be angry: today he makes a fatal mistake but he's not an idiot , i think he knew he didn't have the legs to chase Chaves , so decided to wait ,hoping Chaves blow up[/quote]

This. I was going to say the same thing. Yes, it was strange that Alberto didn't react to Chaves. But just like Cancellara in de Ronde, I guess Alberto didn't feel good enough to go 1 vs 1 and indeed gambled on Chaves paying for his efforts, while he could save a lot of energy.

That's cycling, mistakes happen.[/quote]
The tragic thing, seen from the point of view of these "aging" stars, is that they actually are good enough to go 1 v 1 - both in de Ronde and today. In the end it ends up being a tactical decision that proves costly[/quote]

Sagan was clearly better than Cancellara. Alberto, yes, maybe..[/quote]
Yet Cancellara was faster up Paterberg (Sorry. Irrelevant to this thread), and Contador also closed down 30 sec on Chaves. Added to that there is no point in the race where Alberto has lost the wheel of Chaves when he's attacked. Typically, Chaves has been allowed to break free, as it was the case today
 
Jan 24, 2012
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Ricco' said:
Next year, Contador should go for GC at the 100th Giro and focus on stages and polka dot at the Tour.

Given the risks and rewards involved, I think this option it's safest and prestigious too, instead of risking it all at the Tour and being a level below the top tier.
Contador in the Polka Dots would be pretty cool to see.
 
Re: Re:

DFA123 said:
If he did that expecting Movistar to 'repay' a favour later in the race, then he's clueless.
Well, normally when you earn favors, they are repaid at some point. Tiralongo earned favors as a domestique for Contador, which Contador repaid by helping him win a stage at the Giro. This in return earned Contador favors. Tiralongo repaid them by helping him win a Vuelta. That's how it normally goes, and it also works the other way around. If you're going around being a jerk, for example attacking when someone has crashed, don't be surprised if it backfires at some point. The peloton remembers.
After seeing how friendly Quintana was with Contador after stage 15 I had expected a little help at least, of course, silly me, Movistar/Valverde would never give him even an inch. Lot of bad blood between them. Guess the rumors of Contador negotiating a contract with Movistar can be tossed into the bin.
 
Re: Re:

Sciocco said:
Ricco' said:
Next year, Contador should go for GC at the 100th Giro and focus on stages and polka dot at the Tour.

Given the risks and rewards involved, I think this option it's safest and prestigious too, instead of risking it all at the Tour and being a level below the top tier.
Contador in the Polka Dots would be pretty cool to see.

I like this idea too and he could still be billed as a protected rider at the Tour so that Trek would get the marketing value from that while in reality he could support Mollema and go for polka dots.
 
Re: Re:

LaFlorecita said:
DFA123 said:
If he did that expecting Movistar to 'repay' a favour later in the race, then he's clueless.
Well, normally when you earn favors, they are repaid at some point. Tiralongo earned favors as a domestique for Contador, which Contador repaid by helping him win a stage at the Giro. This in return earned Contador favors. Tiralongo repaid them by helping him win a Vuelta. That's how it normally goes, and it also works the other way around. If you're going around being a jerk, for example attacking when someone has crashed, don't be surprised if it backfires at some point. The peloton remembers.
After seeing how friendly Quintana was with Contador after stage 15 I had expected a little help at least, of course, silly me, Movistar/Valverde would never give him even an inch. Lot of bad blood between them. Guess the rumors of Contador negotiating a contract with Movistar can be tossed into the bin.
That's ridiculous. Sure, if it was a nothing stage where Movistar didn't have much to ride for, it would have been good of them to put in a bit of a chase for him.

But it was Movistar's biggest stage of the year; they had to be 100% focused on one thing - controlling Froome. Absolutely clueless of Contador to expect them to be handing out favours and needlessly wasting energy in that situation.
 
Re: Re:

LaFlorecita said:
DFA123 said:
If he did that expecting Movistar to 'repay' a favour later in the race, then he's clueless.
Well, normally when you earn favors, they are repaid at some point. Tiralongo earned favors as a domestique for Contador, which Contador repaid by helping him win a stage at the Giro. This in return earned Contador favors. Tiralongo repaid them by helping him win a Vuelta. That's how it normally goes, and it also works the other way around. If you're going around being a jerk, for example attacking when someone has crashed, don't be surprised if it backfires at some point. The peloton remembers.
After seeing how friendly Quintana was with Contador after stage 15 I had expected a little help at least, of course, silly me, Movistar/Valverde would never give him even an inch. Lot of bad blood between them. Guess the rumors of Contador negotiating a contract with Movistar can be tossed into the bin.

Don't underestimate the fact that Chaves is Colombian either.
 
Re:

Ricco' said:
Next year, Contador should go for GC at the 100th Giro and focus on stages and polka dot at the Tour.

Given the risks and rewards involved, I think this option it's safest and prestigious too, instead of risking it all at the Tour and being a level below the top tier.
Agree, but I'm afraid either his pride or his team will force him to go for GC at the Tour... :(
 
Re: Re:

LaFlorecita said:
DFA123 said:
If he did that expecting Movistar to 'repay' a favour later in the race, then he's clueless.
Well, normally when you earn favors, they are repaid at some point. Tiralongo earned favors as a domestique for Contador, which Contador repaid by helping him win a stage at the Giro. This in return earned Contador favors. Tiralongo repaid them by helping him win a Vuelta. That's how it normally goes, and it also works the other way around. If you're going around being a jerk, for example attacking when someone has crashed, don't be surprised if it backfires at some point. The peloton remembers.
After seeing how friendly Quintana was with Contador after stage 15 I had expected a little help at least, of course, silly me, Movistar/Valverde would never give him even an inch. Lot of bad blood between them. Guess the rumors of Contador negotiating a contract with Movistar can be tossed into the bin.

To be honest I don't think Movistar were necessarily adverse to helping Contador if they could but I think they just saw Froome as too big a threat and felt they needed all their reserves for a possible Sky assault.
 
Re: Re:

LaFlorecita said:
DFA123 said:
If he did that expecting Movistar to 'repay' a favour later in the race, then he's clueless.
Well, normally when you earn favors, they are repaid at some point. Tiralongo earned favors as a domestique for Contador, which Contador repaid by helping him win a stage at the Giro. This in return earned Contador favors. Tiralongo repaid them by helping him win a Vuelta. That's how it normally goes, and it also works the other way around. If you're going around being a jerk, for example attacking when someone has crashed, don't be surprised if it backfires at some point. The peloton remembers.
After seeing how friendly Quintana was with Contador after stage 15 I had expected a little help at least, of course, silly me, Movistar/Valverde would never give him even an inch. Lot of bad blood between them. Guess the rumors of Contador negotiating a contract with Movistar can be tossed into the bin.

It is a race for win, not a charity sunday stroll. Stage 15 they had common interest, today Movistar had no need what-so-ever to bring Chaves back. Why would they spend energy to do so and not focus on winning the race with the tactics selected?
 
Re: Re:

DFA123 said:
That's ridiculous. Sure, if it was a nothing stage where Movistar didn't have much to ride for, it would have been good of them to put in a bit of a chase for him.

But it was Movistar's biggest stage of the year; they had to be 100% focused on one thing - controlling Froome. Absolutely clueless of Contador to expect them to be handing out favours and needlessly wasting energy in that situation.
Yes, everything he does, everything he says, everything he decides is clueless, idiotic, stupid, ridiculous, childish in your eyes. We get it.
 
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roundabout said:
Contador rode for his GC as much as Quintana's. Why should Movistar ride for Contador's GC when Chaves is not a threat to them?
Edit: what hrotha wrote
Before Formigal Quintana was 3:28 ahead of Contador but just 00:54 ahead of Froome. Quintana was the largest beneficiary there and without Contador it would not have succeeded. In this stage they had enough numbers to chase Chaves without trouble. Also it was Contador who was urging the riders to cooperate and the other riders other than Movistar cooperated. If Tinkoff stopped working, all other riders stop working
 
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bambino said:
It is a race for win, not a charity sunday stroll. Stage 15 they had common interest, today Movistar had no need what-so-ever to bring Chaves back. Why would they spend energy to do so and not focus on winning the race with the tactics selected?
Oh they didn't have to, it is a race after all, I just feel it would have looked good on them if they'd helped Contador just the tiniest bit. Because, you know, without Contador and Tinkoff they wouldn't even have won the race. But it is what it is, Movistar continues to alienate other teams and competitors. It's nothing new. Don't be surprised when we see Contador chasing down Valverde or lending Froome a hand in beating Quintana next year.
 
Re: Re:

LaFlorecita said:
DFA123 said:
That's ridiculous. Sure, if it was a nothing stage where Movistar didn't have much to ride for, it would have been good of them to put in a bit of a chase for him.

But it was Movistar's biggest stage of the year; they had to be 100% focused on one thing - controlling Froome. Absolutely clueless of Contador to expect them to be handing out favours and needlessly wasting energy in that situation.
Yes, everything he does, everything he says, everything he decides is clueless, idiotic, stupid, ridiculous, childish in your eyes. We get it.
Don't be childish about it. He's made a few tactical errors this race - it's fair game to discuss them.
 
Re: Re:

IndianCyclist said:
roundabout said:
Contador rode for his GC as much as Quintana's. Why should Movistar ride for Contador's GC when Chaves is not a threat to them?
Edit: what hrotha wrote
Before Formigal Quintana was 3:28 ahead of Contador but just 00:54 ahead of Froome. Quintana was the largest beneficiary there and without Contador it would not have succeeded. In this stage they had enough numbers to chase Chaves without trouble.

And without Movistar Contador wouldn't have moved up from 6th to 4th with a chance of 2nd.

Edit: again, they owe him nothing from that stage
 
Re: Re:

LaFlorecita said:
bambino said:
It is a race for win, not a charity sunday stroll. Stage 15 they had common interest, today Movistar had no need what-so-ever to bring Chaves back. Why would they spend energy to do so and not focus on winning the race with the tactics selected?
Oh they didn't have to, it is a race after all, I just feel it would have looked good on them if they'd helped Contador just the tiniest bit. Because, you know, without Contador and Tinkoff they wouldn't even have won the race. But it is what it is, Movistar continues to alienate other teams and competitors. It's nothing new. Don't be surprised when we see Contador chasing down Valverde or lending Froome a hand in beating Quintana next year.
Movistar will probably just ally with Gallopin and Astana and all the other villains in the peloton. :rolleyes:
 
Aug 6, 2015
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Re: Re:

LaFlorecita said:
portugal11 said:
The difference between contador and 99% of the peloton (froome inclued) is that contador enjoys winning and being competitive and the others enjoy riding his bike
???
He doens't enjoy riding his bike like the others. He was 6 months banned and he never reached his monster shape again.
 
Re: Re:

LaFlorecita said:
bambino said:
It is a race for win, not a charity sunday stroll. Stage 15 they had common interest, today Movistar had no need what-so-ever to bring Chaves back. Why would they spend energy to do so and not focus on winning the race with the tactics selected?
Oh they didn't have to, it is a race after all, I just feel it would have looked good on them if they'd helped Contador just the tiniest bit. Because, you know, without Contador and Tinkoff they wouldn't even have won the race. But it is what it is, Movistar continues to alienate other teams and competitors. It's nothing new. Don't be surprised when we see Contador chasing down Valverde or lending Froome a hand in beating Quintana next year.

Oh and he is perfectly allowed to do that, it would be entirely his own decision and we should respect it. Like Astana's decision was to pull on Stage 15.

Btw. When looking back to history, remeber that you can't say that everything would've happened exactly how we saw it happening if something changed in proceeding. Therefore you cannot say Movistar won just because of Contador, without that break and 2 minutes they gained, the last 5 stages would"ve looked completely different and we will never know what the end result would have been.
 
Re: Re:

Sciocco said:
Ricco' said:
Next year, Contador should go for GC at the 100th Giro and focus on stages and polka dot at the Tour.

Given the risks and rewards involved, I think this option it's safest and prestigious too, instead of risking it all at the Tour and being a level below the top tier.
Contador in the Polka Dots would be pretty cool to see.
I don't see him losing time on purpose though, he'll have too much of a "what if" feeling if he doesn't try. So yeah, I don't really see it happening

Hopefully his new team will talk some sense into him. He really should go for the Giro/Vuelta double. However, it would be a hard decision between publicity or results for the team and sponsors.
 
Re: Re:

LaFlorecita said:
bambino said:
It is a race for win, not a charity sunday stroll. Stage 15 they had common interest, today Movistar had no need what-so-ever to bring Chaves back. Why would they spend energy to do so and not focus on winning the race with the tactics selected?
Oh they didn't have to, it is a race after all, I just feel it would have looked good on them if they'd helped Contador just the tiniest bit. Because, you know, without Contador and Tinkoff they wouldn't even have won the race. But it is what it is, Movistar continues to alienate other teams and competitors. It's nothing new. Don't be surprised when we see Contador chasing down Valverde or lending Froome a hand in beating Quintana next year.
ou are caught up in emotions right now.

They helped the tiniest bit. Valverde actually pulled for a couple of kilometres, so did Castro, but I know what you mean.

Thats speculative. Froome was the favourite at that point after Aubisque, but not by much. Quintana would have had Formigal, Costa and Aitana left to gain 1.20 assuming Froome would still win that much time in the ITT - not unreasonable.

I think Contador is reasonable and he would understand, it was in the heat of the moment. As I've said before, it was Chaves of all people, a Colombian countrymen.. you just don't chase him down if you are Quintana. It shouldn't necessarily come as a surprise to you that Valverde maybe would've preferred not to chase. So the team's 2 biggest riders have reason not to be overly eager.
 
Re: Re:

roundabout said:
IndianCyclist said:
roundabout said:
Contador rode for his GC as much as Quintana's. Why should Movistar ride for Contador's GC when Chaves is not a threat to them?
Edit: what hrotha wrote
Before Formigal Quintana was 3:28 ahead of Contador but just 00:54 ahead of Froome. Quintana was the largest beneficiary there and without Contador it would not have succeeded. In this stage they had enough numbers to chase Chaves without trouble.

And without Movistar Contador wouldn't have moved up from 6th to 4th with a chance of 2nd.

Edit: again, they owe him nothing from that stage
What? Contador finished 4th, over 3 minutes ahead of 5th. That means he would have been 4th regardless of that stage.
 
Re: Re:

LaFlorecita said:
roundabout said:
IndianCyclist said:
roundabout said:
Contador rode for his GC as much as Quintana's. Why should Movistar ride for Contador's GC when Chaves is not a threat to them?
Edit: what hrotha wrote
Before Formigal Quintana was 3:28 ahead of Contador but just 00:54 ahead of Froome. Quintana was the largest beneficiary there and without Contador it would not have succeeded. In this stage they had enough numbers to chase Chaves without trouble.

And without Movistar Contador wouldn't have moved up from 6th to 4th with a chance of 2nd.

Edit: again, they owe him nothing from that stage
What? Contador finished 4th, over 3 minutes ahead of 5th. That means he would have been 4th regardless of that stage.

What yourself.

They gave him a chance to finish second. Doesn't mean that they have to ride for him on every stage after if he isn't good enough to take it.
 
Re: Re:

portugal11 said:
LaFlorecita said:
portugal11 said:
The difference between contador and 99% of the peloton (froome inclued) is that contador enjoys winning and being competitive and the others enjoy riding his bike
???
He doens't enjoy riding his bike like the others. He was 6 months banned and he never reached his monster shape again.
That is nonsense.

I'll give you this quote, I'm sure you'll understand as a Portuguese
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