Teams & Riders Alberto Contador Discussion Thread

[Netserk]

If its all about endurance how comes he won the opening stage of Pais Vasco before and how comes he creamed everyone on Catalunya in stage 3

I doubt those stages were more than 230km, not to mention 270km.

 

[Red Rick]

I hope the Ponferrada WC course will be very hard, he'll want to give it a serious shot and I hope he'll be the Contador of old when it happens

 

[The Hitch]

Hitch, you're don't realise that the hill at the worlds is only 6% average for 4km. GdL had a HC climb in the beginning and Muro di Sormano 50km from the finish, which is enough to make sure there are only climbers left.

Yeah but the field is weaker. And people care less.

Look at the olympics. As anything other than the olympic or worlds rr that would have been a sprint 100 times out of 100. The 2 other times that course (or somehting like it) was done (albeit shorter) its been a sprint all the way.

But because it was road race you had guys like Canc, Gilbert Menchov, Gesink attack 100k out.

4k at 6% isnt much but since they do it what is it, 11 times or something it is going to take its toll.

I wouldnt have expected Contador to win by attacking on it, but for repeated ascents, raced hard, to simply take their toll on everyone, and Contador, as the best climber in the world behind Froome, would in top shape

 

[The Hitch]

I doubt those stages were more than 230km, not to mention 270km.

I meant recovery not endurance. If its all about recovery how can he win stages so early like that?

 

[The Hitch]

I hope the Ponferrada WC course will be very hard, he'll want to give it a serious shot and I hope he'll be the Contador of old when it happens

This is what was making the rounds when they won the hosting.

Firenze would suit Contador more imo. A lot more.

 

[Netserk]

To try and explain this to you in races you might recollect. Contador rode the 2012 GDL. THat race was won by J Rodriguez who you say is a favourite because he can sprint a little. Purito won solo after attacking on the hill 9k out from the finish. In Firenze its not 9k to the finish from the final hill but 5km. If Rodriguez can win solo a race which has 9k of flat at the end, how is a harder race with less flat at the end a guaranteed bunch sprint?

The final hill in Firenze is 600m @ 10%.

Compared to this:

@ Underlined:

There was 2.8km of flat in the end of Lombardia.

 

[The Hitch]

yes, youve made that point. Its white noise to me though, which is why i ignored it the first time, because I was adressing the flat that comes after it due to La Flo's obsession with how many km of flat are at the end being the true measure of how hard a course is.

 

[LaFlorecita]

yes, youve made that point. Its white noise to me though, which is why i ignored it the first time, because I was adressing the flat that comes after it due to La Flo's obsession with how many km of flat are at the end being the true measure of how hard a course is.

Wut you mentioned x km of flat not me.

 

[LaFlorecita]

This is what was making the rounds when they won the hosting.

Firenze would suit Contador more imo. A lot more.

Why?

..........

 

[Netserk]

Here you have the last 16.75km of both races (remember the difference on the y-axis):

Firenze:

Lombardia:

 

[The Hitch]

Why?

..........

Because it is a lot harder.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Because it is a lot harder.

The entire race or just the circuit? The circuit doesn't seem much easier.

 

[The Hitch]

The entire race or just the circuit? The circuit doesn't seem much easier.

Well you cant really read that much into the profile since they dont show the %'s but I remember the discussions at the time said it wasn't that hard a route, maybe a bit tougher than last year, but that its a bit of a waste of a great location

http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?t=15926

You even took part in the thread, asking why they didn't go for the harder option

 

[LaFlorecita]

Well you cant really read that much into the profile since they dont show the %'s but I remember the discussions at the time said it wasn't that hard a route, maybe a bit tougher than last year, but that its a bit of a waste of a great location

http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?t=15926

You even took part in the thread, asking why they didn't go for the harder option

Hmm I don't know. It does seem hard but not as hard as Firenze. But the downhill suits Alberto I think, if he could get a small gap on the ascent he could keep it on the descent. Not vs Nibali or Sagan of course. I think he doesn't have a big chance on either course but for next year I am hoping he can improve somewhat. It would be sad if he'd never get to wear the rainbow stripes.

 

[The Hitch]

yeah it would be sad.

fortunately this years worlds course is the hardest in decades, geared for climbers like Contador to get their 1 big final chance at weari...

Oh wait

 

[Netserk]

yeah it would be sad.

fortunately this years worlds course is the hardest in decades, geared for climbers like Contador to get their 1 big final chance at weari...

Oh wait

Unlike 2009 (where he'd have a *much* better chance to win it, with that form he had that year) he actually participate in this year's worlds.

 

[LaFlorecita]

yeah it would be sad.

fortunately this years worlds course is the hardest in decades, geared for climbers like Contador to get their 1 big final chance at weari...

Oh wait

I know, it's unfortunate that when there's finally a suited course his form is ****.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Unlike 2009 (where he'd have a *much* better chance to win it, with that form he had that year) he actually participate in this year's worlds.

Agreed. He should have tried in 2009. He's pretty stupid.

 

[Angliru]

I think a Contador in giro 2011 form would have a very big chance to win it unless like hitch said you've a devolder scenario or contador rides like an idiot.

We've never even seen Contador in top shape in a classic. In 2010 he had an ok shape in LBL and with some luck he might have won that.

I believe he was in, or close to, top form the year he made the podium at Fleche Wallone.

At all of those, primarily Hitch, that have a problem with his focus being on the Tour, all I can say is: why is that a surprise? He's a stage racer and more specifically a grand tour gc contender. As one of the best in his discipline why wouldn't he focus on the sport's marque event? I think also that many here are creating drama where there is none. Contador said it's all about the Tour which is the same as Boonen saying it's all about PR and RVV. It's not to say that he/they won't be competitive in other races, which in Contador's case he has always been and continues to be just to a lesser degree of success lately.

It appears that some are arranging scenarios and circumstances to support their perspective which is to continue to tear down a rider who is going through a down period in their productivity, this after years of great success. Still whining about being "lied to" and that a rider "bluffed" about his form to hang on to the team's leadership, making his team work for goals that were, in the eyes of those (Hitch/Miburo) that strangely feel cheated in some way, knowingly/selfishly unattainable. These same folks have taken all leave of anylogic and in its place is some personal crusade of whining and crying of having their expectations driven off of a cliff by the evil deception that originated in the diabolical mind of Alberto Contador.

Once again certain people are injecting their own personal preferences of what a rider should do to further their place in the sport's history and place themselves among the greats. They bring up certain grand tour riders that have done fairly well in classics to support their argument that Contador should (or should have) give(n) the classics a real try to cement his place among the established greats. Is it possible that his stellar grand tour record is a result of his own personal strategy of focusing on stage races because that is where he believed he would find the most success? Should he be raked across the coals because his idea of success and how to go about reaching it is different?

Seems many are confusing real life with video games. Things were going along well when the rider was winning while they were on board. It made them feel and look great when their predictions were supported by the riders success. The moment the rider stumbles and doesn't live up to the "over-the-top" support that was given, the rider is tossed in the trashbin for having the audacity of dreaming that they could maintain their level of success. All the power figures and pre-race training numbers (comparable to the values given for the various categories that measure a riders success in these same games) don't change the fact that the race still has to take place and sometimes the best preparation in the world doesn't result in the ideal conclusion to the race.

 

[LaFlorecita]

I believe he was in, or close to, top form the year he made the podium at Fleche Wallone.

At all of those, primarily Hitch, that have a problem with his focus being on the Tour, all I can say is: why is that a surprise? He's a stage racer and more specifically a grand tour gc contender. As one of the best in his discipline why wouldn't he focus on the sport's marque event? I think also that many here are creating drama where there is none. Contador said it's all about the Tour which is the same as Boonen saying it's all about PR and RVV. It's not to say that he/they won't be competitive in other races, which in Contador's case he has always been and continues to be just to a lesser degree of success lately.

It appears that some are arranging scenarios and circumstances to support their perspective which is to continue to tear down a rider who is going through a down period in their productivity, this after years of great success. Still whining about being "lied to" and that a rider "bluffed" about his form to hang on to the team's leadership, making his team work for goals that were, in the eyes of those (Hitch/Miburo) that strangely feel cheated in some way, knowingly/selfishly unattainable. These same folks have taken all leave of anylogic and in its place is some personal crusade of whining and crying of having their expectations driven off of a cliff by the evil deception that originated in the diabolical mind of Alberto Contador.

Once again certain people are injecting their own personal preferences of what a rider should do to further their place in the sport's history and place themselves among the greats. They bring up certain grand tour riders that have done fairly well in classics to support their argument that Contador should (or should have) give(n) the classics a real try to cement his place among the established greats. Is it possible that his stellar grand tour record is a result of his own personal strategy of focusing on stage races because that is where he believed he would find the most success? Should he be raked across the coals because his idea of success and how to go about reaching it is different?

Seems many are confusing real life with video games. Things were going along well when the rider was winning while they were on board. It made them feel and look great when their predictions were supported by the riders success. The moment the rider stumbles and doesn't live up to the "over-the-top" support that was given, the rider is tossed in the trashbin for having the audacity of dreaming that they could maintain their level of success. All the power figures and pre-race training numbers (comparable to the values given for the various categories that measure a riders success in these same games) don't change the fact that the race still has to take place and sometimes the best preparation in the world doesn't result in the ideal conclusion to the race.

Angliru, a very well-written post, +1. Sums up my thoughts. Of course I can't express them as well as you can in English.

 

[The Hitch]

I believe he was in, or close to, top form the year he made the podium at Fleche Wallone.

At all of those, primarily Hitch, that have a problem with his focus being on the Tour, all I can say is: why is that a surprise? He's a stage racer and more specifically a grand tour gc contender. As one of the best in his discipline why wouldn't he focus on the sport's marque event?

Which isn't saying much. Its a very stupid comment and the essay you wrote afterwards will prove to have been just a waste of your time.

There is a very obvious difference between focusing on the Tour de France like Contador has done for most of his career, and focusing ONLY on the Tour de France at the expense of all other races which hypocrites like you used to critisice Andy Schleck for but dont have the balls to do to riders you like.

Or at least I thought it was hypocricy. Judging by your inability to distinguish between the 2, it could just be ignorance.

 

[murali]

+1 Angliru

fair point/

the point that was made by a few(including me) was that he could have done all that others wanted if he had focused on that.


he is who he is. and he is great.

 

[Netserk]

Which isn't saying much. Its a very stupid comment and the essay you wrote afterwards will prove to have been just a waste of your time.

There is a very obvious difference between focusing on the Tour de France like Contador has done for most of his career, and focusing ONLY on the Tour de France at the expense of all other races which hypocrites like you used to critisice Andy Schleck for but dont have the balls to do to riders you like.

Or at least I thought it was hypocricy. Judging by your inability to distinguish between the 2, it could just be ignorance.

When was the last time Andy ended better in T-A(or any one-week race) than the Tour? (where he did reasonable well)

I don't know if you remember, but Contador did better in the GC in T-A and Oman than he did in the Tour....

 

[murali]

There is a very obvious difference between focusing on the Tour de France like Contador has done for most of his career, and focusing ONLY on the Tour de France at the expense of all other races which hypocrites like you used to critisice Andy Schleck for but dont have the balls to do to riders you like.

with respect to andy schleck, let us be a bit objective. he seems to be in good form only for that small TdF window. Andy could have been much more, if he was having a sports psychology consultant. despite what AS has achieved, you still look at him as a could-have-been great.

AC's case is different.

 

[The Hitch]

Contador Oman was still when he was The Great One. He attacked far out on that stage and even though he lost that stage narrowly, there was a lot to admire.