Teams & Riders Alberto Contador Discussion Thread

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Jul 19, 2010
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I think, TS needs domestiques.. very, very good one that don't want to be a star or leader. Sky seemed to have a knack of finding them, even movistar too. Roche is good rider, maybe we kept saying he is not a good domestique because we expect him more than just falling off the waist side when sky starts punching the gas. I expected him to stay as the last man with contador and kreuziger, but last year he wasn't doing that. Even in the Giro, instead of shepherding Majka, he kept going in breakaway with no result, because he was lacked of form or no luck or timing or whatever the problem was. If he was a GC contender and he went on the break, he should have stronger than his companion? no? Turn out it was Mickey who was the one stayed with Majka. What's wrong with that equation? I thought he was co-captain with Majka so techically he either was the strongest on the team or he was the second strongest. Or is it just based on his name?

So TDF, not so sure what to think of Roche. Because we expect him to stay there with nieve, porte, froome, kreuziger and contador. If he can't even match nieve, forget about it. As a domestique, he is expected to perform far ahead of Jesus and paulinho. On paper, he should be stronger than them. But on the road, is another story..:p
 
Jul 25, 2011
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IMO Tinkoff-Saxo has a big hole between their best climbers (AC, RK, Rogers, Roche and Majka) and the second line, those whose rol never will be a captain.

Oleg must get someone in the market, Mikel Nieve, for example, was going to be a great signing as he has showed at SKY.

About Roche I see him more useful at middle-mountain stages than the big climbs.
 
Forunculo said:
IMO Tinkoff-Saxo has a big hole between their best climbers (AC, RK, Rogers, Roche and Majka) and the second line, those whose rol never will be a captain.

Oleg must get someone in the market, Mikel Nieve, for example, was going to be a great signing as he has showed at SKY.

About Roche I see him more useful at middle-mountain stages than the big climbs.
Isnt CAS in the middle ground,or is he crap nowadays?
 
Jul 25, 2011
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Hakkapelit said:
Isnt CAS in the middle ground,or is he crap nowadays?
Unfortunately CAS never showed that he can be a solid helper, neither Jesus Hernandez, Paulinho is old. David Navarro was, but logically he was given the chance to be a leader at other team.

The main weakness for Tinkoff-Saxo at stage races is that second line, and it's where Oleg should splash out the money.

Obviously if you bring to the same race Contador, Kreuziger, Roche, Majka and Rogers it's a strong line up, but it's not possible.
 
May 24, 2010
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inthepink said:
1. Roche rode very well for Contador last Tour except his climbing form wasn't there ....IT usually takes him ages ot get to form and is in his 2nd GT he is at his best...But there was no denying he was committed to Contador...In the stage in Aux 3 Dom he blew chasing leaders across the valley (which he caught) . He rode his heart out on stage 13 .. He chased on Mountains stages to be up there ...totally ridiculous to suggest he should be left at home

2. The reason TCS hasn't better domestiques is money....Bjarne didn't have it till too late last year and most riders gone by then Also Contador has highest salary in peloton so hard ot afford anyone prior to that...So mayeb if Contador not paid so much last year could have afforded more domestiques last year

3.Riders like Kreuziger need to be given a chance to ride for himself and is doing so in TdeSuisse so team at Dauphine couldn't be helped but punters vile about them on social media...wihtout knowing what happened at beginning of the stage

4. People here are also writing Froome off too soon....Its a long Tour and you do it at your peril....he is a tremendous rider and will not give it up easily and can TT better than Contador

5. Valverde will also be a major threat as will Garmin

6. Majka wanting to ride the Vuelata and not the Tour is him NOT thinking about himself as you accuse Roche of.....rubbish

7. Last year after the Tour I seem to remember people writing Contador off and saying he is too old , past it etc.. Same people now think he is invincible...Cycling should teach the 'experts' on here that nothing is certain or constant
You must be cycling_mad to come up with that lot.... ;0)
 
Jul 11, 2013
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Forunculo said:
Unfortunately CAS never showed that he can be a solid helper, neither Jesus Hernandez, Paulinho is old. David Navarro was, but logically he was given the chance to be a leader at other team.

The main weakness for Tinkoff-Saxo at stage races is that second line, and it's where Oleg should splash out the money.

Obviously if you bring to the same race Contador, Kreuziger, Roche, Majka and Rogers it's a strong line up, but it's not possible.
Pardon me.. But why is this not possible?

Majka is the only one not officilally considered for the Tour.. Granted...

As it stands right now, AC may have the best/last chance to win the Tour, if He brings the best possible line-up..(young people coming from behind -Kelderman,Talansky and a possibly decimated CF)
So why not drop conventional thinking and bring an in-form Majka who has been resting after the giro as far as i know... (He should be able to to well despite racing the Giro, and if they give ham a long break afterwards he should also not suffer long term)

If Majka was totally out of the picture they would have said so officially allready?

I know that they can't put all the eggs in the same basket(TDF) however a win in the tour for AC would mean the world, not only to him but all the people working for this since his arrival at TS...
I for one would bet that nothing else matters this year, given the opening that Dauphiné proved to be...

If Majka could be the fether in the basket to turn the balance and provide the advantage towards AC, they will bring him....
 
To add on to the Roche subject, I found it truly awful how him and Rogers went with the attack on the stage to Zoncolan after Majka had been sick in the days before. Good for them I guess that Rovny and Poljanski had their best day in the Giro that day.

Roche isn't really a strong climber usually. His results in mountain stages in the Tour have been with five or six team mates helping him until the last mountain where he has then been able to finish around 20th place. Then last year he was all of a sudden like 30 percent than ever before in the Vuelta and in the Giro he was just a his normal/usual level.

The last few posts are nonsense, no offense. Nobody needs a team with eight climbers. Contador's problems, if he have any, in the Tour will not be about team strength whoever will be selected.

And when he is a helper CAS has been able to stay with the leaders until and including much of the last mountain ever since his first years as a professional.
 
Jul 11, 2013
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ciranda said:
To add on to the Roche subject, I found it truly awful how him and Rogers went with the attack on the stage to Zoncolan after Majka had been sick in the days before. Good for them I guess that Rovny and Poljanski had their best day in the Giro that day.

Roche isn't really a strong climber usually. His results in mountain stages in the Tour have been with five or six team mates helping him until the last mountain where he has then been able to finish around 20th place. Then last year he was all of a sudden like 30 percent than ever before in the Vuelta and in the Giro he was just a his normal/usual level.

The last few posts are nonsense, no offense. Nobody needs a team with eight climbers. Contador's problems, if he have any, in the Tour will not be about team strength whoever will be selected.

And when he is a helper CAS has been able to stay with the leaders until and including much of the last mountain ever since his first years as a professional.
How did you come to that conclusion? Who said that?
Quote please if I missed it??
Using the term "the last few posts" is rather inconcrete and only offensive, despite your claim "no offense"

I am happy to discuss whether my post is nonsense but you have to be more specific and not make things up about other posters "bottom line" which is only your take on it...

I think he needs a strong team in every aspect, and if Majka could prove usefull (more than others) in the mountains, they should bring him..

Futhermore I would happily sacrafice Paulinho for Morkov or Matti..
Last years Tour also showed us that a difference can be maid in all parts of the race (referring to the ST taem attack in the sidewind)

Roche seems to be a integrated part of the team, that is not likely to be pulled despite the fact that he may be mediocre (as well as JH...)

The point beeing that maybe they bring riders not only because of strength but also to make the pieces "fit each other" to boost morale etc...

IMO CAS has allways had the mule role trying to reduce the field and never really been able to make a rel difference in terms of throwing off a rival??
 
May 24, 2010
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Such a lot to read...being without a laptop is murder, anyway....

The Dauphine - Yeah TCS wasn't the best team but we should have expected that after the strong team put out at the Giro, every race can't have the best team. Either way it was a brilliant race for Alberto despite the team, he came away with exactly what he needed for the tour.

Don't believe the criticism for losing the MJ on Sunday... he did what he had to do, marked the strongest rival attacked and beat him, he put in a herculean effort to get back but he didn't that's racing; chapeau Talansky for taking advantage.

Berto is now stuck in Fwoomies head...he know Berto is immensley strong right now and showing he is the best stage racer of the year so far, that was the whole point of last week to test himself against Froome.

The team - you need to blood less capable riders in WT events at some point and the team wasn't so bad just not capable of churning out the watts that they experienced last week, I suspect they did their best.

The Tour team - Where does Berto need most help, after the showing on Sunday specifically he needs no one but at the Tour Roman will be key. I think more relevant is a team around him who can handle the pace on the rolling stages, that is more important, you can't win it on those stages but you can lose it

Either way..... last week was a phenominal heads up for the tour!!
 
Jul 25, 2011
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mrhender said:
Pardon me.. But why is this not possible?
Because of the calendar, if Majka did the Giro and has to help AC at the Vuelta, Roche and Rogers did the Giro too and are resting to go to France, and Kreuziger is in Swiss, Contador needs a couple of solid helpers at Dauphine, not stars but people who can offer some help.

If you think that a world tour team leaving alone their leader with 100 km to go in a 130 km stage is something normal just because the other captains are in other races you are wrong.

To sum up my point, it doesn't matter if the captains are in other races/calendar, that's normal and it's positive. But the main captain should have at least a couple of solid helpers at his service in every race he ride. That's my point of view;)
 
Jul 11, 2013
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Forunculo said:
Because of the calendar, if Majka did the Giro and has to help AC at the Vuelta, Roche and Rogers did the Giro too and are resting to go to France, and Kreuziger is in Swiss, Contador needs a couple of solid helpers at Dauphine, not stars but people who can offer some help.

If you think that a world tour team leaving alone their leader with 100 km to go in a 130 km stage is something normal just because the other captains are in other races you are wrong.

To sum up my point, it doesn't matter if the captains are in other races/calendar, that's normal and it's positive. But the main captain should have at least a couple of solid helpers at his service in every race he ride. That's my point of view;)
Maybe I was to quick as my comment was referring to the Tour line-up..

I perfectly understand the line up in the Dauphiné so I might misread your post..
And the last part of your post I couldn't agree with more :)
 
mrhender said:
How did you come to that conclusion? Who said that?
IMO CAS has allways had the mule role trying to reduce the field and never really been able to make a rel difference in terms of throwing off a rival??

Not about your points, it was Forunculo's ideas about second line I found strange.

mrhender said:
IMO CAS has allways had the mule role trying to reduce the field and never really been able to make a rel difference in terms of throwing off a rival??
That's what every helper in the mountains does, no? If he could ride away from Contador's rivals he should ride for himself.

I mean, Sky train is an anomaly. You don't need four guys left with the last fifteen on mountain stages. Allrounders are just as important and Tinkoff have many good ones.
 
Nov 26, 2012
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lenric said:
Leopold Konig and Daniel Moreno would be good doms to Contador.
among them, Konig. good for future as well.
Moreno hadn't been performing that well imho.

But, i would rather have TS pick some climbing youngsters.

whts your take on Lars Boom for TS?
 
Jun 3, 2014
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TS will need extremely strong climbing squad, because they want to control race themselves and put SKY under pressure.

I'm just wondering what SKY will do, if eg. Kreuziger+Majka (being in top 10) would get involved into strong long range attack on stage 9.

Chasing them down will cost Froome some domestiques next day. And then on stage 10, AC tries himself...
 
murali said:
among them, Konig. good for future as well.
Moreno hadn't been performing that well imho.

But, i would rather have TS pick some climbing youngsters.

whts your take on Lars Boom for TS?
Well Lars Boom seems to be more of a time-trialist than a climber, so I guess he would be good to be a roleur, not to help Contador in the mountains.
 
Aug 4, 2010
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LaFlorecita said:
Don't think anyone doubts his commitment. I, for one, doubt his domestique abilities.
this.

I dont understand why anybody can think otherwise.He never was a good domestique,maybe he just lacks power to ride more than his body allows and then softpedal to the finish,everybody dont have this imo
 

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