Teams & Riders Alberto Contador Discussion Thread

[huge]

Nibali's haters everywhere...

 

[BlurryVII]

Re:

Wansn't the strongest, so didn't won unfairly. Uuuuhh Contador 2012 Vuelta? Cmon Blurry, don't be an idiot

Oh yeah, I'm being an idiot. Purito didn't crash if I remember correctly, huh?

Find a better example.

 

[lenric]

Re: Re:

Oh well, so many teams rumored, Etixx, Lampre, whatever. Let Contador go to Efapel, I'd like to see him winning Volta a Portugal, where the field's level may be higher than in the Tour

He needs to win the 100th Giro next year.

He needs to win the Tour first. And I was joking. Jeez, so much seriousness.


Blurry, last time I checked Contador had won 7 GTs. We must assume that, if you're saying that he won 9, then you also agree that Armstrong won 7 too.

 

[Brullnux]

Re: Re:

Wansn't the strongest, so didn't won unfairly. Uuuuhh Contador 2012 Vuelta? Cmon Blurry, don't be an idiot

Oh yeah, I'm being an idiot. Purito didn't crash if I remember correctly, huh?

Find a better example.

Schleck 2010 Tour. I reckon AC was stronger but still.

One more thing, seeing as no one disparages Contador's wins, can you refrain from doing so with everyone else's?

 

[Red Rick]

Re: Re:

Wansn't the strongest, so didn't won unfairly. Uuuuhh Contador 2012 Vuelta? Cmon Blurry, don't be an idiot

Oh yeah, I'm being an idiot. Purito didn't crash if I remember correctly, huh?

Find a better example.

No, but he was the strongest the entire race.

 

[dacooley]

typical blurry. any winner he's not satisfied with is instantly belittled. either contador or no one. pretty much like this.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Trying to eat on a descent is hardly a poor decision. Everyone does it, especially when there are almost no flat roads. Contador was unlucky there was a hole in the road just when he was reaching for his pocket. I guess you can argue it was a poor decision to reach for his pocket when there was a pothole coming up, but yeah

 

[BlurryVII]

Re: Re:

Contador, winner of 9 GTs, doesn't know how to assess his own abilities on a bike too, damn I forgot about that as well.

Nope, we said luck has nothing to do with that.

Yeah, he felt great in 2014, previous winner already crashed out, the season was going well, Nibali didn't show much before Tour, of course that made Contador feel confident. And confidence can very easily lead to mistakes,

Thank you for the insight of Contador's mind during 2014, all of that really built up to the crash moment.

Now, explain us why didn't his "over confidence" make him take "poor decisions" that led him to crash, let's say in 2009 for example?

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re: Re:

Oh well, so many teams rumored, Etixx, Lampre, whatever. Let Contador go to Efapel, I'd like to see him winning Volta a Portugal, where the field's level may be higher than in the Tour

He needs to win the 100th Giro next year.

He needs to win the Tour first. And I was joking. Jeez, so much seriousness.


Blurry, last time I checked Contador had won 7 GTs. We must assume that, if you're saying that he won 9, then you also agree that Armstrong won 7 too.

Of course, Armstrong won 7

 

[Brullnux]

Re:

Trying to eat on a descent is hardly a poor decision. Everyone does it, especially when there are almost no flat roads. Contador was unlucky there was a hole in the road just when he was reaching for his pocket. I guess you can argue it was a poor decision to reach for his pocket when there was a pothole coming up, but yeah

Yeah, I agree. It was unlucky to an extent but also avoidable. He made the call to eat hoping/expecting it to be fine but it didn't unfortunately for him. As you said, everyone does it and normally the risks entailed do not materialise, but in that case they did.

 

[BlurryVII]

Re: Re:

Wansn't the strongest, so didn't won unfairly. Uuuuhh Contador 2012 Vuelta? Cmon Blurry, don't be an idiot

Oh yeah, I'm being an idiot. Purito didn't crash if I remember correctly, huh?

Find a better example.

No, but he was the strongest the entire race.

Not the entire race, he completely cracked on pure strength in the Fuente De stage, big difference. Didn't crash to eventually lose his lead. You're missing the whole point here.

 

[lenric]

Re: Re:

Oh well, so many teams rumored, Etixx, Lampre, whatever. Let Contador go to Efapel, I'd like to see him winning Volta a Portugal, where the field's level may be higher than in the Tour

He needs to win the 100th Giro next year.

He needs to win the Tour first. And I was joking. Jeez, so much seriousness.


Blurry, last time I checked Contador had won 7 GTs. We must assume that, if you're saying that he won 9, then you also agree that Armstrong won 7 too.

Of course, Armstrong won 7

I'm just using Contador's fans reasoning when they say Contador won 9 GTs, in spite of wikipedia showing 7 wins and 2 disqualifications
The principle is the same, isn't it?

 

[damian13ster]

Re: Re:

Contador, winner of 9 GTs, doesn't know how to assess his own abilities on a bike too, damn I forgot about that as well.

Nope, we said luck has nothing to do with that.

Yeah, he felt great in 2014, previous winner already crashed out, the season was going well, Nibali didn't show much before Tour, of course that made Contador feel confident. And confidence can very easily lead to mistakes,

Thank you for the insight of Contador's mind during 2014, all of that really built up to the crash moment.

Now, explain us why didn't his "over confidence" make him take "poor decisions" that led him to crash, let's say in 2009 for example?

He didn't make the poor decision in 2009 so he won there. He made a poor decision in 2014 and lost. What are you getting at?
Are you trying to argue that just because someone didn't make a mistake once, he will never make a mistake (or consequently if he made a mistake then he will always make a mistake)?
Or are you trying to somehow prove that Contador has qualities needed to win a GT? There is no need for that, everyone here knows that.
He just didn't display all of them in 2014 so he didn't win, and neither did Kruijswijk in this Giro. Nibali did, so he won both races

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re: Re:

I'm just using Contador's fans reasoning when they say Contador won 9 GTs, in spite of wikipedia showing 7 wins and 2 disqualifications
The principle is the same, isn't it?

Yes, he won 9 GTs, although two were taking away officially, he still won 9.

 

[Brullnux]

He's won 9 but has 7, is that a fair compromise?

 

[BlurryVII]

Re: Re:

He didn't make the poor decision in 2009 so he won there. He made a poor decision in 2014 and lost. What are you getting at?
Are you trying to argue that just because someone didn't make a mistake once, he will never make a mistake (or consequently if he made a mistake then he will always make a mistake)?
Or are you trying to somehow prove that Contador has qualities needed to win a GT? There is no need for that, everyone here knows that.
He just didn't display all of them in 2014 so he didn't win, and neither did Kruijswijk in this Giro. Nibali did, so he won both races

I just proved your whole "over confidence" theory wrong . It couldn't possibly have led him to take a "poor decision" which, by the way, is a laughable choice of words given the ridiculously unlikely situation.

But my main point is that it's down to luck. We'll have to agree to disagree then.

 

[lenric]

Re: Re:

I'm just using Contador's fans reasoning when they say Contador won 9 GTs, in spite of wikipedia showing 7 wins and 2 disqualifications
The principle is the same, isn't it?

Yes, he won 9 GTs, although two were taking away officially, he still won 9.

So the problem is semantics. I'm sorry to break up with your dream, but while in a competition, you're the winner when you're the first by being in the same conditions as the others are. If not, it's not a fair win and you get disqualified. Were he disqualified right after x or y stage and we weren't loosing our time discussing semantics and dreams.

 

[BlurryVII]

Re:

Trying to eat on a descent is hardly a poor decision. Everyone does it, especially when there are almost no flat roads. Contador was unlucky there was a hole in the road just when he was reaching for his pocket. I guess you can argue it was a poor decision to reach for his pocket when there was a pothole coming up, but yeah

He saw the pothole way too late as well, so how's that even a poor decision making, god knows lol.

 

[BlurryVII]

Re: Re:

I'm just using Contador's fans reasoning when they say Contador won 9 GTs, in spite of wikipedia showing 7 wins and 2 disqualifications
The principle is the same, isn't it?

Yes, he won 9 GTs, although two were taking away officially, he still won 9.

So the problem is semantics. I'm sorry to break up with your dream, but while in a competition, you're the winner when you're the first by being in the same conditions as the others are. If not, it's not a fair win and you get disqualified.

Giro 2011 says hi. Any proof that he wasn't in the same conditions?

Also why do Merckx, Pantani and Riis still have all of their GTs when proven guilty of "not being in the same conditions"?

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re: Re:

I'm just using Contador's fans reasoning when they say Contador won 9 GTs, in spite of wikipedia showing 7 wins and 2 disqualifications
The principle is the same, isn't it?

Yes, he won 9 GTs, although two were taking away officially, he still won 9.

So the problem is semantics. I'm sorry to break up with your dream, but while in a competition, you're the winner when you're the first by being in the same conditions as the others are. If not, it's not a fair win and you get disqualified. Were he disqualified right after x or y stage and we weren't loosing our time discussing semantics and dreams.

This is a discussion for the Clinic.

 

[lenric]

Re: Re:

I'm just using Contador's fans reasoning when they say Contador won 9 GTs, in spite of wikipedia showing 7 wins and 2 disqualifications
The principle is the same, isn't it?

Yes, he won 9 GTs, although two were taking away officially, he still won 9.

So the problem is semantics. I'm sorry to break up with your dream, but while in a competition, you're the winner when you're the first by being in the same conditions as the others are. If not, it's not a fair win and you get disqualified.

Giro 2011 says hi. Any proof that he wasn't in the same conditions?

Also why do Merckx, Pantani and Riis still have all of their GTs when proven guilty of "not being in the same conditions"?

2011's Giro isn't in his curriculum, is it? I guess it answers your first question.
About the second one, it's self-explanatory and easier to understand. So easy that I'll leave it to you to find the answer.


La Florecita, we're talking about the amount of GT wins he has in his curriculum. I guess this is not a theme entitled to the clinic.

 

[BlurryVII]

I forgot Di Luca recently. Still winner of the Giro 07' strangely enough.

Funny thing, the same guy (lenric) claims to be a big contador fan but is always arguing against him for some reason. I've seen many of those people by now, trying to appear "more objective" by saying they're fans and hating at the same time. It's not working, just saying.

 

[BlurryVII]

Re: Re:

I'm just using Contador's fans reasoning when they say Contador won 9 GTs, in spite of wikipedia showing 7 wins and 2 disqualifications
The principle is the same, isn't it?

Yes, he won 9 GTs, although two were taking away officially, he still won 9.

So the problem is semantics. I'm sorry to break up with your dream, but while in a competition, you're the winner when you're the first by being in the same conditions as the others are. If not, it's not a fair win and you get disqualified.

Giro 2011 says hi. Any proof that he wasn't in the same conditions?

Also why do Merckx, Pantani and Riis still have all of their GTs when proven guilty of "not being in the same conditions"?

2011's Giro isn't in his curriculum, is it? I guess it answers your first question.
About the second one, it's self-explanatory and easier to understand. So easy that I'll leave it to you to find the answer.

Oh really? Not in his curriculum? Oops, blind people can't see eh.

Nothing to see here then, claiming a point and not defending it.

 

[Red Rick]

Re: Re:

Wansn't the strongest, so didn't won unfairly. Uuuuhh Contador 2012 Vuelta? Cmon Blurry, don't be an idiot

Oh yeah, I'm being an idiot. Purito didn't crash if I remember correctly, huh?

Find a better example.

No, but he was the strongest the entire race.

Not the entire race, he completely cracked on pure strength in the Fuente De stage, big difference. Didn't crash to eventually lose his lead. You're missing the whole point here.

Maybe I should stop asking questions when people don't seem to figure out what I mean. If you say that being the strongest is what makes you deserve to win, then you don't understand what makes road cycling so unique. Being the strongest does not mean you should win, and does not mean that it isn't fair if you don't win. Crashing is a huge part of cycling, always has been. That the rider you want to win doesn't, doesn't mean that its fair. Now thanks to your rambling we've gotten to the 9v7 debate.

Again.

 

[LaFlorecita]