Teams & Riders Alberto Contador Discussion Thread

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Jul 14, 2016
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dacooley said:
it's been sad but inevitable at some point. really hoping for ending the career on a very major note as Vino or Cancellara did. the 2018 Giro win would be very very fitting.


He is one year older, which is not an advantage at his age. It's the final percentage of physics that you lose with age and that's what you need when you compete against the best.
 
Aug 4, 2010
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Jelantik said:
Robert5091 said:
I think management will speak to Bertie tomorrow ...

maybe time to consider bringing Aru to Trek? The cofee giant would love that.

Darn, darn. I just wanted to see Contador at least up there, and be competitive. He was out climbed by Yates and almost everyone. Forget the top contender like Froome, Porte, Bardet, Aru. I can't remember when the last time he was competitive at the Tour since 2013. 2014 is the only time he looked really prime to win it, only to crash out.

on another note: that darn Oleg was right. Contador is limping like a duck. Darn.

This is the smartest thing I've read on here today, Contador's done as a rider and he'll be lucky if Trek even offers him something like money to limp along at the back of the peloton next year.

Aru has way more upside for the money to be paid out. I hope trek signs Are and shows Contador the door.
 
Mar 20, 2010
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rhubroma said:
I can't help but think rather than two speeds sport, we have a two priorities sport.

Well Trek just wants to sell bikes......and evidently Alberto sells a lot of bikes!
 
May 15, 2011
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Carols said:
rhubroma said:
I can't help but think rather than two speeds sport, we have a two priorities sport.
Well Trek just wants to sell bikes......and evidently Alberto sells a lot of bikes!
And Segafredo wants to sell coffee - Berto helps with that as well ;)
 
Jul 6, 2016
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Yeah, what to say?

I genuinely believed he would have been up there. And I still think it could be possible for him to match the game of the likes of Froome and all the other guys.

Honestly now I'm really doubting his preparation. Or is has to do with some clinic stuff.

But this is it then. Hopefully he can animate a stage somewhere in the coming two weeks.

For now: thanks for everything Berto. Supporting and rooting for you until the very last drip of blood.
 
Jul 19, 2010
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hm.. reading his interview.. I'm still thinking.. what went wrong? He is just not good. Period. I was hoping he'll be up there with Aru, Bardet or even dropped the same time as Quintana. But no. He practically plunging into 3rd tier climber. He can't hold the wheel and already at his limit? Landa with his Giro leg, climbing for Froome is still finishing ahead of him. Is he just under train?
 
Jun 10, 2017
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rhubroma said:
arvc40 said:
rhubroma said:
Strange though he talked the numbers game at the start of this race, even if it was apparent at the Dauphine he was behind schedule in being able to peak for the Tour.

What I can't understand is how he and his team were so egregiously mistaken in preparation and prognostication. His decline has been ongoing since 2011 at the Tour, but every year there was always something to deceive one into thinking the ineluctable was mistaken. Now the final verdict is out.

Don't get me wrong I have much admiration for the way he has battled last few years. Some have gone off the rails when reality has hit. Some of my favourite moments have been created by this man even in recent years, real hum dinger stages, you all know the ones !. All this 2014 numbers stuff is just more likely to suggest that even that year Froome would have forced a submission. Although he did look Physically different that year but can't talk about that hear

No question about it now, in 2014 he was much, much better. Would have been the only time he and Froome could have gone at it mano a mano. What perplexes me (and no I'm not naive on certain issues), is that what worked in 2014 has not been repeated. Is it because Riis was fired? It's just a pity that his career had to overlap with Sky and got derailed when a certain setup could have produced an epic confrontation that never materialized.

Is it too obvious an answer that he was 31 in 2014, and he's 34 now? That he's been riding at the highest level for so long now, it's hard for the body to maintain that intensity for a decade? He didn't even get a full 2 year break for his suspension with the amount of time it spent in the courts.
 
Jun 14, 2010
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Well now its definately the end, barring some Pereiro type stuff. But this is not the Contador of 2011 or 2014. Too long now he's seemed to me to be more of a broken man, and the old aura is gone.

So if its goodbye, its a different goodbye than for most riders. He's maybe (despite the fact that Froome now outshines him), the most significant cyclist of the millenium. Certainly his fanbase seems to me the biggest of any cyclist since Pantani, and that's also significant, not just winning titles. The story is also interesting - more so than the Froome or Armstrong ones of - win easily every year. As is the personality and character.

I think what people saw in Contador that made them like him, was that he has traits of an alpha male. Armstrong was portrayed as that, but the ruthlessness about him created the aura of someone who was unable to remain calm under pressure - a form of weakness. Froome's story makes him look like more of a robot than an actual human being and people don't look up to that. Nor do they like someone who seems to so obviously be living a lie.

Contador was calm, always. He never seemed to betray hate. He was diplomatic, and didn't speak or appear that much- creating mystery. His early dominance, combined with the way he was able to light up stages
like no one else occasionally, taking risks gave him a reputation of someone who was always in with a chance and who would never give up. These are traits people look for in their heroes.
He in some ways run on this reputation way beyond its expiry date, visible by the fact that despite not coming close to even wearing a yellow jersey since 2010, somehow every year his fans think he could win.

The doping clouds never hurt him that much, because he never won after they surfaced. Vino maybe had the same thing, which is why a similar cult of personality surrounded him, and actually his profile wasn't too different from the above one I outline for Contador.

On the other hand, if Contador had won his Tours towards the end of his career, they would be remembered more fondly. It would have been a more happy story.

The fact that he won them at the beginning, and then added only giros and vueltas in the second half, will make it for many people a - what could have been. And more of a sad story. Potential unrealised.

Because the way the early years went, maybe he could have made it top 3 of all time with Eddy and Hinault.
No one will ever make that argument now.

But he's still young and got his life set for him, a young family. Hopefully he'll be able to enjoy it, build on it and put cycling behind him.

Once its all over it doesn't even matter that much what you won back when you were young, but the family and the day to day. At the end of the day I doubt its neccesarily the Eddy's and the Bernard's and the Miguel's that live the most satisfying lives. Life is a very different game to cycling.

Could he have beaten Froome at some point? 2014 was obviously the year and that one will always hurt the most for his fans. But hey these things happen to people. I will always feel it was an idiotic decision to go for the Giro in 2015, abdicating his last chance at a win at the Grandady of them all. But it was his decision so hopefully he doesn't regret it. 2013 was out of character, and maybe the one Contador himself will regret most, if he thinks he could have beaten Froome, but it is a hard sport and even people like Contdor can fail to match it sometimes. The clen thing, well that was the worst thing that happened to him and it was a bit of bad luck at the end of the day. Still, others got off worse and at least he still salvaged a second half of a career out of it, which many others were never able to. If it had never happened, probably he would have also won the Tour in 2011 and maybe 2012. But then would he have had as many devoted fans as the new Armstrong? I doubt it, having something to fight against, made him what he became.

That he never won the fight though is a sad ending to the story. For me I will always look back on Contador as a case of what could have been. But its a reminder that cycling really is amongst the most cold, brutal sports, and at the end of the day, as the likes of Marco and Michelle have shown us, there are worse ways for it to end. And maybe Contadors young fans will learn lesson from this too. Your heroes do not always win. Sometimes you have to take the loss and suck it up. And then do the same again year after year. Its a better lesson than the spoilt kids get who's favourite sports stars/ teams always win. And if it helps them live a better life, then maybe Contador's career will have done some good in that way too
 
Jun 7, 2011
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After he got dropped, and the camera went back to him on a switchback and he was virtually at a standstill, that was sad.

I hope he doesn't do the TDF Next year.
 
Jul 5, 2017
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I think Alberto is over trained.This was seen in stage 5, where he was dropped from the others and after 20 seconds he came back very easy with the rest.I also think that he cycles to many tours befor the TDF.
In his best years 2007 2009 2010 he cycled Paris-Nice, Toure of Basque, Criterium dauphine.Now when he is over 30 years old he is cycling Paris-Nice,Volta Catalunya, toure of Basque, Criterium Dophine and TDF
 
Feb 20, 2012
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The Hitch said:
If Contador had won his Tours towards the end of his career, they would be remembered more fondly.

The fact that he won them at the beginning, and then added only giros and vueltas in the second half, will make it for many people a - what could have been.

Maybe he could have made it top 3 of all time with Eddy and Hinault.
No one will ever make that argument now.

But he's still young and got his life set for him, a young family. Hopefully he'll be able to enjoy it, build on it and put cycling behind him.

Once its all over it doesn't even matter that much what you won back when you were young, but the family and the day to day. At the end of the day I doubt its neccesarily the Eddy's and the Bernard's and the Miguel's that live the most satisfying lives. Life is a very different game to cycling.

I think what people saw in Contador that made them like him, (certainly his fanbase seems to me the biggest of any cyclist since Pantani) was that he has traits of an alpha male. Armstrong was portrayed as that, but the ruthlessness about him created the aura of someone who was unable to remain calm under pressure - a form of weakness. Contador was calm, always. He never seemed to betray hate. He was diplomatic, and didn't speak or appear that much- creating mystery. His early dominance, combined with the way he was able to light up stages occasionally, taking risks gave him a reputation of someone who was always in with a chance and who would never give up. All traits people look for in their heroes. He in some ways run on this reputation way beyond its expiry date, visible by the fact that despite not coming close to even wearing a yellow jersey since 2010, somehow every year his fans think he could win.

For me I will always look back on Contador as a case of what could have been. Its sad for me because I would have been happy for him to win one more in the last 7 years. But its a reminder that cycling really is amongst the most cold, brutal sports, and at the end of the day, as the likes of Marco and Michelle have shown us, there are worse ways for it to end.

Very nice post Hitch.

I think what hurts the most is that as the narrative in our minds (and probably his as well) that he has unfinished business at the Tour de France, the one race which is regarded as the highest he could achieve. From being booed in 2011 to now, 6 years later, the biggest race in the world has caused him and his fans sparsely good memories. The fact that he was so bad in 2013, and Sky coming down on the race has made people talk like Alberto Contador was a relic of a bygone era. Even in his greatest season since his comeback, he did not get a chance to fight for the win, and I think that's what hurts the most. He didn't even get the chance to fight for the win, be it missing peaks, be it crashing, be it Giro's, he's always underperformed compared to what he can actually do. Even now, people seem to assume that today showcased his true level. I don't believe that. Being outclimbed by a guy with a single Vuelta top 10 to his name, who fractured his pelvis 2 months ago and who's been in the breakaway 2 days in a row isn't what he can do. And he's not been able to show what he can do at the biggest stage for 6 years now.

For me personally, it's been similar to watching my favorite tennis player, Andy Roddick, chase his 2nd Grand Slam victory for years. The 2014 Tour crash had a 09' Wimbledon feel to it.
 
Aug 26, 2014
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The Hitch said:
If Contador had won his Tours towards the end of his career, they would be remembered more fondly.

The fact that he won them at the beginning, and then added only giros and vueltas in the second half, will make it for many people a - what could have been.

Maybe he could have made it top 3 of all time with Eddy and Hinault.
No one will ever make that argument now.

But he's still young and got his life set for him, a young family. Hopefully he'll be able to enjoy it, build on it and put cycling behind him.

Once its all over it doesn't even matter that much what you won back when you were young, but the family and the day to day. At the end of the day I doubt its neccesarily the Eddy's and the Bernard's and the Miguel's that live the most satisfying lives. Life is a very different game to cycling.

I think what people saw in Contador that made them like him, (certainly his fanbase seems to me the biggest of any cyclist since Pantani) was that he has traits of an alpha male. Armstrong was portrayed as that, but the ruthlessness about him created the aura of someone who was unable to remain calm under pressure - a form of weakness. Contador was calm, always. He never seemed to betray hate. He was diplomatic, and didn't speak or appear that much- creating mystery. His early dominance, combined with the way he was able to light up stages occasionally, taking risks gave him a reputation of someone who was always in with a chance and who would never give up. All traits people look for in their heroes. He in some ways run on this reputation way beyond its expiry date, visible by the fact that despite not coming close to even wearing a yellow jersey since 2010, somehow every year his fans think he could win.

For me I will always look back on Contador as a case of what could have been. Its sad for me because I would have been happy for him to win one more in the last 7 years. But its a reminder that cycling really is amongst the most cold, brutal sports, and at the end of the day, as the likes of Marco and Michelle have shown us, there are worse ways for it to end.

This is a nice and thoughtful post to see amidst some of the gloating. I certainly would agree with a lot of it. Funny about the Alpha male thing, though. I wouldn't describe him as that - perhaps because I equate 'alphas' with more extrovert tendencies and desire to dominate others. A lot of the qualities of 'alphas' - confidence, single-mindedness, competitiveness etc. - can all too quickly overspill into some pretty unpleasant excesses - arrogance, conceit, vanity, bullying, ruthlessness, braggadoccio etc. etc. A need to be the centre of attention in all ways and all areas. To win everything. Even the game of tag with your kid; whatever.

Where Contador appears to be different is that he doesn't tend to exhibit these excesses much and certainly very little outside racing. Despite immense talent, he's seemed to keep his feet pretty well on the ground and retain a sense of dignity, humility and perspective even immediately after disappointment. He might not be the 'big extrovert personality', but there is a lot of appeal in someone who appears consistent and sincere in their behaviour;to have integrity.

Regarding traits one looks for in heroes - for me that is very much linked to the way Contador races: I have an intense dislike and mistrust of the 'system' and over-bearing, rigid, planned control; I like the people who can mix things up by being freakishly talented, unpredictable, having courage and instinct and being prepared to take chances and live with the consequences. So I guess Contador's way of racing helps to affirm my attitude to life - that's it's a hell of a lot more fun, more inspiring, more pretty much anything, to go for it than to live according to a calculated playbook. I guess maybe that way you don't always win what you could, but the chance to go up or down in glorious flames is about a million per cent higher. For all Contador is ageing, stuff like last year's Vuelta and this year's Paris-Nice show that this aspect at least is the same as ever.

I am sorry about today. I wish it were different, but not everything last's forever, and I'll take whatever throws of the dice he feels like giving for the rest of his career, because frankly, he's still the guy that whatever race he's in, makes the race just a little more interesting. We need more like that - cycling is most fun when it's predominantly about individual exploits and individual goals - whether that's a loan breakaway holding off the peloton against the odds, or a guy like Contador doing some long-range attack and shattering the predicted roadbook. It's better if they win in the end, but I still wouldn't trade. Those folks are the reason I watch cycling.
 
Jun 14, 2010
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Red Rick said:
The Hitch said:
If Contador had won his Tours towards the end of his career, they would be remembered more fondly.

The fact that he won them at the beginning, and then added only giros and vueltas in the second half, will make it for many people a - what could have been.

Maybe he could have made it top 3 of all time with Eddy and Hinault.
No one will ever make that argument now.

But he's still young and got his life set for him, a young family. Hopefully he'll be able to enjoy it, build on it and put cycling behind him.

Once its all over it doesn't even matter that much what you won back when you were young, but the family and the day to day. At the end of the day I doubt its neccesarily the Eddy's and the Bernard's and the Miguel's that live the most satisfying lives. Life is a very different game to cycling.

I think what people saw in Contador that made them like him, (certainly his fanbase seems to me the biggest of any cyclist since Pantani) was that he has traits of an alpha male. Armstrong was portrayed as that, but the ruthlessness about him created the aura of someone who was unable to remain calm under pressure - a form of weakness. Contador was calm, always. He never seemed to betray hate. He was diplomatic, and didn't speak or appear that much- creating mystery. His early dominance, combined with the way he was able to light up stages occasionally, taking risks gave him a reputation of someone who was always in with a chance and who would never give up. All traits people look for in their heroes. He in some ways run on this reputation way beyond its expiry date, visible by the fact that despite not coming close to even wearing a yellow jersey since 2010, somehow every year his fans think he could win.

For me I will always look back on Contador as a case of what could have been. Its sad for me because I would have been happy for him to win one more in the last 7 years. But its a reminder that cycling really is amongst the most cold, brutal sports, and at the end of the day, as the likes of Marco and Michelle have shown us, there are worse ways for it to end.

Very nice post Hitch.

I think what hurts the most is that as the narrative in our minds (and probably his as well) that he has unfinished business at the Tour de France, the one race which is regarded as the highest he could achieve. From being booed in 2011 to now, 6 years later, the biggest race in the world has caused him and his fans sparsely good memories. The fact that he was so bad in 2013, and Sky coming down on the race has made people talk like Alberto Contador was a relic of a bygone era. Even in his greatest season since his comeback, he did not get a chance to fight for the win, and I think that's what hurts the most. He didn't even get the chance to fight for the win, be it missing peaks, be it crashing, be it Giro's, he's always underperformed compared to what he can actually do. Even now, people seem to assume that today showcased his true level. I don't believe that. Being outclimbed by a guy with a single Vuelta top 10 to his name, who fractured his pelvis 2 months ago and who's been in the breakaway 2 days in a row isn't what he can do. And he's not been able to show what he can do at the biggest stage for 6 years now.

For me personally, it's been similar to watching my favorite tennis player, Andy Roddick, chase his 2nd Grand Slam victory for years. The 2014 Tour crash had a 09' Wimbledon feel to it.
Its funny that you write that because Roddick was also my favourite tennis player and the 2009 Wimbledon final a very harsh one to watch. My heart always drops when I see highlights of it. And Roddick had that easy volley that would have won that 2nd set. Morally it would have been 100x better for Roddick to get 1 than fed to get another one.

But I always force myself to watch it, to relive the pain, and remind myself that Roddick's story or Contador's story is not my story.

And hey Roddick's got a supermodel wife. Not that that neccesarily leads to happiness ultimately, but it certainly puts into perspective how pathetic it is to feel sorry for him. He's got tv gigs, retired early, won't have to work any job he doesn't want, his kids futures are set. Is that who I should be feeling sorry for? Considering there's 24 million people living as slaves in North Korea currently, millions of others around the world living other forms of suffering. Its just a trick of the brain that we identify with characters we see on tv.

Contador hasn't got it that bad. He's also set financially, and this being born into what I understand is more of a poorer neighbourhood in Pinto. He's financially set, got a loving wife (or I remember it that way), he survived the brain scare, he can help his unfortunate brother (which in some ways is more important than a million TDF's). And heck, he tasted 3 times the glory of winning the Tour de France. One of them he got from Rasmussen who doesn't even have that consolation. But Rasmussen seems like a happy man as well.

Winning TDF's can also be a curse. Floyd's life probably would have been way better if he had never got there, Armstrong probably in a similar boat. Pantani paid in a different way. Fignon died young too as did Anquetil. Compare the latter to his rival Poulidor. 50 years ago we would have been sorry for Poulidor in favour of Fignon. But who of them has been living by all accounts a very nice life as an icon for 40 years since. I think people like Pereiro and Sastre who can win a Tour quietly and then retire have it best of all.
 
Jun 12, 2016
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The Hitch said:
Red Rick said:
The Hitch said:
If Contador had won his Tours towards the end of his career, they would be remembered more fondly.

The fact that he won them at the beginning, and then added only giros and vueltas in the second half, will make it for many people a - what could have been.

Maybe he could have made it top 3 of all time with Eddy and Hinault.
No one will ever make that argument now.

But he's still young and got his life set for him, a young family. Hopefully he'll be able to enjoy it, build on it and put cycling behind him.

Once its all over it doesn't even matter that much what you won back when you were young, but the family and the day to day. At the end of the day I doubt its neccesarily the Eddy's and the Bernard's and the Miguel's that live the most satisfying lives. Life is a very different game to cycling.

I think what people saw in Contador that made them like him, (certainly his fanbase seems to me the biggest of any cyclist since Pantani) was that he has traits of an alpha male. Armstrong was portrayed as that, but the ruthlessness about him created the aura of someone who was unable to remain calm under pressure - a form of weakness. Contador was calm, always. He never seemed to betray hate. He was diplomatic, and didn't speak or appear that much- creating mystery. His early dominance, combined with the way he was able to light up stages occasionally, taking risks gave him a reputation of someone who was always in with a chance and who would never give up. All traits people look for in their heroes. He in some ways run on this reputation way beyond its expiry date, visible by the fact that despite not coming close to even wearing a yellow jersey since 2010, somehow every year his fans think he could win.

For me I will always look back on Contador as a case of what could have been. Its sad for me because I would have been happy for him to win one more in the last 7 years. But its a reminder that cycling really is amongst the most cold, brutal sports, and at the end of the day, as the likes of Marco and Michelle have shown us, there are worse ways for it to end.

Very nice post Hitch.

I think what hurts the most is that as the narrative in our minds (and probably his as well) that he has unfinished business at the Tour de France, the one race which is regarded as the highest he could achieve. From being booed in 2011 to now, 6 years later, the biggest race in the world has caused him and his fans sparsely good memories. The fact that he was so bad in 2013, and Sky coming down on the race has made people talk like Alberto Contador was a relic of a bygone era. Even in his greatest season since his comeback, he did not get a chance to fight for the win, and I think that's what hurts the most. He didn't even get the chance to fight for the win, be it missing peaks, be it crashing, be it Giro's, he's always underperformed compared to what he can actually do. Even now, people seem to assume that today showcased his true level. I don't believe that. Being outclimbed by a guy with a single Vuelta top 10 to his name, who fractured his pelvis 2 months ago and who's been in the breakaway 2 days in a row isn't what he can do. And he's not been able to show what he can do at the biggest stage for 6 years now.

For me personally, it's been similar to watching my favorite tennis player, Andy Roddick, chase his 2nd Grand Slam victory for years. The 2014 Tour crash had a 09' Wimbledon feel to it.
Its funny that you write that because Roddick was also my favourite tennis player and the 2009 Wimbledon final a very harsh one to watch. My heart always drops when I see highlights of it. And Roddick had that easy volley that would have won that 2nd set. Morally it would have been 100x better for Roddick to get 1 than fed to get another one.

But I always force myself to watch it, to relive the pain, and remind myself that Roddick's story or Contador's story is not my story.

And hey Roddick's got a supermodel wife. Not that that neccesarily leads to happiness ultimately, but it certainly puts into perspective how pathetic it is to feel sorry for him. He's got tv gigs, retired early, won't have to work any job he doesn't want, his kids futures are set. Is that who I should be feeling sorry for? Considering there's 24 million people living as slaves in North Korea currently, millions of others around the world living other forms of suffering. Its just a trick of the brain that we identify with characters we see on tv.

Contador hasn't got it that bad. He's also set financially, and this being born into what I understand is more of a poorer neighbourhood in Pinto. He's financially set, got a loving wife (or I remember it that way), he survived the brain scare, he can help his unfortunate brother (which in some ways is more important than a million TDF's). And heck, he tasted 3 times the glory of winning the Tour de France. One of them he got from Rasmussen who doesn't even have that consolation. But Rasmussen seems like a happy man as well.

Winning TDF's can also be a curse. Floyd's life probably would have been way better if he had never got there, Armstrong probably in a similar boat. Pantani paid in a different way. Fignon died young too as did Anquetil. Compare the latter to his rival Poulidor. 50 years ago we would have been sorry for Poulidor in favour of Fignon. But who of them has been living by all accounts a very nice life as an icon for 40 years since. I think people like Pereiro and Sastre who can win a Tour quietly and then retire have it best of all.
It's so crazy that Sastre and Pereiro both won a Tour. A bit off topic I know but just considering that riders like Basso could never manage it, it still seems so strange.
 
Jul 30, 2011
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I've always been mystified (post 14) by the lack of attention to Riis. There's even an intervuew where confirms it.

Ferryman: don't knock the extrvagant languages: rhub has to deal in a super mongrel form day to day.
 
Aug 5, 2009
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Re:

Red Rick said:
https://www.instagram.com/p/BWVb90PFdxM/

One battered man

Probably mentally more than physically. He made some changes to his prep for the Tour but still no result. If Contador can't get results in GTs he won't be hanging around much longer, possibly one more season. He would probably want to finish up in the Vuelta.
 
Jun 10, 2010
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bob.a.feet said:
It's so crazy that Sastre and Pereiro both won a Tour. A bit off topic I know but just considering that riders like Basso could never manage it, it still seems so strange.
I think it's crazy to compare Sastre to Pereiro. Sastre was one of the most consistent GC riders of the 2000s. Aside from his 2008 Tour victory, he podiumed another two times, and he also has one podium at the Giro and three at the Vuelta, plus plenty other top 10's in all three GTs. Sastre is criminally underrated.
 
May 19, 2014
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Very nice post from Hitch and I totally agree with him.
Sometimes you just have to let it go so that you can free your mind to do other things.