Are there any smart dopers?

[BroDeal]

It seems to me that after doping your way to winning the big one the smart thing to do would be to go off the sauce, serve out your contract, and collect your pay while resting on your laurels, especially if you are near the end of your career. Sastre comes to mind.

Or a rider could limit doping to the final twelve months before contract renegotiation.

Obviously Armstrong is an example of the opposite, but are there riders who carefully weigh the risk to reward ratio then decide it is okay if they suck for a while?

 

[taiwan]

It seems to me that after doping your way to winning the big one the smart thing to do would be to go off the sauce, serve out your contract, and collect your pay while resting on your laurels, especially if you are near the end of your career. Sastre comes to mind.

Or a rider could limit doping to the final twelve months before contract renegotiation.

Obviously Armstrong is an example of the opposite, but are there riders who carefully weigh the risk to reward ratio then decide it is okay if they suck for a while?

Leipheimer, Andy Schleck, many on teams like Movistar or the vets on Radioschack who could get in the top 10 of a GT then just go back to being a domestique. Garmin has a similar pattern.

 

[180mmCrank]

I am sure that there are many 'tactical' dopers.

I am sure that the nature of cycling and it's intimate and long standing relationship to doping has bred many different approaches to navigating the 'ethics' of the peloton ... it must have played out for the lesser domestique as much as for the team leaders.

I suspect a few of the more genuine personal accounts of life in the peloton give some clues about what might have gone on and be going on even now as the sport cleans itself up a little.

Some we might hear about but most we will not.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Klöden = contract year

 

[sniper]

I thought of this every time I saw Evans struggling in the mountains and TTs.

 

[taiwan]

Gilbert.

chars

 

[Caruut]

Well, Gilbert springs to mind immediately.

Still, cycling involves many sacrifices - doping is but one of them. The "contract year phenomenon" is not limited in its scope to doping. As well as being prepared to take more risks with their health and with getting caught, riders have more incentive to train harder and longer, more reward for bearing the pain that much longer in a race and might make more demands for leadership roles or opportunities to ride for themselves.

EDIT: My conclusion was that what may appear to be "smart doping" might sometimes be a combination of that and other factors.

 

[180mmCrank]

Well, Gilbert springs to mind immediately.

Still, cycling involves many sacrifices - doping is but one of them. The "contract year phenomenon" is not limited in its scope to doping. As well as being prepared to take more risks with their health and with getting caught, riders have more incentive to train harder and longer, more reward for bearing the pain that much longer in a race and might make more demands for leadership roles or opportunities to ride for themselves.

EDIT: My conclusion was that what may appear to be "smart doping" might sometimes be a combination of that and other factors.

I am sure you are right.

T

 

[sniper]

i noted evans had quite a good mood throughout the tour. he was laughing alot, even after the nail-incident. he didn't seem to mind losing this year's tour.

i think evans is a smart doper.

 

[the asian]

Menchov seems to be off the dope in recent years. Cobo also seemed to lie low for a couple of years.

 

[BroDeal]

Wiggums, apparently he is smarter than he looks.

 

[eljimberino]

Everyone who wins, and doesn't get popped. Silly thread.

 

[BroDeal]

Everyone who wins, and doesn't get popped. Silly thread.

It is all about managing risk. Most pros seem totally incapable of it, ike Ricco getting popped while preparing for a pretty insignificant race compared to the Giro.

 

[The Hitch]

Wiggums, apparently he is smarter than he looks.

you can't say that sky are in league with the uci then propose that Wiggins is dropping doping because he doesn't want to get caught. Besides he did very well in that 1 giro mountain he contested. Outclimbed guys like gesink and scarponi. Not something pre 2009 Wiggins would be capable of.

 

[Afrank]

Wiggums, apparently he is smarter than he looks.

What good is doping if you never enter a race and make use of the benefits it gives you? If you can't make use of the benefits it's not really smart doping.

 

[Lanark]

What good is doping if you never enter a race and make use of the benefits it gives you? If you can't make use of the benefits it's not really smart doping.

Looks like he's using the hit and run method. Dope to a very succesfull year, and then do a couple of cleanish, low risk years where you start earning based on your great year. See Gilbert.

 

[BroDeal]

What good is doping if you never enter a race and make use of the benefits it gives you? If you can't make use of the benefits it's not really smart doping.

One Tour result is good for several years of salary. Wiggums gets a result in 2009, signs a huge contract, and then is nowhere through 2010 until the end of 2011. He pulls out all the stops out in 2012, and it now looks like he writing this season off.

 

[Afrank]

Looks like he's using the hit and run method. Dope to a very succesfull year, and then do a couple of cleanish, low risk years where you start earning based on your great year. See Gilbert.

Same thing I was thinking actually. But having a horrible year right after an exceptional one can look very suspicious as well sometimes.

And at least Gilbert in 2012 had a couple good performances (Amstel, Fleche, Worlds). It wasn't just a complete drop off, like Wiggins year so far. Don't know/not sure if that means anything though.

 

[BroDeal]

you can't say that sky are in league with the uci then propose that Wiggins is dropping doping because he doesn't want to get caught. Besides he did very well in that 1 giro mountain he contested. Outclimbed guys like gesink and scarponi. Not something pre 2009 Wiggins would be capable of.

Armstrong was in league with the UCI. How did that work out for him in the long run? The UCI tried to protect Contador but that did not work out either. Once WIggins' chances at the Giro collapsed, he might have calculated that it was not worth the risk to continue.

I would place Armstrong in the smart doper category. After the Tour he would disappear. He could have easily won multiple world time trial championships. Pre Tour he would race just to test his form.

 

[spalco]

I would say, if there really still is widespread doping, the sort of middlish or above-middlish-but-not-quite-top well-paid domestiques like Voigt, Eisel, Agnoli, Karpets, Siutsu, etc. are the smartest, because they make a good living with (relatively) minimal risk of detection due to rarely winning anything.

If you're an average pro with the intention to make maximum money and don't have much conscience regarding doping, that's the way to go imo.

 

[TourOfTexas]

Menchov seems to be off the dope in recent years. Cobo also seemed to lie low for a couple of years.

Cobo! Wow, that guy's ability really took a nosedive after Vuelta 2011. I'm surprised he hasn't blamed it on a virus, or being depressed, or whatever the going excuse is.

 

[Dazed and Confused]

Cobo! Wow, that guy's ability really took a nosedive after Vuelta 2011. I'm surprised he hasn't blamed it on a virus, or being depressed, or whatever the going excuse is.

Depression is the excuse du jour.

 

[taiwan]

Even if Wiggins has guarantees from Pat, he needs to be very careful. He's British sporting royalty, almost literally. His credibility is tied to that of BC and the GB olympic team. The smart way to do it would indeed be to get on the deluxe programme briefly at the time when the results would have the maximum impact. If that were the intention then it would be mission accomplished.

 

[icefire]

Armstrong was in league with the UCI. How did that work out for him in the long run? The UCI tried to protect Contador but that did not work out either. Once WIggins' chances at the Giro collapsed, he might have calculated that it was not worth the risk to continue.

I would place Armstrong in the smart doper category. After the Tour he would disappear. He could have easily won multiple world time trial championships. Pre Tour he would race just to test his form.

Armstrong smarts finished the day Sastre won the Tour

 

[The Hitch]

Armstrong wasn't smart, he just didn't give a **** about any race other than the tour. He told g Thomas the 1 race he regrets not winning was ventoux mtf. Not giro, not vuelta not worlds or liege or Olympics. Just another stage at the tour. Worth more to him than anything else.