Armstrong on Bolt and Federer scepticism

[Cloxxki]

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/armstrong-and-basso-test-tour-de-france-cobbles

Armstong went on to refer obliquely to the recent Landis allegations. “The most important thing is to be authentic. Nowadays in sport, nobody believes in anything anymore, even if you ride strong and are tested a hundred times a year. People doubt it when Bolt breaks the 100m record or Federer wins so many Grand Slams. It’s hard to fight against scepticism. No show, what you see is what’s there."

Does Bolt receive so much scepticism still? After his forst records, sure. But now, I think everyone recognizes that he's just built differently, and near flawless in his performance.
I am on the running twice a week, a very competitive club with contenders at world elite level. I did not hear anything than praise for Bolt as an athlete. As a person, he may have a longer way to go (general playboy behavior).

Anyway, Armstrong has a former domistique explicitly declaring that he got his doping and doping knowledge from him. That's a tiny bit different than some public scpeticism about world records.

Failed diffusion attempt from the PR master?

On a side note, the women's WR over 100m is still with a lady who's not even alive anymore. Marion Jones, doped to the gills and built like body builder, did not reach it. Yet, the men run faster and faster. Seems to hint the weight-adding steroids the men especially took in the 80's and 90's to reach WR's (some to have them taken away again) were slowing them down more than they realized, or something? Nowadays 100m winners seem lighter built, and get through a 300m quite decently (Bolt being way tall and just 90kg).

And isn't Nadal the suspicious tennis player of the bunch? Federer to me is more like Sampras. Impeccable technique, not so much invincible power or endurance.

 

[dolophonic]

Why does he keep involving people in his own mess..!

What happened to his own "code of silence"?

 

[dolophonic]

Bolt is the man BTW !

 

[Race Radio]

This is the latest Armstrong attempt at justification, everyone is doing it.

 

[oldschoolnik]

Someone here recently posted that the last bastion or fallback position of the Fanboy is the "everyone's doing it, so it's a level playing field" etc.. and from what I have seen this resonates with most of the Fanboy base. Just the other day someone responded to my Facebook post about the NY Times article saying "I stopped trying to figure out who were the good guys and who were the bad guys a long time ago"

The fanboy will always lump all riders who ever took a drug together whether they went about their business quietly (Big Mig) or ruined other rider's careers or enorced OMERTA as much as possible. To me there is a huge difference.

 

[Jamsque]

Pretty standard media manoeuvring from Lance. He is still trying to paint himself as a brave crusader who is hated for winning, and so he is trying to align himself with people like Usain Bolt who have received doping accusations purely based on performances, while ignoring all of the personal accusations and other evidence against him.

Interesting that you mention Rafa Nadal. I was thinking about this the other day, and I recall that when Puerto broke there were a bunch of people who had clearly either seen the whole list of Fuentes' customers or knew who was on it, but couldn't write about it publicly. There were a lot of very vaguely-worded reports that tried to spell out which non-cyclists were on the list without actually naming names, and I do remember at the time trying to read between the lines and getting the distinct impression that Nadal was on the list.

 

[Ferminal]

Like I needed any more reasons to doubt them... a glowing reference from the king of doping himself.

 

[eleven]

Before Bolt, 4 of the last 5 100M Olympic champions had either tested positive (3) or been accused by knowledgeable parties (1). So had a long list of other track stars. When you combine that information with Bolt's performances, it's not hard to see why there is so much doubt. Cycling and track both suffer from the same lack of credibility in this regard.

 

[Cloxxki]

Now what if the true sportsmen of this world, BEING Federer and Bolt, would together hold a press conference to express their sadness over Lance's wording, and that he shouldn't drag the impeccable into his dirty hole?

If I were Bolt or Federer, I would not let myself be compared to a guy who was just accused by his former friend and loyal helper (thus best informed person on the planet) of the worst yet most common crime in their line of work.

Bolt and Federer do their respective thing alone. With their feet on the ground, and the competition on the other side of the line. They are the best at what they do, and the best there ever were. Peers to Lance you might think, but stating such would actualy do the former two disjustice.

Federer BTW is also a Nike man, for whatever that's worth.

 

[saganftw]

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/armstrong-and-basso-test-tour-de-france-cobbles

Does Bolt receive so much scepticism still? After his forst records, sure. But now, I think everyone recognizes that he's just built differently, and near flawless in his performance.

this is interesting point you made here,in connection with the "superhuman performance thread"...if you say bolt is built differently it makes me think that actually there is no such think as human limits,some of suspected cyclist could be built differently too (like high altitude born climbers f.e.)

on the topic,i think LA got a point here,but since its LA it doesnt matter because he is allegedly doper too so anything he says can be downplayed by saying L´equipe

i wonder why ppl are so furious about doping in cycling while they ignore other sports...im sure cycling doping rules and testing in american football would instantly change superbowl contenders but somehow ppl and even journalist dont give a damn

 

[Cobblestones]

i wonder why ppl are so furious about doping in cycling while they ignore other sports...im sure cycling doping rules and testing in american football would instantly change superbowl contenders but somehow ppl and even journalist dont give a damn

This crops up now and then. The answer is always: I don't care about football. Not my sport, not my problem. Let football fans sort that out.

 

[Winterfold]

Tennis is so suspiscous to me.

I know racket technology accounts for a lot of the increase in pace of the ball, but the way the guys are now so much bigger built, but still with amazing agility and stamina with 2/3/4 hours of constant stop/starting in very hot conditions.

 

[flicker]

Someone here recently posted that the last bastion or fallback position of the Fanboy is the "everyone's doing it, so it's a level playing field" etc.. and from what I have seen this resonates with most of the Fanboy base. Just the other day someone responded to my Facebook post about the NY Times article saying "I stopped trying to figure out who were the good guys and who were the bad guys a long time ago"

The fanboy will always lump all riders who ever took a drug together whether they went about their business quietly (Big Mig) or ruined other rider's careers or enorced OMERTA as much as possible. To me there is a huge difference.

Doping is doping. I believe that across the board in sports our heroes are dopers. So I only have 3 choices. Don't watch the sports. Watch the sports and pretend my hero is clean. Choose to root for the doper I choose to like.
PS: I betcha I have been watching cycling longer then you.
Here is another tip. When Armstrong comes on turn the volume off. It is better for everyone that way.

 

[Kender]

Federer BTW is also a Nike man, for whatever that's worth.

so is tiger

 

[forty four]

you all do realize doping/cheating will never ever ever ever ever go away it is the nature of competition and the types who are competitive. accept it and enjoy the spectacle that is sport or stop watching sports its that simple it really is.

 

[unsheath]

Cleaner by association.

I would have steered clear of Bolt and used Phelps myself..

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

The big difference is that LA has a lot more attached to his alleged doping than either of these two. The cortisone TUE, the six retroactive EPO positives and the Ashenden interview, the allegations by Anderson, O'Reilly, the IM between FA and JV, the connections to Ferrari, and then there's the two-ton elephant - Landis confession.

Bolt has never been tied to anything other than very fast times in a sport where others have tested positive. Federer not tied to anything other than allegations of others doping in his sport.

Quite the difference.

 

[Benotti69]

The big difference is that LA has a lot more attached to his alleged doping than either of these two. The cortisone TUE, the six retroactive EPO positives and the Ashenden interview, the allegations by Anderson, O'Reilly, the IM between FA and JV, the connections to Ferrari, and then there's the two-ton elephant - Landis confession.

He is Pharmastrong!

Bolt has never been tied to anything other than very fast times in a sport where others have tested positive.

Well, most open eyed people know that 100m has a very checkered past, so for me what Bolt has done will eventually be outed, like a Balco or other..

Federer not tied to anything other than allegations of others doping in his sport.

Tennis has been a strong opponent of testing for PEDs for a long time and one can only deduce that it is not clean.

Quite the difference.

The difference is media related, as Lance has had a lot of brown thrown at him and lots of it sticks, justifiably .

Bolt is in a sport which is as dirty as pro cycling, probably every last 100metres gold medallist has tested positive since Ben Johnson at some stage in their career. Carl Lewis tested positive in the USA trials prior to the olympics Johnson was caught

Federer?, tennis has very poor testing regimes and is one of the 'clean image' sports, but the pace of the serves has become so fast that there must be some enhancement. Nadal's physique looks very OTT to me so, who knows..

Human's cheat to win.

 

[cody_57]

i wonder why ppl are so furious about doping in cycling while they ignore other sports

So do I! And not just fans, but the controlling bodies as well.

This crops up now and then. The answer is always: I don't care about football. Not my sport, not my problem. Let football fans sort that out.

Not sure if this is too easy an answer? Maybe it's the nature of football (a team sport) vs. cycling? (a team sport focused on one member of that team)

But, what about baseball and or ice hockey where the stars on the team can be bigger than the team? Why don't people care about the doping there to the same extent as cycling? Why don't the organizing bodies 'try to clean up their sports?'

Here's a question: how much money is made by (for instance) the TdeF organizers? Maybe that's the driving force behind the willingness in some sports to turn a blind eye to doping.

 

[The Hitch]

i remember when i saw one of these fawning documentaries about bolt, one point they made was that the only other person that had run as fast as bolt was ben johnson in 1988, who still represents the great shame for athletics. What they meant by that was that natural bolt = better than everyone else doping. But i dont see him as superhuman any more than i see la as superhuman.

Also people said gatlin was clean. That was until he was busted.

And i think it is in the interest of athletics to make sure, that their great celebrity who makes them millions if not billions, does not get busted. much like the uci doesnt want lance busted

 

[lean mean &green]

The fanboy will always lump all riders who ever took a drug together whether they went about their business quietly (Big Mig) or ruined other rider's careers or enorced OMERTA as much as possible. To me there is a huge difference.

if it seems like i'm picking on you i'm not. i condemn LA just as much as MI. indurain operated completely under the radar in a pre-festina/pre-wada era in which authorities and fans were mostly unaware of the powerful effects of EPO. he never faced the challenges to his sporting performances the way that LA does. he didn't need to intimidate and manipulate the media as LA has had to do. who's to say how indurain may have reacted to these same conflicts?

it's time to take big mig off the pedestal if you haven't already.