Articles about $10,000 bikes - What's the point?

[badboygolf16v]

Parera's post sums it up, but not just for Felt.

Any bike manufacturer, Serotta, Colnago, Specialized, Cannondale, Parlee, whoever, that charges mega bucks for a frame is taking the ****.

It's just pure BS.

 

[Parera]

Parera's post sums it up, but not just for Felt.

Any bike manufacturer, Serotta, Colnago, Specialized, Cannondale, Parlee, whoever, that charges mega bucks for a frame is taking the ****.

It's just pure BS.

And even sadder is the fact the ducati comes in a 1-3k less than some of these halo bikes.

 

[ElChingon]

Worse yet is stories on how dumb stories on $10K bikes are. Looks like the CN bike reviewer is getting super lazy or no one will ship him a bike anymore (I wonder why )

 

[Maxiton]

Worse yet is stories on how dumb stories on $10K bikes are. Looks like the CN bike reviewer is getting super lazy or no one will ship him a bike anymore (I wonder why )

Funny, I guess I hadn't even read the OP until you pointed it out. What's interesting to me is that, since cycling has always been primarily a working class sport, about the only segment of society it didn't target specifically was the upper middle class and above. The combination of carbon fiber and marketing has put paid to that, however, and in the process cycling has become, in part, the "new golf."

End result: more money for cycling companies and better exercise for everyone. I'm totally okay with that, just so long as no one gets any douchery on me, and just so long as truly worthwhile products remain appreciated and available.

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

Not to belabor a point, but let's look at the Cannondale Ultimate EVO or whatever.

MSRP is $12,100. What do you get for this?

SRAM Red kit with Hollowgram Cranks. Let's say $2,100 for this.
DT Swiss wheels. $3,000
Saddle, Stem, Bars, Post: $1,000.

That's $6,100.

That leaves like $6K for the frame. WTF? This has to be the absolute worst deal in cycling.

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

Not to belabor a point, but let's look at the Cannondale Ultimate EVO or whatever.

MSRP is $12,100. What do you get for this?

SRAM Red kit with Hollowgram Cranks. Let's say $2,100 for this.
DT Swiss wheels. $3,000
Saddle, Stem, Bars, Post: $1,000.

That's $6,100.

That leaves like $6K for the frame. WTF? This has to be the absolute worst deal in cycling.

I'm not anti-Cannondale. I own a Scalpel. But they're a marketing joke.

 

[Notso Swift]

Funny, I guess I hadn't even read the OP until you pointed it out. What's interesting to me is that, since cycling has always been primarily a working class sport, about the only segment of society it didn't target specifically was the upper middle class and above. The combination of carbon fiber and marketing has put paid to that, however, and in the process cycling has become, in part, the "new golf."

End result: more money for cycling companies and better exercise for everyone. I'm totally okay with that, just so long as no one gets any douchery on me, and just so long as truly worthwhile products remain appreciated and available.

In Australia Road cycling was always more middle class, track was generally working class.
A lot of that was driven out of the Pro v Amateur split and there was a chance to earn (much needed) money on the track, so a lot of guys went pro early, and once you are pro you could never go back

 

[laziali]

I don't have a huge problem with bikes like the Time RXRS or the Colnago C59, the Cyfacs, etc. costing a lot of money, since they are keeping their manufacturing in-house (Colnago only in part). I understand that hand-made bikes cost more, and they should. Time's manufacturing process is absolutely incredible. ...

Bold bit ^

The C59 and EPQ (ie the lugged carbon frames) are still 100% made in Italy. Tubes are manufactured at a facility near Cambiagio that also does F1 carbon and then the frames are still lugged in the workshop beneath Ernesto's house. Paint shop is also in the Po valley (I forget where, but closer to Torino).

The M10 monocoque is made in Taiwan and painted in Italy.

The CX-1 duocoque is made in two triangles in Taiwan and them assembled and painted in Italy.

The other carbon and alu is not worth a mention.

Steel Masters are still made in Cambiagio, but only in a limited run once each year.

Yes, I know far too much about Colnago, but I probably love them (almost) as much as the wife.

PS - RDV, your C40 imho is probably the best frame for its era of all time. Mapei etc won so many races on that bike. (and before this turns into da klinic, yes I know Mapei were as juiced as everyone else) - here's a photo of the legendary Michele Bartoli rocking his C40 in true Italiano style - only guy who had more style was Cipollini ...

These guys, not so much ........

 

[oldborn]

I see here a lot Italian nostalgic posts
So for you non europeans as I understand, no problemo for C59 or De Rosa King 3 RS for 6249 euro dealer price, but muchos problemos for same price range barbarian bikes as Specialized, Cannondale etc?
Why?

 

[RDV4ROUBAIX]

Bold bit ^

The C59 and EPQ (ie the lugged carbon frames) are still 100% made in Italy. Tubes are manufactured at a facility near Cambiagio that also does F1 carbon and then the frames are still lugged in the workshop beneath Ernesto's house. Paint shop is also in the Po valley (I forget where, but closer to Torino).

The M10 monocoque is made in Taiwan and painted in Italy.

The CX-1 duocoque is made in two triangles in Taiwan and them assembled and painted in Italy.

The other carbon and alu is not worth a mention.

Steel Masters are still made in Cambiagio, but only in a limited run once each year.

Yes, I know far too much about Colnago, but I probably love them (almost) as much as the wife.

PS - RDV, your C40 imho is probably the best frame for its era of all time. Mapei etc won so many races on that bike. (and before this turns into da klinic, yes I know Mapei were as juiced as everyone else) - here's a photo of the legendary Michele Bartoli rocking his C40 in true Italiano style - only guy who had more style was Cipollini ...

Oh, I'm very well aware of the historical aspects and technical contributions of Colnago. My old C40 was the quintessential game changer of the road race machine. And anyone that's been on this forum for any length of time knows my 2nd favorite racer after De Vlaeminck was Bartoli, and most of the Italians from the old Mapei squad for that matter, Tafi, Ballerini (RIP). Thanks for the reminder.

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

I see here a lot Italian nostalgic posts
So for you non europeans as I understand, no problemo for C59 or De Rosa King 3 RS for 6249 euro dealer price, but muchos problemos for same price range barbarian bikes as Specialized, Cannondale etc?
Why?

Colnago: hand made in Italy. Tons of sizes and options available.
Specialized: mass produced out of molds in China. Same with Cannondale. Five sizes. Again, you're not paying for quality when you buy Specialized. You're paying for them to sponsor Astana, Saxo Bank, HTC, etc.

As far as the Colnago price, a C59 Italia is $3800 from Mike at Maestro. Two grand cheaper than buying it in the States. If he can get me a GDOB, I'm going for it. Wish they still made the PRAL color.

 

[oldborn]

Colnago: hand made in Italy. Tons of sizes and options available.
Specialized: mass produced out of molds in China. Same with Cannondale. Five sizes. Again, you're not paying for quality when you buy Specialized. You're paying for them to sponsor Astana, Saxo Bank, HTC, etc.

As far as the Colnago price, a C59 Italia is $3800 from Mike at Maestro. Two grand cheaper than buying it in the States. If he can get me a GDOB, I'm going for it. Wish they still made the PRAL color.

Thanks!
If they are hand made that does not mean there is few of them, right? I really do not know how many Colnago production is per year but it is still thousands of them IMHO.
I really do not know where are you from but that 3800$ for C59 is silly price, get me one dude
How about 14000$
http://www.racycles.com/product.aspx?catid=2,430,595&pid=5248
Or 16399$ http://www.wrenchscience.com/road/frames/Colnago/C59+Italia+Di2+Limited+Edition/2011/
I am just saying

So Colnago can be rip off for sure same as Canondale or Giant IMO.

 

[avanti]

A few years ago McQuaid objecting to track frames costing $100,000 plus.
http://road.cc/content/news/15922-u...rule-clarification-all-about-stopping-team-gb

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

Thanks!
If they are hand made that does not mean there is few of them, right? I really do not know how many Colnago production is per year but it is still thousands of them IMHO.
I really do not know where are you from but that 3800$ for C59 is silly price, get me one dude
How about 14000$
http://www.racycles.com/product.aspx?catid=2,430,595&pid=5248
Or 16399$ http://www.wrenchscience.com/road/frames/Colnago/C59+Italia+Di2+Limited+Edition/2011/
I am just saying

So Colnago can be rip off for sure same as Canondale or Giant IMO.

I think you are quite misinformed. We are talking about halo bikes, not their entire line. Many Colnagos are made in the Far East as well. We are talking about the C59.

As far as the $3800, here's the site. http://www.maestro-uk.com
I have bought two frames from him previously. He's a great chap.

 

[fabramowski]

I think you are quite misinformed. We are talking about halo bikes, not their entire line. Many Colnagos are made in the Far East as well. We are talking about the C59.

As far as the $3800, here's the site. http://www.maestro-uk.com
I have bought two frames from him previously. He's a great chap.

that 2799 euro's = 4366 us dollars = your crazy....(1 euro = 1.56 us) then add campy record 11sp = 2155 us dollars, zipp 404 = 2100 us dollars, so your still looking over 10 grand for a bicycle, I would rather have one of thesehttp://www.ducatiusa.com/bikes/monster/1100__evo_/index.do so atleast I could carry one of these. http://www.topspeed.com/motorcycles/motorcycle-news/ducati-monster-the-chick-magnet-ar77162/picture312453.html..

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

that 3800 euro's = 5928 us dollars = your crazy....(1 euro = 1.56 us) then add campy record 11sp = 2155 us dollars, zipp 404 = 2100 so your still looking over 10 grand for a bicycle, I would rather have one of thesehttp://www.ducatiusa.com/bikes/monster/1100__evo_/index.do so atleast I could carry one of these. http://www.topspeed.com/motorcycles/motorcycle-news/ducati-monster-the-chick-magnet-ar77162/picture312453.html..

Are you just bad at math? You're confusing Euros and pounds. You don't even have the prices right, even though I showed you the web site.

2799 Euros = $3731 USD. The exchange rate is 1.33 Euros per dollar.

I can't believe I have to explain this to people.

 

[fabramowski]

Are you just bad at math? You're confusing Euros and pounds. You don't even have the prices right, even though I showed you the web site.

2799 Euros = $3731 USD. The exchange rate is 1.33 Euros per dollar.

I can't believe I have to explain this to people.

my bad...so you save what ~700 bucks.....so you upgrade to super record..still over 10 large..and few people can pay that for a bicycle....

 

[DirtyWorks]

RDV - suprised you would pay so much for lugged carbon. Surely this is an outdated manufacturing technique?

Not really. It just depends on the scale of production. If a brand wants to use many models as their niche, lugged is the way to go. If the business strategy is volume-based, then molds are the way to go.

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

my bad...so you save what ~700 bucks.....so you upgrade to super record..still over 10 large..and few people can pay that for a bicycle....

Try again. Seriously. Addition is not hard if you focus.

$3700 for the frame. (that's over $2000 less than US retail).
$2000 for SUPER RECORD from the same place
Campy Shamals: $1000, same place.
Add a grand for tires, bars, stem, saddle and you get?

$7700 for a C59 with Super Record 11, Shamals, and nice bits.

Or? $12,000 for a Cannondale with Sram Red.

 

[oldborn]

Try again. Seriously. Addition is not hard if you focus.

$3700 for the frame. (that's over $2000 less than US retail).
$2000 for SUPER RECORD from the same place
Campy Shamals: $1000, same place.
Add a grand for tires, bars, stem, saddle and you get?

$7700 for a C59 with Super Record 11, Shamals, and nice bits.

Or? $12,000 for a Cannondale with Sram Red.

Hey, hey, hey, that Cannonball has SRM and mavic cosmic carbone
Add that and you get 20,000$ for C59
Anyway it is too much for me

 

[Notso Swift]

It is funny how we are all cringing at the Felt F1, and I know I am one who wouldn't touch it for the dollars involved, however...
RIDE Cycling review which is one of the best magazines in the world that pioneered some of the quantifiable data we now expect in a non-subjective test (Velo news basically copied it) tested a F1 in the current issue, as well as a number of other top end bikes:
Time RXRS
Cannondale SuperSix EVO
Felt F1
Carrera Erakle
Baum Turanti

If you read the Felt I can tell you it stacked up exceptionally well, they thought it was outstanding for a super light bike (the build with Di2 was 6.0x KG ex-pedals/cages) in feel and how planted it was in cornering. Subjectively, the bike was riden by 1 for extended test (ie months) and 5 more for a quick spin. Universally it was praised.

OK I would have the Time without a thought (it also did well, though 1.5kg heavier looks bad) but maybe we dismiss some of these "johnny come lately" volume based manufactures a little too fast...

 

[Parera]

OK I would have the Time without a thought (it also did well, though 1.5kg heavier looks bad) but maybe we dismiss some of these "johnny come lately" volume based manufactures a little too fast...

I don't think they are dismissing Felt as a Johnny come lately, rather that just they are overcharging for that particular bike. If you Do the calculation, it's just a ghastly price for the frame relative to custom options widely available.

 

[Shady87]

Apparently you can get 'Halo' commuters too.

http://www.gucci.com/us/styles/284332JA3108730#

$14000 for what?

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

Hey, hey, hey, that Cannonball has SRM and mavic cosmic carbone
Add that and you get 20,000$ for C59
Anyway it is too much for me

It doesn't have an SRM and it doesn't have Cosmic Carbones either.
Add that to the C59 and you get...$11,000.

Still less than the Cannondale without those.

 

[42x16ss]

I don't think they are dismissing Felt as a Johnny come lately, rather that just they are overcharging for that particular bike. If you Do the calculation, it's just a ghastly price for the frame relative to custom options widely available.

That's it precisely. The major manufacturers aren't building bad bikes, otherwise they wouldn't get extended deals with ProTeams (unlike say, Batavus) or faithful customers. They just don't provide value for money at the top end.

They do however, have the capacity and financial turnover to manufacture large quantities of bikes and provide some to ProTeams. If some of the custom manufacturers had the capacity to sponsor big teams, we would probably see a huge shakeup of the brands used in the pro peloton.