Australian Crime Commission investigation finds widespread doping

[observer]

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/bombers-secret-deal-exposed-20130327-2guq0.html

this sheds some light on dodgy dealings within ASADA. Many aussies are so enamoured with their footy clubs that they'll do this stuff to help them out.

 

[Cookster15]

I think it is now becoming obvious the sensationalist press conference conducted on February 7 was highly premature for political reasons - still not 1 single player named let alone charged or banned. I don't doubt that PEDs are or have been used by some AFL and NRL players but the manner in which this event has unfolded since February 7 has become farcial.

http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/drugsinsport-response-hysterical-20130529-2nc4h.html

Mr Clare and Sports Minister Lundy have since softened their rhetoric and argue the main sign of success is ''behaviour change'' rather than catching criminals

What happened to the "Organised Crime Links" stated by Clair and Lundy in the Press conference? It seems the ACC and ASADA have been handed a poisoned chalice by their political masters - doomed to failure.

Ever since February 7 ASADA have seemed increasingly desperate to find any evidence at all to support the hyped up press conference. Even going so far as to suggest Peptides may have contributed to the Cancer which claimed the Life of a League player. After that announcement and the grief it must have caused the family it was confirmed by the Medical fraternity there is no research that confirms such a claim.

By all means clean cheats out of sports but it needs to be done the right way.

 

[blackcat]

why would australia be any different from europe and north america. because doping is not a character issue (see: vaughters) and should not be interpreted thru this lens.

nrl aru afl all infested like the epl, and other continental soccer leagues, and the n american pro sport leagues.

 

[sittingbison]

the biggest problem is the complete lack of co-operation with ASADA by NRL, AFL and most of all the players. All the players were told by lawyers to keep schtumm, and without coercion powers ASADA had no choice but cancel all interviews.

For heavens sake James Hird is still the coach of Essendon after organising and overseeing Danks peptide, actovegin etc program...and taking it himself.

Certainly the politicians jumped the gun, taking some heat off Gillard for about an afternoon. However the subsequent attitudes of NRL and AFL have been disgraceful.

 

[Nick777]

the biggest problem is the complete lack of co-operation with ASADA by NRL, AFL and most of all the players. All the players were told by lawyers to keep schtumm, and without coercion powers ASADA had no choice but cancel all interviews.

For heavens sake James Hird is still the coach of Essendon after organising and overseeing Danks peptide, actovegin etc program...and taking it himself.

Certainly the politicians jumped the gun, taking some heat off Gillard for about an afternoon. However the subsequent attitudes of NRL and AFL have been disgraceful.

Where has it been reported that the Essendon players are being investigated for Actovegin use?

 

[thehog]

Where has it been reported that the Essendon players are being investigated for Actovegin use?

They were seen dumping empty cartons by a French highway just before a game

 

[Nick777]

the biggest problem is the complete lack of co-operation with ASADA by NRL, AFL and most of all the players. All the players were told by lawyers to keep schtumm, and without coercion powers ASADA had no choice but cancel all interviews.

[/IMG]

That is flat out not true.

I am not sure where you are getting your info from, but you might want to consider a new source.

 

[Nick777]

They were seen dumping empty cartons by a French highway just before a game

I was a little concerned when I heard that the Sydney Swans bus broke down on the way to the MCG last Friday night

 

[thehog]

I was a little concerned when I heard that the Sydney Swans bus broke down on the way to the MCG last Friday night

Got to be hard to transfuse 21 players plus interchange before a game

Jokes aside drug use in AFL is rampant. Still is. Several VFL/AFL players used to come to AiS for testing. Most just picked up a stash of gear for the season.

WCE took it to the systematic level. Barber made those boys so strong but kept their speed. Too many guys were bulking in the off season and lost agility.

These days it's a cycling 2000's levels. Keeping them lean but super strong.

Not sure if they'd be mixing blood though. But you never know. Much easier to undertake in a clubroom than in a GT.

 

[Nick777]

Got to be hard to transfuse 21 players plus interchange before a game

Jokes aside drug use in AFL is rampant. Still is. Several VFL/AFL players used to come to AiS for testing. Most just picked up a stash of gear for the season.

WCE took it to the systematic level. Barber made those boys so strong but kept their speed. Too many guys were bulking in the off season and lost agility.

These days it's a cycling 2000's levels. Keeping them lean but super strong.

Not sure if they'd be mixing blood though. But you never know. Much easier to undertake in a clubroom than in a GT.

A mate of mine has a very fast brother. Went to train in WA in the early 90's with Capobianco. Came home pretty quickly.

 

[sittingbison]

That is flat out not true.

I am not sure where you are getting your info from, but you might want to consider a new source.

ermmm....have you living under a rock?

http://www.news.com.au/breaking-new...w-sharks-players/story-e6frfkp9-1226631784380

http://www.canberratimes.com.au/rug...es-back-sharks-interviews-20130512-2jg7u.html

http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-league/...rack-graham-20130513-2jie4.html#ixzz2Ujvmzbkq

Graham is the only Sharks player to appear before ASADA, and the way things are headed, it will remain that way.

 

[Nick777]

ermmm....have you living under a rock?

http://www.news.com.au/breaking-new...w-sharks-players/story-e6frfkp9-1226631784380

http://www.canberratimes.com.au/rug...es-back-sharks-interviews-20130512-2jg7u.html

Where does it say that AFL players aren't co-operating? I can't find it.

 

[Spider1964]

ermmm....have you living under a rock?

http://www.news.com.au/breaking-new...w-sharks-players/story-e6frfkp9-1226631784380

http://www.canberratimes.com.au/rug...es-back-sharks-interviews-20130512-2jg7u.html

Sorry Bison, but I have to agree with Nick777 here. You've lumped both NRL and AFL into one box and that is the error (I think) that he is pointing out.

It is simply not true that the AFL clubs are not co-operating, as distinct from the NRL clubs. Even your linked articles are based on the non co-operation of NRL clubs.

From the AFL CEO to the AFL players involved, all have assisted with the enquiry.

Doesn't change the fact that they have been using illegal methods, but they have assisted the enquiry.

 

[Spider1964]

Got to be hard to transfuse 21 players plus interchange before a game

Jokes aside drug use in AFL is rampant. Still is. Several VFL/AFL players used to come to AiS for testing. Most just picked up a stash of gear for the season.

WCE took it to the systematic level. Barber made those boys so strong but kept their speed. Too many guys were bulking in the off season and lost agility.

These days it's a cycling 2000's levels. Keeping them lean but super strong.

Not sure if they'd be mixing blood though. But you never know. Much easier to undertake in a clubroom than in a GT.

Mostly true, particularly the WCE stuff, first hand knowledge of that one.

Not so sure the program is at cycling 2000's level though? I tend to think it's dialed back a bit from that level? Could be wrong.

Party gas is a HUGE issue for all the clubs though... where do you think Dane Swan goes after weekend commitments are finished? Been known to hop on a plane and hit the party circuit in Cairns, sample a bit of euro backpacker, bit of gear. It's no Tenerife style action, but not too many drug testers up there.

 

[sittingbison]

thats because ASADA didn't start with AFL because they had to let the Essendon inquiry run its course. AFL players have been advised the same as NRL players - say nothing, don't incriminate yourself by dobbing in others.

Demetriou et al are all paying lip service only, the last thing they want is a drugs scandal. Its all been nicely swept under the carpet since those idiotic press announcements. Not even James Hird has been sacked or charged, despite him organising Danks involvement and taking the gear himself.

BTW ASADA don't have the heart to charge Melbourne after the 4 Corners revelations of Dank injecting their players....performance UNenhancing lol

 

[Nick777]

thats because ASADA didn't start with AFL because they had to let the Essendon inquiry run its course. AFL players have been advised the same as NRL players - say nothing, don't incriminate yourself by dobbing in others.

Demetriou et al are all paying lip service only, the last thing they want is a drugs scandal. Its all been nicely swept under the carpet since those idiotic press announcements. Not even James Hird has been sacked or charged, despite him organising Danks involvement and taking the gear himself.

BTW ASADA don't have the heart to charge Melbourne after the 4 Corners revelations of Dank injecting their players....performance UNenhancing lol

ADADA have interviewed plenty of Essendon players, and nobody refused to be interviewed.

Edited to say that the interviews are now over, and all players co-operated.

 

[sittingbison]

Its not that they refused to be interviewed, its what they said in the interview...or more importantly what they DIDN'T say in the interview.

omerta lives on

 

[thehog]

Mostly true, particularly the WCE stuff, first hand knowledge of that one.

Not so sure the program is at cycling 2000's level though? I tend to think it's dialed back a bit from that level? Could be wrong.

Party gas is a HUGE issue for all the clubs though... where do you think Dane Swan goes after weekend commitments are finished? Been known to hop on a plane and hit the party circuit in Cairns, sample a bit of euro backpacker, bit of gear. It's no Tenerife style action, but not too many drug testers up there.

Many of those WC guys went batty.

Turley got out. It was roids, disco biscuits, Valium. Repeat to fade. Over and over again. Went surfing and never came back.

Mainwaring couldn't kick it amongst many others.

Worsefold just did roids. Left the biscuits to the kids.

Barber killed a lot of those kids. They were bloody good. But had consequence.

Bit like what Walsh did to his 'angels' on the track program.

Neiwand is a very sad story. Along with Vinnie. They don't even know who they are anymore. Very sad.

 

[Nick777]

Many of those WC guys went batty.

Turley got out. It was roids, disco biscuits, Valium. Repeat to fade. Over and over again. Went surfing and never came back.

Mainwaring couldn't kick it amongst many others.

Worsefold just did roids. Left the biscuits to the kids.

Barber killed a lot of those kids. They were bloody good. But had consequence.

Bit like what Walsh did to his 'angels' on the track program.

Neiwand is a very sad story. Along with Vinnie. They don't even know who they are anymore. Very sad.

Chad Fletcher

 

[DirtyWorks]

thats because ASADA didn't start with AFL because they had to let the Essendon inquiry run its course. AFL players have been advised the same as NRL players - say nothing, don't incriminate yourself by dobbing in others.

Demetriou et al are all paying lip service only, the last thing they want is a drugs scandal. Its all been nicely swept under the carpet since those idiotic press announcements. Not even James Hird has been sacked or charged, despite him organising Danks involvement and taking the gear himself.

BTW ASADA don't have the heart to charge Melbourne after the 4 Corners revelations of Dank injecting their players....performance UNenhancing lol

I am assuming, based on the little I've read, ASADA is set up like USADA. Based on that assumption, IF the athletes went straight to ASADA, then ASADA applies the rules of the sports federation. If the anti-doping rules are relaxed, then there's nothing the ASADA can do but enforce the relaxed sports federation's rules. That's because the authority begins and ends with the sport federation. The national ADA merely enforces the federation's rules.

IMHO, the UCI did not plan for the chain of unlikely events that gave USADA the opportunity to hand out long overdue doping bans. Many other sports seem to do a much better job suppressing their doping positives and ensuing controversy. That doesn't mean your outrage is not valid. The system is set up to maximize entertainment, not create a legitimate game, regardless of the sport.

 

[rata de sentina]

DW
All OZ professional codes have signed up to wada code so they are unable to be more "relaxed". That's why asada is running this not the codes. Some clubs have had their own internal investigations mainly looking at governance issues. They also have to wait on asada.

 

[Nick777]

Its not that they refused to be interviewed, its what they said in the interview...or more importantly what they DIDN'T say in the interview.

omerta lives on

Let me know what they said in the interviews, as nobody except you and the players seem to know this.

 

[sittingbison]

James Hird and Stephen Dank forced all Essendon players to sign non-disclosure agreements or be sacked, so it would appear the players are unable to say anything to anyone. And as all players in both codes have been advised by their Players Association lawyers to say nowt, ASADA has had to cancel player interviews.

omerta!

Nick you seem to be a little defensive about Essendon. This is not about Essendon, it is about professional sport (and indeed all sport) being infected with a PED problem, and exposure to organised crime. The issue is far more pervasive and widespread than the general public wants to know about or Demetriou and his ilk wants to acknowledge, its best for all concerned to sweep it under the carpet...after all the show must go on. To whit not a single Essendon, Melbourne or Cronulla player has been suspended following the revelation they were all injected with peptides and various other substances. The sad truth is all these clubs should have been prevented from fielding any players on their current senior roster for two years. And anybody at all associated with or knowledge of the practice summarily sacked.

To pretend that Essendon, Melbourne and Cronulla players and for that matter the several other NRL clubs Dank was previoulsly associated with were not on a team based sytematic PED program is ostrich mentality, which we have seen in cycling for ever, certainly the past 20 or 30 years when it became systematically organised.

 

[Nick777]

James Hird and Stephen Dank forced all Essendon players to sign non-disclosure agreements or be sacked, so it would appear the players are unable to say anything to anyone. And as all players in both codes have been advised by their Players Association lawyers to say nowt, ASADA has had to cancel player interviews.

omerta!

Nick you seem to be a little defensive about Essendon. This is not about Essendon, it is about professional sport (and indeed all sport) being infected with a PED problem, and exposure to organised crime. The issue is far more pervasive and widespread than the general public wants to know about or Demetriou and his ilk wants to acknowledge, its best for all concerned to sweep it under the carpet...after all the show must go on. To whit not a single Essendon, Melbourne or Cronulla player has been suspended following the revelation they were all injected with peptides and various other substances. The sad truth is all these clubs should have been prevented from fielding any players on their current senior roster for two years. And anybody at all associated with or knowledge of the practice summarily sacked.

To pretend that Essendon, Melbourne and Cronulla players and for that matter the several other NRL clubs Dank was previoulsly associated with were not on a team based sytematic PED program is ostrich mentality, which we have seen in cycling for ever, certainly the past 20 or 30 years when it became systematically organised.

No mate. Not defensive.. just correcting some of your factually incorrect statements.

You lumped Essendon in with the NRL. The Essendon player attitute to the investigation couldn't be more opposite to the NRL's players. ASADA didn't need to cancel player interviews with Essendon. Every player that was asked to be interviewed, was interviewed.

The NDA was more about IP than omerta. The players have to sign similar agreements so that they cannot disclose game plans if they are traded.

No player has been suspended, simply because the investigation is still going.

Some players may well be suspended down the track... who knows?

 

[M Sport]

James Hird and Stephen Dank forced all Essendon players to sign non-disclosure agreements or be sacked, so it would appear the players are unable to say anything to anyone.

The non-disclosure agreements the players signed are worthless. The players are bound to the club and the AFL's rules. The AFL rules require them to participate in ADADA hearings. On top of that the players are contracted to the Essendon football club and the board (allegedly) had no knowledge of the non-disclosure agreements. That the non-disclosure agreements purpose was to suppress allegedly illegal practices also makes them void.

And as all players in both codes have been advised by their Players Association lawyers to say nowt, ASADA has had to cancel player interviews.

It's been pointed out you are wrong about the Essendon players. You need to do a bit more research.