Bin Laden dead

[Clearly Unstable]

It great to see elementary school kids have such excellent photoshopping skills. What adult would be lame enough to bother? Oh wait, I forgot the "intellectual" conservatives.

My bad.

 

[woodie]

Can someone please explain why the photos of a dead bin-laden pose a "security risk" to the US??
wtf is Obama on about now??
I smell a rat...

Because if the photo's are released then people who are still part of al-Qaeda will use them as propaganda and to influence young people into joining them and killing more innocent people. Releasing the photo could potentially cause more trouble. Killing him in the first place will probably open up a whole can of worms anyway.

Why do people want to see someone with half their head missing anyway? I sure don't.

 

[Stingray34]

Oh gosh, no; they can't release any photos of the dead SOB because that'd just inflame Islamic fundamentalists. Good thing they've kept everybody happy by disposing of the man's body according to Islamic custom. They'd have a real fight on their hands otherwise.

The yanks might've murdered a man on someone else's sovreign soil, right in front of his kids and wounded the guy's wife, but as long as they respect the fecker's religious beliefs, everyone's peachy.

So, let's see: 3,000 dead Americans versus 1,000,000 dead Iraqs and Afganis. yep, that's justice done.

This is why Americans will never be known for their architecture: no sense of proportion.

Difference?

 

[fatandfast]

It will be interesting to see if the ****stani people will allow the US to enter their country with aircraft, kill a few people, take a body or two fly away after exploding a helicopter. Now there government says we knew nothing about it in one of the most militarized zoned in the region. If this causes an "uprising" I ma interested to see what US policy does about a revolt that has nukes.

Hillary is going door to door trying to get guns and money for rebels in Libya, automatic weapons are not good for storekeepers and housewives in the US but in Libya or ****stan one should be included when getting a loaf of bread. This is going to be the biggest mess we have ever created. Every time the longest running war in US history has some chance of a draw down we stoke the fire.

 

[blutto]

Blutto,

I think that saying that the US supported Bin Laden directly is a really slippery slope. The US through the ****stanis funneled arms and money to the Mujaheddin. The Mujaheddin is a large group with many groups within are often at odds with eachother.

Depending on what you read or believe the US may have favored a Mujaheddin group led by Massoud who was clearly a moderate Muslim and I think if you looked at the key players in the Afghan military today, you could probably trace many of the higher ranking Generals to Massoud.

What probably happened however is that the ****stanis favored a really ugly character in Gulbuddin Hekmatyar and there is little doubt that a significant amount of our resources went to him. That is where the connection to Bin Laden is found.

I think saying that Bin Laden was our guy really inaccurate and sloppy. He was a "friend of a friend". He was also one of scores of bored Saudis that headed to Afghanistan to fight the infidel.

I think we let the ****stanis really lead us astray on that one. More and more they are the unwanted gift that keeps on giving..

As I am sure you are aware, Bin Laden through Al Queda had Massoud killed in a suicide bomb attack as he was the leader of the Northern Alliance who opposed the Taliban.

This is why the statement that the Mujaheddin that the US supported "coalesced" into the Taliban is also sloppy and inaccurate. Some of them definitely did but some of them continue to fight the Taliban today.

....while I agree that yes what I said is in a very strict sense is a bit of a slippery slope...but the counter case is also a bit of a slippery slope given the strong connections bin Laden had to the US political establishment ( and especially the Bush family )...but I still stand by my point that US support built the stage upon which bin Laden played out his hero role...without that stage he could have just as easily remained in Saudi Arabia as a disaffected ideologue mumbling into his tea...

...the other point I would like to make, and which incidentally, I didn't have time to make yesterday, is the way that US foreign policy has this tendency to be led astray...whether it was Chiang kai Shek supporters in post war China, the supporters of Diem in Vietnam, the officer corps in Iran, there is always somebody leading the US astray...while it makes for a great way to slide off the hook after a bad decision, if you look at the specifics of each situation mentioned, it seems the same people are always led astray....and in all those cases strong counter arguments were available that would not have led people astray...and furthermore, in all cases the folks who forced the decision that were led astray did very well for themselves....a cynic would say that those astray decisions were just the basis for make-work projects for the military complex and in a broad sense I kinda agree...I mean the results speak for themselves...

....and one final point...the Massoud assassination should be seen in context...allied as he was to the Northern Alliance ( which is based on a different set of tribes than those who back the Taliban and whose fight with those tribes goes back centuries) who are remnants of the segment of Afghan society which backed the Communists...so for the Taliban he was an enemy twice over....he was also against the drug trade which was the Northern Alliance's bread and butter ( and which the Taliban were at that time doing a very good job of eliminating )....so who wanted him killed? a lot of people, and for different reasons....I have no issue with the official story that identifies the man who pulled the trigger but I think the real story is who allowed him to get into position to pull that trigger...and in that part of the story there are several suspects...

...sorry to keep short forming my arguments but I'm trying real hard not to have a thesis break out on these pages...but Afganistan is a very complicated story and requires complex answers...still amazed we are actually doing such a good job piling thru this complexity...just waiting for a call for a group hug which would be so un-CN-forum-like that the very thought of it makes me giggle...

Cheers

blutto

 

[Clearly Unstable]

Drunk kids. [some of the girls are hot though....]

 

[patricknd]

Drunk kids. [some of the girls are hot though....]

and isn't hot girls what it's really all about?

 

[Stingray34]

Drunk kids. [some of the girls are hot though....]

Someone told those kids Alpha Beta Pi were putting on keggers.

BTW: which of those girls are hot?

 

[Stingray34]

It will be interesting to see if the ****stani people will allow the US to enter their country with aircraft, kill a few people, take a body or two fly away after exploding a helicopter. Now there government says we knew nothing about it in one of the most militarized zoned in the region. If this causes an "uprising" I ma interested to see what US policy does about a revolt that has nukes.

Hillary is going door to door trying to get guns and money for rebels in Libya, automatic weapons are not good for storekeepers and housewives in the US but in Libya or ****stan one should be included when getting a loaf of bread. This is going to be the biggest mess we have ever created. Every time the longest running war in US history has some chance of a draw down we stoke the fire.

Agree.

The White House also has real form when it comes to honeymoons gone sour: Saddam Hussein, Pinochet, Noriega...

You'd almost think they really like invading other countries, as if their economy depended on it...oh, right.

 

[flicker]

and isn't hot girls what it's really all about?

Obviously a bunch over oversexed young people. Nothing a couple cold showers and bible studies can't cure.

 

[flicker]

Honestly, all the radical muslims want are good jobs, nice houses, escalades,iphones,blonde wive(s) and a starbucks within 20miles.
Pure jealousy really, they are united as oppressed poor people by the radical islamic rhetoric.
Fact, as soon as the burka clad women, men in kaffias jump on an airliner close the first class curtains close, the burkas fall, the ciggies come out and the champagne flows. Pure hipocrisy, the radical muslims. Bin Laden was out whoring and drinking in his bad old days himself. The men who flew the airliners into the WTC were whoring and drinking it up in Vegas before their jihadist actions. Frauds.

 

[Stingray34]

If it weren't for double standards, the White House would have none at all.

http://media.smh.com.au/news/national-news/gruesome-photos-from-osama-compound-released-2344486.html

It's not who we are.We may unilaterally invade countries and massacre hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians, but we won't show you any video nasties.

Murderous yet prudish...what a combo

 

[Stingray34]

Honestly, all the radical muslims want are good jobs, nice houses, escalades,iphones,blonde wive(s) and a starbucks within 20miles.
Pure jealousy really, they are united as oppressed poor people by the radical islamic rhetoric.
Fact, as soon as the burka clad women, men in kaffias jump on an airliner close the first class curtains close, the burkas fall, the ciggies come out and the champagne flows. Pure hipocrisy, the radical muslims. Bin Laden was out whoring and drinking in his bad old days himself. The men who flew the airliners into the WTC were whoring and drinking it up in Vegas before their jihadist actions. Frauds.

You only dislike some frauds, don't you flick?

 

[Hugh Januss]

Someone told those kids Alpha Beta Pi were putting on keggers.

BTW: which of those girls are hot?

All college girls are hot if you are a middle aged man.

 

[flicker]

You only dislike some frauds, don't you flick?

Doping ended when !!!!HE!!!! retired, the witch and the witches brew has been dumped into the sand.

Seriously though, if you look at Iran and Indonesia a majority of the individuals Muslim and non-muslim would like to see normal relations with the USA.
That is where the largest population of Muslims live in Indonesia.
I have met many, many Egyptians,Indonesian, and Iranians in my area and they have no issue with the USA. They are free to live the life of their choosing, workwise, educationwise, freedom of women, practicing their religion.
If some choose to be Wahhabi in their countries that is their choice. They don't need to threaten me with violence or terror. Hey, what the heck, if they want to live like they were living a millenia ago that is their choice.
Watching AlJezeera though the AlQueda elders do look for real, and are scary.
I personally do not believe it is healthy to suppress their young people and turn them into jihadists'. It is a waste of the yong peoples potential and a very negative thing for people like me who choose to exprss myself, travel and have security and freedom.

 

[blutto]

Oh gosh, no; they can't release any photos of the dead SOB because that'd just inflame Islamic fundamentalists. Good thing they've kept everybody happy by disposing of the man's body according to Islamic custom. They'd have a real fight on their hands otherwise.

The yanks might've murdered a man on someone else's sovreign soil, right in front of his kids and wounded the guy's wife, but as long as they respect the fecker's religious beliefs, everyone's peachy.

So, let's see: 3,000 dead Americans versus 1,000,000 dead Iraqs and Afganis. yep, that's justice done.

This is why Americans will never be known for their architecture: no sense of proportion.

Difference?

...the scary thing is, that given a story I read recently that states that 60% of US youth figure torture is ok, the two crowds shown may be a lot closer in attitude than I find comfortable...

Cheers

blutto

 

[flicker]

...the scary thing is, that given a story I read recently that states that 60% of US youth figure torture is ok, the two crowds shown may be a lot closer in attitude than I find comfortable...

Cheers

blutto

A picture says a thousand words. Notice the picture below, no women.
Abso0lutely nothing against the Islamic religion but, why would the Wahhabis choose to cloister their women? Women are 25% smarter then men, so the Wahhabis are working on about 40% of their workforce, and intelligence bank. They also lack the spontaneity and positive influence of women.
They also forgot they came from a woman.........

 

[Stingray34]

Flicker

If some choose to be Warmongers in their countries that is their choice. They don't need to threaten me with violence or terror.

Flicker

Watching Fox news though the Republican elders do look for real, and are scary.

Flicker

I personally do not believe it is healthy to suppress their young people and turn them into government-sanctioned killing machines. It is a waste of the young peoples potential and a very negative thing.

Flicker

people like me who choose to express myself, travel and have security and freedom

Good golly, Flick! We agree!

 

[flicker]

My issue with the Taliban.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/nov/22/afghanistan-gender-women-taliban

 

[Stingray34]

A picture says a thousand words. Notice the picture below, no women.
Abso0lutely nothing against the American religion but, why would the Wall Streeters choose to cloister their women? Women are 25% smarter then men, so the Wall Streeters are working on about 40% of their workforce, and intelligence bank. They also lack the spontaneity and positive influence of women.
They also forgot they came from a woman.........

Yep, right again, flick.

 

[blutto]

...there is one more angle to the Massoud (sp?) story that should be noted...Massoud had, despite his Northern Alliance connection, some common cause with the Taliban and the southern tribes that supported that group...he was one of the few people that had a chance, albeit a small chance, of uniting Afghanistan..

...now if I were to play devil's advocate here and say that if someone were to want an Afghanistan that was inherently unstable internally and required an outside force to create order one of the first things to do is get rid of people that would scupper my plan...then you can bring in some stooge who was already on the payroll ( Karzai's job before becoming the mayor of Kabul...errr...leader of Afghanistan was as a consultant for the infamous us pipeline project bid that the Taliban eventually awarded to a non-US company...and were consequently threatened with a bombing campaign that would land them in the stoneage... ) and would feed the tribal mistrust that had already wracked the country for centuries....and voila you have permanent instability that needs a benevolent outside force to come in and save the country from itself...and while they are there they plunder its abundant natural resources ( though of course in the name of providing lobs for all those poor people )...

...could this be a classic win-win-win move for guys who play the game of Realpolitik...well if history is any indicator this is a strong could be...yes this can be subsumed under the banner of big lie but as we all know those are not really that hard to sell...WMD's anyone?...

Cheers

blutto

 

[flicker]

My neighbors point of view....

http://blogs.kqed.org/newsfix/2011/05/02/fremonts-afghanis-react-to-osama-bin-ladens-death/

Don't listen to me I am just a dumb native american....

 

[Stingray34]

My neighbors point of view....

http://blogs.kqed.org/newsfix/2011/05/02/fremonts-afghanis-react-to-osama-bin-ladens-death/

Don't listen to me I am just a dumb native american....

Okay, Flick...please stop now.

 

[flicker]

Okay, Flick...please stop now.

just listen to my neighbors in fremont, brother.....
You can say Bush was wrong.....
you can say he planned it all for his oil money....
listen to the afghanis on the KQED audio blog, i have personally met a few...
Go on PBS and look at the girls and women who are not allowed to go to school...
Everyone has a right to go to school, even girls and women..
no regime has the legitimacy to disfigure a girl or woman to want education...
that friend is the agenda of the Taliban, who chose to protect Bin Laden....

 

[Stingray34]

just listen to my neighbors in fremont, brother.....
You can say Bush was wrong.....
you can say he planned it all for his oil money....
listen to the afghanis on the KQED audio blog, i have personally met a few...
Go on PBS and look at the girls and women who are not allowed to go to school...
Everyone has a right to go to school, even girls and women..
no regime has the legitimacy to disfigure a girl or woman to want education...
that friend is the agenda of the Taliban, who chose to protect Bin Laden....

The White House didn't have to invade Egypt, Tunisia and and Libya to get their democracy cakewalk. Heck, even the Serbs did it themselves in 2000, more than 18 months after Clinton's bombs rained down on civilians.

Everyone hates the evangelists who darken their door. Ya gotta let countries work out their own shit. Of course, the White House isn't altruistic; it only invades countries for the White House's sake.

It seems to me your neighbours are more than a little afraid of the consequences of the cavalry's actions.