Cadel Evans, I told you it was his year.

[racing_like_scalded_cats]

He looks like this is his year as long as he does not have that inevitable bad day. I'd like to see him go on the attack and punish the Shreks. Probably not going to happen but would make this more exciting.

 

[Timmy-loves-Rabo]

Cry me a river Timmy... and I'm sure all new posters would be buoyed by your support... validation by the great man... well done champ. I'd argue some of your counter-claims, but then that would be like arguing with a fictional interwebs character... sort of meaningless.

Anyways... back on topic.... Cadel still seems to be sitting in a nice position. I can sense another 2nd... but hoping for a win... who knows? He's past the 2nd MTF that some experienced posters predicted he would fail on?

I wasn't the one having a cry was I. remember the whole.. wahh you called us july crowd wahhh, with flawed reasoning Anyway you failed to address my point because I assume you simply had nothing. Well done on your reply regarding nothing. You should learn to read.


@Acf I'm not P**sed off
I am sticking by my guns tho, I feel confident when schleck actually rides with some balls in the alps will be all over ACF.
At this point I will concede that cuddles is looking very good and he is in a great position. If I am wrong I ofc will take that cuddles avatar permenately


Anyway I have no problem with a cuddles thread (I do have a problem with 700 cuddles threads) and it is fine that others have different opinions but the point of a forum is to argue and discuss such topics. I feel the need to debate all the cuddles love going on here.
Or maybe I should be like. YA EVANS WOO, I LOVE THE LITTLE GREMLIN!

 

[blaxland]

I wasn't the one having a cry was I. remember the whole.. wahh you called us july crowd wahhh, with flawed reasoning Anyway you failed to address my point because I assume you simply had nothing. Well done on your reply regarding nothing. You should learn to read.


@Acf I'm not P**sed off
I am sticking by my guns tho, I feel confident when schleck actually rides with some balls in the alps will be all over ACF.
At this point I will concede that cuddles is looking very good and he is in a great position. If I am wrong I ofc will take that cuddles avatar permenately


Anyway I have no problem with a cuddles thread (I do have a problem with 700 cuddles threads) and it is fine that others have different opinions but the point of a forum is to argue and discuss such topics. I feel the need to debate all the cuddles love going on here.
Or maybe I should be like. YA EVANS WOO, I LOVE THE LITTLE GREMLIN!

I love Gremlins too Timmy....

 

[Timmy-loves-Rabo]

I love Gremlins too Timmy....

Andy should just throw water on evans
Maybe Evans thought cav was a gremlin

 

[Anonymous]

I have always wondered why Cuddles sits so low on his bike. He is a pro, and a successful one, but it has always seemed like he could pick up a bit on climbs if he raised his saddle. Far be it for me to question someone who has that much riding experience, but it does seem maybe he still has his mountain bike saddle height, which doesn't seem optimal for climbs like that. Just an observation.

 

[swuzzlebubble]

http://www.cyclingtipsblog.com/2011/05/giro-ditalia-stage-21-e-finita/#comment-214114840

I'm going to start a bet going on. I will buy willing to buy the top 10 users who get their name in first, Campy Bora ultra wheels, if and only if Cadel Evans ever wins the tour. I say again, if Cadel EVER wins Le Tour, I will be buying 10 users Campy Bora ultra wheels.

http://www.cyclingtipsblog.com/2011/07/le-tour-diary-stage-14/#comment-254735570

Ok people, I'm putting in an order of 10 pairs of Boras for those 10 lucky people. Once Cadel is in yellow in Paris, I'll have them shipped the next day. If he's not, then I guess I'll be having 10 pairs of spare Boras at home

 

[swuzzlebubble]

I have always wondered why Cuddles sits so low on his bike. He is a pro, and a successful one, but it has always seemed like he could pick up a bit on climbs if he raised his saddle. Far be it for me to question someone who has that much riding experience, but it does seem maybe he still has his mountain bike saddle height, which doesn't seem optimal for climbs like that. Just an observation.

His head tube is lower too.

 

[Damiano Machiavelli]

His head tube is lower too.

It is not how long your head tube is. It is how you use it.

 

[Spider1964]

<Anyway you failed to address my point because I assume you simply had nothing. Well done on your reply regarding nothing. You should learn to read>.

Sounds like a Seinfeld episode to me Tommy... See I misspelled that intentionally because you are so prone to misspellings that your message is sometimes lost? In your (original) reply, you stated "that post means noting"? By noting I assumed that you meant "that means noting"? But you actually meant "Nothing"?

So to address your point... you were giving Gesink a free pass if the injury had no effect. True. Then you said "I am certain he will beat him at the very least". Now silly old me took that to mean that you thought that Gesink was going to beat Cadel "at the very least", with or without the injury? How silly of me? IMO that statement was more a reflection of your Rabo love than a reflection of the race that Cadel had been riding to that stage, in my view Cadel had Gesink covered with or without his injury... just my view of course. And it seems the view of ACF94... thanks for the thanks ACF94

this changes nothing before peopel are like "what he can't climb??"

This as I even mentioned in many posts was going to be the MTF that suited him the most, and moreover considering some of the other riders who finished not that far behind (Tommy V etc) I refuse to drop my opinion.

Andy rode like a loser, only concerned with ac.
If he really goes for it at de bellie I am certain he beat cadel my 2min +

Moving past the misspellings... Andy again rode like a loser and he certainly did beat Cadel... By 2 Seconds.

Look, Peace bro. I realise it's easy to pick out random posts and pick them to pieces after the event and I commend you for having a go at making some predictions, but it's a bike race, random things are going to happen and there are so many factors that come into play that make it a difficult sport to predict the outcome. In my view Cadel is riding a stronger and smarter race this year... still working for him at this stage. Tough last week to come and as we know Cadel has had a difficult time of it on the steeper pitches and previous last weeks at the tour... maybe this year is different? I'm certainly hoping so.

I have always wondered why Cuddles sits so low on his bike. He is a pro, and a successful one, but it has always seemed like he could pick up a bit on climbs if he raised his saddle. Far be it for me to question someone who has that much riding experience, but it does seem maybe he still has his mountain bike saddle height, which doesn't seem optimal for climbs like that. Just an observation.[/quote]

+1

This was the first thing I noticed about this photo... He does seem very low, but I couldn't work out if it was the camera angle and the timing of the pedal stroke making him look so low? Or it may appear that way because Basso is on the hoods and Evans is in the drops?

 

[auscyclefan94]

I have always wondered why Cuddles sits so low on his bike. He is a pro, and a successful one, but it has always seemed like he could pick up a bit on climbs if he raised his saddle. Far be it for me to question someone who has that much riding experience, but it does seem maybe he still has his mountain bike saddle height, which doesn't seem optimal for climbs like that. Just an observation.

A better picture that may help your point is this picture

not saying you are right or wrong but he was never that low down in the past on climbs. He also seems to be sitting down on the climbs a lot more instead of swinging his bike around.

 

[Timmy-loves-Rabo]

Sounds like a Seinfeld episode to me Tommy... See I misspelled that intentionally because you are so prone to misspellings that your message is sometimes lost? In your (original) reply, you stated "that post means noting"? By noting I assumed that you meant "that means noting"? But you actually meant "Nothing"?

So to address your point... you were giving Gesink a free pass if the injury had no effect. True. Then you said "I am certain he will beat him at the very least". Now silly old me took that to mean that you thought that Gesink was going to beat Cadel "at the very least", with or without the injury? How silly of me? IMO that statement was more a reflection of your Rabo love than a reflection of the race that Cadel had been riding to that stage, in my view Cadel had Gesink covered with or without his injury... just my view of course. And it seems the view of ACF94... thanks for the thanks ACF94



Moving past the misspellings... Andy again rode like a loser and he certainly did beat Cadel... By 2 Seconds.

Look, Peace bro. I realise it's easy to pick out random posts and pick them to pieces after the event and I commend you for having a go at making some predictions, but it's a bike race, random things are going to happen and there are so many factors that come into play that make it a difficult sport to predict the outcome. In my view Cadel is riding a stronger and smarter race this year... still working for him at this stage. Tough last week to come and as we know Cadel has had a difficult time of it on the steeper pitches and previous last weeks at the tour... maybe this year is different? I'm certainly hoping so.

Like I said it was about gesink, maybe you shouldn't post a complaint post regarding another if you don't fully understand it. Anyway regarding bad spelling, I don't really care. This is a cycling forum, not a "I'm gonna play dumb because you made a few errors" forum.

Earlier I said people make stupid threads during the tour and thus the regular members get annoyed. This is a fact, don't get upset, just prove your not of those users with intelligent posting. Rather then crying about a sterotype that we regular members are using.

And lol @ you making assumptions. I am aware of my name, but I could care less about rabobank(I do respect what they are doing for dutch cycling tho). I often belittle the team management. I care for dutch riders, but I'm also realistic. I never thought Gesink was going to win this race, I suspected a podium was very possible. I have seen gesink outclimb evans many times in his young career, why wouldn't I be confident that he could beat Evans if not for the injury, especially with his improved ITT. But yeah I must be full of rabo love for using past performances. So that jab at me is based on nothing other then my user name I guess.

Anyway ACF is always of the opinion that cuddles > peloton. I don't even like schleck but I never thought any of my favorite riders could beat him (or AC if he didn't ride the giro).

Anyway I agree andy rode like a loser, I have said this countless times in other threads. I still think he will win tho. Time will tell.

 

[Spider1964]

Like I said it was about gesink, maybe you shouldn't post a complaint post regarding another if you don't fully understand it. Anyway regarding bad spelling, I don't really care. This is a cycling forum, not a "I'm gonna play dumb because you made a few errors" forum.

Earlier I said people make stupid threads during the tour and thus the regular members get annoyed. This is a fact, don't get upset, just prove your not of those users with intelligent posting. Rather then crying about a sterotype that we regular members are using.

And lol @ you making assumptions. I am aware of my name, but I could care less about rabobank(I do respect what they are doing for dutch cycling tho). I often belittle the team management. I care for dutch riders, but I'm also realistic. I never thought Gesink was going to win this race, I suspected a podium was very possible. I have seen gesink outclimb evans many times in his young career, why wouldn't I be confident that he could beat Evans if not for the injury, especially with his improved ITT. But yeah I must be full of rabo love for using past performances. So that jab at me is based on nothing other then my user name I guess.

Anyway ACF is always of the opinion that cuddles > peloton. I don't even like schleck but I never thought any of my favorite riders could beat him (or AC if he didn't ride the giro).

Anyway I agree andy rode like a loser, I have said this countless times in other threads. I still think he will win tho. Time will tell.

No, you misunderstand (again), it wasn't a complaint post... more like pointing out the fallibilities of some regulars. Heck, if I could use the search feature I'd find a time when one of TheHogs predictions came true

And, yes, it was a tongue in cheek jab at your username, don't get upset, because I'm definitely not. If you have a look at the dates we joined these here forums, you have one month seniority... just because I don't post as much doesn't mean I don't follow the forums on a regular basis. Work, kids and yes riding my bike take up too much time to commit to a high post count.

IF Andy grows a set and commits to an attack, then I agree with your opinion that he looks the likely race winner, but he needs to get going right about now. At the moment he (and his brother) are playing to Cadels strengths, rather than their own.

 

[timbat]

I found some stats for Cadel (source bikeradar):

Critical measurements
# Rider's height: 1.74m (5' 9") ; Weight: 68kg (150lb)
# Seat tube length, c-c: 470mm
# Seat tube length, c-t: 510mm
# Top tube length: 545mm (horizontal)
# Saddle height, from BB (c-t): 742mm
# Saddle nose tip to C of bars: 574mm
# C of front hub to top of bars: 536mm

He is much shorter than Basso for instance ... and his seat height not that high.

In order to get sufficient drop between saddle and bars thus he needs a short head tube and low handlebar .... witness his TT bike.

I have similar dimensions and have similar fit ...

 

[Timmy-loves-Rabo]

No, you misunderstand (again), it wasn't a complaint post... more like pointing out the fallibilities of some regulars. Heck, if I could use the search feature I'd find a time when one of TheHogs predictions came true

And, yes, it was a tongue in cheek jab at your username, don't get upset, because I'm definitely not. If you have a look at the dates we joined these here forums, you have one month seniority... just because I don't post as much doesn't mean I don't follow the forums on a regular basis. Work, kids and yes riding my bike take up too much time to commit to a high post count.

IF Andy grows a set and commits to an attack, then I agree with your opinion that he looks the likely race winner, but he needs to get going right about now. At the moment he (and his brother) are playing to Cadels strengths, rather than their own.

I never attempt to push my seniority on other users due to post count, like I said in one of my earlier posts I don't judge on post count, but rather quality of posts. Never meant to offend, for what it is worth I don't think you are a bad poster.

And don't worry I am not upset either. And I ofc respect why some users post less then others, as it is I have to much time at uni and work (in front of computer for both) I tend to post too much. Doesn't help I get little to no sleep either and will waste time after a stage arguing

--

you are right about cadel, so far the tour has gone perfect for him.
I gotta stick to my guns tho, when schleck really goes for it I see him winning the tour.

 

[JA.Tri]

I have always wondered why Cuddles sits so low on his bike. He is a pro, and a successful one, but it has always seemed like he could pick up a bit on climbs if he raised his saddle. Far be it for me to question someone who has that much riding experience, but it does seem maybe he still has his mountain bike saddle height, which doesn't seem optimal for climbs like that. Just an observation.

That!
Abso..bloody...lutely! Was the first thought when I saw this photo. Ivan looks relaxed and comfy...Cadel looks like he is jammed like a jack-in-the-box.

addendum: noted hoods vs drops...but thought applies to question of leg extension/compression.

 

[JA.Tri]

Who knows if Cadel stands on the top step of the Podium?

Based on my reading a significant number of posters still don't rate Cadel as a contender. My hope is he wins...but crash, sans, illness...(which can happen to anyone, especially crash) AND ultimate lack of ability may mean otherwise.

I don't think too many have written off Alberto (certainly not me), Ivan and Andy. Even Tommy is now (rightly IMO*) considered a significant possibility.

Luck, good management, serenity, supportive (psychologically) team, have favoured Cadel so far. Hopefully Cadel can stay with the "contenders" and in due course be considered a true contender.

*Tommy...as some others have pointed out his ITT has plenty of scope for an "apparent" improvement...his climbing is still abit of a question but boy he is impressive.

 

[mickkk]

Well the ole reverse psychology worked as treat. Still alive, just.

Nice to hear the Shrek moaning about Cadel, absolutely brilliant in fact. As discussed above, he will never look comfortable riding, thats just his way. A lot of it is the MTB origins. Push a big gear, none of this tempo rubbish, I reckon Ive seen Evans ride tempo once this tour and maybe once before.

Alp D`Huez, taken the day off to watch it. Its going to be on. Start of the climb, Alberto will go as soon as he can, all or nothing, if he doesnt stay away. The Shreks will then try to one two Evans at 15, 10 and 5 k from the finish. Always a chance one of them will crash in the next coupla days too!

Shouldnt forget to mention Hincape, if Evans wins it, he deserves a medal for his efforts too.

If it is not all out attack from the 4 favorites in an attempt to smash each other, none of them will win it.

 

[Dermie]

The bookies odds

Apparently PMU the French bookmakers, & the sponsors of the green jersey have the odds like this at the moment.

A Schleck 2.3 to 1
C Evans 2.9 to 1
A Contador 4.4 to 1
T Voeckler 10 to 1
F Schleck 10 to 1
I Basso 17 to 1
S Sanchez 35 to 1
D Cunego 175 to 1
R Uran 250 to 1
T Danielson 250 to 1
P Velits 350 to 1
N Roche 450 to 1

A tyre width for the top pozzie!!!

 

[movingtarget]

As others have noted, Evans is spending more time on the saddle than I have ever seen before. You could always picked him out before as he was the only one in the front bunch on the climbs out of the saddle or more than anyone else. He also seems to be riding lower gears and spinning more. Obviously working for him. Maybe this is to help with fatigue and tired muscles and also to respond to attacks a bit quicker ?

 

[Dermie]

A few years ago a vet racer who I respect (he wins a lot) told me that I needed to drop my saddle a bit and that I could bring my glutes into play a bit more whilst climbing. Although it did not do much for me as I am more of a sprinter, but I believe he knows what he is talking about.

 

[Anonymous]

A better picture that may help your point is this picture

not saying you are right or wrong but he was never that low down in the past on climbs. He also seems to be sitting down on the climbs a lot more instead of swinging his bike around.

Actually, yea, better picture for what I am talking about. He looks to be close to the bottom of his stroke, and look how much bend there is in his knee. Also look how much overlap there is between his knee and elbow. He looks like he is riding a keirin. Again, he is the best judge about his saddle height and riding position, but his position looks to me like a sprinters position as opposed to a climbers position. That may be because he knows that he he is a grinder and doesn't have a traditional climbing ability anyway, so he goes with his known strength. However, it does seem a little bunched up for climbing.

 

[Anonymous]

A few years ago a vet racer who I respect (he wins a lot) told me that I needed to drop my saddle a bit and that I could bring my glutes into play a bit more whilst climbing. Although it did not do much for me as I am more of a sprinter, but I believe he knows what he is talking about.

Funny, an old pro I know told me to raise mine many years ago. I guess maybe it is all personal preference. I know I ride with a saddle that is just below me having to drop my hip to make the bottom of the stroke, so I am at maximum height. For me, my calves have always been wicked huge, so that allows me to utilize them better. This trend to put the axle of the pedal in the middle of the foot to take them out of play is not for me certainly. I also see a lot of tri guys who look like they are trying to minimize their calf usage. I am sure there are good reasons for this, but I would feel freakish riding that way. I did a ride a couple of months ago on a new bike, and the seat was probably 3cm too low, and my thighs were baked and I couldn't climb for ****.

Like I said, Cuddles is the best judge of his riding position, and I see no reason for him to listen to some schmuck on a cycling forum about his riding position, I was just making an observation that was particularly apparent because he was riding next to someone who has a much more stretched out position in Basso.

 

[Oldman]

Actually, yea, better picture for what I am talking about. He looks to be close to the bottom of his stroke, and look how much bend there is in his knee. Also look how much overlap there is between his knee and elbow. He looks like he is riding a keirin. Again, he is the best judge about his saddle height and riding position, but his position looks to me like a sprinters position as opposed to a climbers position. That may be because he knows that he he is a grinder and doesn't have a traditional climbing ability anyway, so he goes with his known strength. However, it does seem a little bunched up for climbing.

The picture obscures his foot angle but he doesn't look like it's all the way flat, suggesting he might not be as low as it appears. We also don't know how much attonation he has which would necessitate some adjustments. Either way he's got a long upper body and top tube for his height.

 

[Angliru]

Nice shot!! Look at the intensity in the faces!

 

[Dermie]

I think Cadel still has good access to the Australian Institute of Sport (AIS) so consequently has the opportunity to deal with some of the best sport science/sport physiology scientists in the world. If they cannot get his position for his body right then no one can.