Cobo Talk Only

[roundabout]

Title says it all.

A guy who was pretty crap between Murcia and Burgos and who was allegedly close to retiring from the sport is now top-5 and might even win.

Shifty even by Matxin's shifty standards.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Compare his results away from Gianetti with his Gianetti results.

 

[Benotti69]

Compare his results away from Gianetti with his Gianetti results.

I wonder why David Millar didn't find Cobo suspicious compared to Piepoli and Ricco

 

[Fergoose]

I wonder why David Millar didn't find Cobo suspicious compared to Piepoli and Ricco

I hate to say it and put on my cynic cap, but I'm in full agreement on this one. Performed to the same standard as Piepoli and not much worse than Ricco back in the day for a team that was so badly rumbled that they had to withdraw. Enough said.

I was relieved to see his old and current teammate de la Fuente denied the stage win today thanks to some master tactics!

EDIT: What is the testing regime at the Vuelta this year? Does the stage winner or top 3 still have to provide a sample?

I think I read a post here suggesting that various tours were no longer conducting tests and that the Vuelta could be one of these?

 

[hrotha]

Cobo is hilarious.

 

[roundabout]

I hate to say it and put on my cynic cap, but I'm in full agreement on this one. Performed to the same standard as Piepoli and not much worse than Ricco back in the day for a team that was so badly rumbled that they had to withdraw. Enough said.

I was relieved to see his old and current teammate de la Fuente denied the stage win today thanks to some master tactics!

EDIT: What is the testing regime at the Vuelta this year? Does the stage winner or top 3 still have to provide a sample?

I think I read a post here suggesting that various tours were no longer conducting tests and that the Vuelta could be one of these?

There's testing in the Vuelta but we're talking about a rider who wasn't caught in the 2008 Tour when Ricco and Piepoli were.

 

[Fergoose]

There's testing in the Vuelta but we're talking about a rider who wasn't caught in the 2008 Tour when Ricco and Piepoli were.

I know, although pulling the team may have spared Cobo a positive. I'm under no illusions about how possible it is to evade tests. I was just wanting to know if there was any chance of him being found out before I start throwing things at the TV as he rides to victory tomorrow.

 

[Benotti69]

I hate to say it and put on my cynic cap, but I'm in full agreement on this one. Performed to the same standard as Piepoli and not much worse than Ricco back in the day for a team that was so badly rumbled that they had to withdraw. Enough said.

I was relieved to see his old and current teammate de la Fuente denied the stage win today thanks to some master tactics!

EDIT: What is the testing regime at the Vuelta this year? Does the stage winner or top 3 still have to provide a sample?

I think I read a post here suggesting that various tours were no longer conducting tests and that the Vuelta could be one of these?

When you consider the Spanish attitude to Op Puerto and Fuentes i doubt anyone will test positive and definitely no Spanish riders. But there were 2 I was actually surprised that last year Nibali didn't test positive in revenge for Valverde.

Saying that last year 2 positives found by a lab in Koln were David Garcia Da Peña and Ezequiel Mosquera for hydroxyethyl starch.

 

[GreasyMonkey]

Saying that last year 2 positives found by a lab in Koln were David Garcia Da Peña and Ezequiel Mosquera for hydroxyethyl starch.

Sacrificial Lambs......

Take two riders from a lower status team, throw them to the anti-doping Gods as appeasement for others' sins. Unfortunately one of them ended up on the podium.

 

[hrotha]

You know the race organizers and the RFEC have nothing to do with the antidoping tests, right?

 

[Benotti69]

You know the race organizers and the RFEC have nothing to do with the antidoping tests, right?

in the real world, but cycling hardly lives in the real world.

 

[Mrs John Murphy]

So does anyone know what the testing regime for the Vuelta is?

To be fair since Kolobnev we've not had any test failures - so there will no doubt be a couple of obscure (probably east european riders or aging Italian riders) to be busted.

 

[GotDropped]

Here's a guy who in a quick 10 question interview named his biggest inspiration to be Piepoli, a guy who he had to let beat him in a stage in the 2008 tour and subsequently got done for cheating. You would have thought he would have felt cheated by the man... unless Cobo was doing the same.

 

[palmerq]

I thought cobo was banned, or did he just hide for a while and come back, no doubt in my head he was doping back in the day, as for now, who knows.

 

[luckyboy]

Last year he did absolutely nothing with Caisse d'Epargne. DNFed almost every stage race he entered and got 0 CQ points.

 

[The Hitch]

JJ rode for Caisse last year?

Live and learn i guess.

 

[WillemS]

I would like to see some investigation into the performance of Cobo also. I don't if he doped, but he might.

But I don't think testing during a GT will reveal everything, doping pre-race is on the most important things in a good doping program. Train harder, condition your body. Did you know that placebo-effects of medication can be partly conditioned? Sometimes this is counter-productive (Environmental cues in a heroin addict's home causes body preparations before the shot, therefore increasing his tolerance. A shot taking without those cues can therefore cause an overdose as the body hasn't prepared for the usual dose.) Pain killers sometimes work in the opposite direction, killing more pain. Maybe conditioning doping during training with cycling effort can cause a placebo doping-like body effect during cycling effort in a race, without the actual doping product present. That's just a bold hypothesis.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

I thought cobo was banned, or did he just hide for a while and come back, no doubt in my head he was doping back in the day, as for now, who knows.

I have half a mind to suggest he might have been clean last year with Caisse. To go from the top 10 of the Vuelta to 0 CQ points without illness or injury, then back to the top 10 of the Vuelta again when reunited with the old Saunier Duval team, is more than a bit suspicious.

 

[craig1985]

I'm surprised Cobo isn't riding for The Hog. But seriously, he's more dodgier than a used car salesman IMO.

 

[Ferminal]

More than likely was totally doped in the past, but if others in the top5 of GC are clean perhaps we should afford Cobo the same luxury.

Alternatively he may not be any good without the sauce, and has kept up his 07-08 habits whilst everyone is is getting "cleaner".

 

[hrotha]

I have half a mind to suggest he might have been clean last year with Caisse. To go from the top 10 of the Vuelta to 0 CQ points without illness or injury, then back to the top 10 of the Vuelta again when reunited with the old Saunier Duval team, is more than a bit suspicious.

I don't think the difference between Caisse and Matxín Cobo is one of clean vs doped. His level at Caisse was below what any minimally-talented clean rider should be able to achieve. It might be a matter of clean + no confidence due to not being on a program vs doped and confident in his own abilities, though.

 

[la.margna]

cobo rules. just back in highly improved form.

 

[LukeSchmid]

While Cobo doping, clean, doping is certainly a possible explanation for his horrid 2010 it is also possible that he was not happy a Caisse, spat the dummy and did not try. Perhaps he wanted to be leader and they said he had to work for others.

 

[Paco_P]

More than likely was totally doped in the past, but if others in the top5 of GC are clean perhaps we should afford Cobo the same luxury..

All right, I'm prepared to believe he's as clean as Wiggins and Froome.

 

[WillemS]

All right, I'm prepared to believe he's as clean as Wiggins and Froome.

I do not. The history of cycling killed my good faith. Whether he doped, I don't know. I think, with or without doping, he is a decent rider and in a totally clean cycling world he may or may not reach this kind of performance in a grand tour. But we do not live in utopia, Cobo has an amazing comeback from nothing to top 5 in a GT. We should be critical of that and take a closer look.

He might be "as clean as" Wiggins and Froome, he might be dirtier, he might even be cleaner. As far as I'm concerned, we can't really tell definitively. We need research for that, and transparency about that research. I don't know how good the former is, because the latter, transparency, is lacking. As for now, all I can conclude is that he may be clean or he may be doped, but that he's pulling off some amazing work. Until we take some major steps in anti-doping, that's probably the most we are going to be able to say about any rider, performing or not.