Comprehensive Climbers Ranking

[mithro]

Not only that. Seixas was at altitude following a monk training protocol while Jonas (as far as I know) still hasn't been at altitude and casually drops better opposition on harder terrain.

Jonas was training at Tenerife already.

 

[BubbaChuck]

My man you gotta put CDA on upper limit for San Remo.It was great perf by pog,but he could be better.

 

[Peyresourde]

My man you gotta put CDA on upper limit for San Remo.It was great perf by pog,but he could be better.

Do you have specific knowledge or a source on Pogacar's CdA? I already set it extremely low. Maybe I am too high on the CRR which is also more important at high speeds, but it is not like Cipressa is the smoothest road in the world.


Maybe he can do even better, but then the other riders can just pack in and go home.
Could you tell what you base your opinion on that he did not do that great?

If it is just because he did not drop Pidcock: Pidcock is probably the second/third best rider in the world on 5 minute efforts and at those speeds you save a lot in the draft.

 

[vappa]

Do you have specific knowledge or a source on Pogacar's CdA? I already set it extremely low. Maybe I am too high on the CRR which is also more important at high speeds, but it is not like Cipressa is the smoothest road in the world.


Maybe he can do even better, but then the other riders can just pack in and go home.
Could you tell what you base your opinion on that he did not do that great?

If it is just because he did not drop Pidcock: Pidcock is probably the second/third best rider in the world on 5 minute efforts and at those speeds you save a lot in the draft.

I think it was meant because he was greatly aided by a convoy of motos very close before him. That alone should make every calculation basically impossible to get accurately

 

[BubbaChuck]

0.275–0.310 range.So you get 7.4 on cipressa nd 7.3 on poggio.

 

[BubbaChuck]

BTW Tom was swimming in free air behind pogacar. Even when got up, he was riding in vacuum. peopele dont understand poagacar engine.

 

[VayaVayaVaya]

@Peyresourde how would you assess Remco 2022/2024 vs Roglic 2023/2024?

 

[Old-school]

If you also look at shorter climbs, Seixas in Faun Ardeche did a stronger performance than Vingeggaard on Pal for certain.

I don't know about details of your calculation of Seixas performance, but I've seen a calculation from a reliable source which considers a difference of 20 watts(std watts 70 kg) compare to Pogi performance during the 2025 EC. Because of wind favorable for him versus headwind for Pogi.

 

[Peyresourde]

0.275–0.310 range.So you get 7.4 on cipressa nd 7.3 on poggio.

I used a CdA in the 0.28 range and calculated with the J. Martin method and used 60kg etalon w/kg to get to my result. So in real watts, he did a bit less then the 7.94 I had as my result as he is heavier than 60kg.

7.4 for Cipressa definitely seems impossibly low for me. How would he destroy the whole peloton with those watts? I am 1000% certain he pushed more than 7.4 w/kg. The moto-escort also happened on the Poggio and not yet on the Cipressa.

@Peyresourde how would you assess Remco 2022/2024 vs Roglic 2023/2024?

The climbers ranking is on page 1 and most of the 10 performances used there are from those years. In terms of w/kg, they were almost at the same level those 3 years.
Roglic used to be more consistent and better at fresh w/kg, while Evenepoel might have been better after high kj stages (when on form).

I don't know about details of your calculation of Seixas performance, but I've seen a calculation from a reliable source which considers a difference of 20 watts(std watts 70 kg) compare to Pogi performance during the 2025 EC. Because of wind favorable for him versus headwind for Pogi.

Are you talking about velo2max?

The climb is in east-west direction. If I remember correctly, the wind changed from south to north (the two prevalent wind directions in the Rhone-valley) just before they did the climb.

It does not really matter much if south or north (both neutral wind directions for the climb). It is theoretically possible that the wind there changed just during the climb and was more of a tailwind for a very short timeframe. But this is really stretching it and extremely unlikely.

 

[BubbaChuck]

You are right, it was crazy oerformance. 7.94 is very good estimation.