ContadorÂ’s legal team hit back at WADA report

[Hugh Januss]

Like I said, some people at WADA/UCI get paid "by the positive".

Any chance you have anything at all to back up this statement?

 

[sniper]

Like I said, some people at WADA/UCI get paid "by the positive".

Leak$ are a very profitable business you know... And licks too.

Like I said, pure speculation. Or pure licking.

 

[Ripper]

Like I said, some people at WADA/UCI get paid "by the positive".

Leak$ are a very profitable business you know... And licks too.

Some ACD quotes

"I ain't got no beef with the system"

"There is no meat to this story"

"Paddy is a cow!"

"They're just trying to grind me into hamburger!"

 

[hektoren]

Like I said, some people at WADA/UCI get paid "by the positive".

Positively wrong, though. Positvely wrong. I work on the inside of the inside of their system, and you're just ever so wrong. Please do clarify, though, whaddya mean "some people". I might have nipped out to lunch that day, but AFAIK, you're dead wrong. Which sort of makes one wonder a bit about your agenda here.

 

[Ripper]

Positively wrong, though. Positvely wrong. I work on the inside of the inside of their system, and you're just ever so wrong. Please do clarify, though, whaddya mean "some people". I might have nipped out to lunch that day, but AFAIK, you're dead wrong. Which sort of makes one wonder a bit about your agenda here.

Oh come on Hek! You know it's a conspiracy. We all know Osama b-L is in charge of WADA

 

[Dr. Maserati]

I've already answered that: Those within WADA or the UCI who leaked the story to the German journalist.

Just because you ask the same question three times does not mean you haven't been given an answer. You may just not accept the answer, but that is an entirely different story.

So, it was either WADA or the UCI - that doesn't really narrow it down too much does it, unless you are suggesting it was a conspiracy between them all....also, you do realise that whoever leaked the story actually told the truth! That Contador had failed a dope test - how can telling the truth about someone be 'character assassination'?

I don't know. You ought to pose that question to the German journalist who got the story leaked from the WADA/UCI employee(s). I certainly was not involved, so I can't give you an exact number. You see, leaking a story is like jumping from a 10-story building: All I need to know is what happens at the beginning. Anything in the middle and the end I can pretty much figure out how it went on my own.

And yes, it would be extremely foolhardy to think that the leaking of the story did not involve $$.

No - I will ask you - as you were the one to suggest that "WADA get paid by the positive" - so again, how much?
I have heard of the UCI getting paid to hide positives.

When you insinuated that I objected (or not) to Fuyu Li's sanction? Like I said, I did not know who Fuyu Li was until a couple week ago.

I didn't just insinuate it - I came right out and asked where was your outrage on Fuyu Li - which you have repeated you did not know his case.
So, that is actually truthful - you are suggesting that this was a lie.

No, the German media were going to make it public and Alberto did it first to save some face. But you already knew this, so I really ignore as to why you must be reminded of things that you already know...

Oh, I know what happened all right - but what I don't know is the why.
Why did the UCI (& Contador) hide the positive for over a month - when the UCI publicly announced Fuyu Li's positive the same day he was notified of his A sample being positive.

 

[Señor_Contador]

Positively wrong, though. Positvely wrong. I work on the inside of the inside of their system, and you're just ever so wrong. Please do clarify, though, whaddya mean "some people". I might have nipped out to lunch that day, but AFAIK, you're dead wrong. Which sort of makes one wonder a bit about your agenda here.

If that's the case why do some of these positives seems to find their way to the media before they're even made public by WADA or the UCI (or whoever is in charge of making it public)?

I mean, I work for a huge financial conglomerate and I would NEVER under any circumstances stick my neck out for them on anything that was not related to what I do. I mean, why would you side with all the employees of an organization when you know some of them have leaked info to the media?

It's always amazed me how obediently protective some of you, supposed WADA employees, are.

The mafia's got nothing on you. That's for sure.

 

[Hugh Januss]

If that's the case why do some of these positives seems to find their way to the media before they're even made public by WADA or the UCI (or whoever is in charge of making it public)?

I mean, I work for a huge financial conglomerate and I would NEVER under any circumstances stick my neck out for them on anything that was not related to what I do. I mean, why would you side with all the employees of an organization when you know some of them have leaked info to the media?

It's always amazed me how obediently protective some of you, supposed WADA employees, are.

The mafia's got nothing on you. That's for sure.

To repeat the most important question here

Why did the UCI (& Contador) hide the positive for over a month - when the UCI publicly announced Fuyu Li's positive the same day he was notified of his A sample being positive. ?

Perhaps someone wanted to prevent another LA Tour de Suisse type situation?

 

[Benotti69]

If that's the case why do some of these positives seems to find their way to the media before they're even made public by WADA or the UCI (or whoever is in charge of making it public)?

I mean, I work for a huge financial conglomerate and I would NEVER under any circumstances stick my neck out for them on anything that was not related to what I do. I mean, why would you side with all the employees of an organization when you know some of them have leaked info to the media?

It's always amazed me how obediently protective some of you, supposed WADA employees, are.

The mafia's got nothing on you. That's for sure.

for me this is a serious accusation of another poster without and evidence and should be withdrawn or at least deleted.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

for me this is a serious accusation of another poster without and evidence and should be withdrawn or at least deleted.

To be honest (IMO) it isn't a "serious accusation" - it is a very weak attempt to deflect from answering the allegation that he has brought up, that WADA is paid to get positives (which is remarkable as WADA don't do any testing!).

Leave the post there - and let them attempt to back up there comment, and if they can't it merely offers an accurate reflection of their posting style on this issue.

 

[Benotti69]

To be honest (IMO) it isn't a "serious accusation" - it is a very weak attempt to deflect from answering the allegation that he has brought up, that WADA is paid to get positives (which is remarkable as WADA don't do any testing!).

Leave the post there - and let them attempt to back up there comment, and if they can't it merely offers an accurate reflection of their posting style on this issue.

it is a weak attempt but any attempt from such a troll should be deleted.

this guy is being a right Rucío.

 

[Dallas_]

response to post #343 by Aguirre

There are right now more possibilities of clearing Contador than judging him guilty. Even UCI thinks that, then major problem is WADA, but I'm comvinced that in this case, so irregular since the beginning, Contador will be cleared.

Scientifically speaking, science cannot prove maybe the meat contamination, but neither the other way round, I mean, science cannot prove the blog transfussion, this is a ridiculous speculation and the plasticers added to that are just specualtions created in forum threads, but is not science and the famous danish guy was simply speculating. Speculation are not facts!

Will have to disagree with you Aguirre on a few points.I cannot see any possibilities of ac being cleared and I am sure that the UCI does not think with you on that point. You are welcome to rebuff me with a link, where the UCI have
issued a press release stating he maybe cleared.

Point 2 is you mention irregulariies from the beginning. Well I have read quite a few posts agreeing with you on that point. I am sure that all the correct UCI protocols have been followed since day 1. Sure there was a leak, but can anybody
verify where the leak originated from ! and is it relevant ! The leak does not alter the facts. Again you are welcome to show me the UCI protocols and where they have been breached by the UCI(ie not media speculation)

Point3 regarding the meat, lean,mean&green gave a very valid response on page 35
of which I 100% agree

cheers dallas

 

[Aguirre]

Will have to disagree with you Aguirre on a few points.I cannot see any possibilities of ac being cleared and I am sure that the UCI does not think with you on that point. You are welcome to rebuff me with a link, where the UCI have
issued a press release stating he maybe cleared.

Point 2 is you mention irregulariies from the beginning. Well I have read quite a few posts agreeing with you on that point. I am sure that all the correct UCI protocols have been followed since day 1. Sure there was a leak, but can anybody
verify where the leak originated from ! and is it relevant ! The leak does not alter the facts. Again you are welcome to show me the UCI protocols and where they have been breached by the UCI(ie not media speculation)

Point3 regarding the meat, lean,mean&green gave a very valid response on page 35
of which I 100% agree

cheers dallas

not agree, I think there is a confussion in this case between law and science. In fact this is the main problem in the politics of anti-Doping. I repeat "the politics of anti-doping".

Contador case is putting this relationship (in between law and science) under a new light (not to mention the rol of the media and public spheres -forums, etc- in this TRIAL)

And regarding the clen in his body: well, we can see a Hollywood film regarding proofs than made guilty innocent people, a Harrison Ford film?

 

[theswordsman]

First details about the meeting with the Competition Committee and some of the studies they might have been given.

http://www.intereconomia.com/notici...ador-basa-informes-cientificos-defensa-comite

In case there are any Contador fans left in the thread, he has a big anniversary on the 27th. It's good he'll be spending it with friends and new teammates. Here's a video of him talking about it. Click "CC" under the video for a choice of subtitles.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zh7-Mc0W_Ac&hd=1

I'm curious about the reaction here to Alberto not threatening to retire, but suggesting he might do it if he receives any punishment at all. For those of you who think he's a doper, maybe even since Operation Puerto, how can you be angry with him for his willingness to leave the sport? I would think it would be great news for you. I used to post positive links in the other side of the Forum, and people flamed me and him then. So if you dislike the guy so much, and a couple of months from now he could walk away from the sport you love forever, that should be a good thing, right? You never have to give him another thought. People who are glad that he's suffered since late August, want him to suffer more, be banned for two years, then come back willingly so you can give him grief again - why? I would think you would all high five if he retires under duress, and move on to the next one. The guy doesn't owe you anything.

 

[Benotti69]

i for one would be happy if Contador doesn't man up and accept his 2 year ban by walking away from the sport. another doper gone. Hurray.

his history in the sport suggests he has been doping from day 1. He as i posted before seems to feel like Landis that he played the game and that game is too dope within the limits of the tests and he did, but wtf did this new test come from that no one told him about and if he knew he wouldn't have got caught so now he is crying and he is upset that he got caught and no one else did.

the doping is still too prevalent in the sport, the evidence, all the top names have not jumped on Contador and said "if it is true he doped i hope they throw the book at him" None of them felt cheated, why? because they are all doping.

 

[Señor_Contador]

for me this is a serious accusation of another poster without and evidence and should be withdrawn or at least deleted.

In that case, who the heck is leaking these stories to the media? I mean, if you know (at the time) only people within WADA and the UCI have knowledge of the positive... how can you honestly say that it is a "serious accusation"?

 

[Señor_Contador]

So, it was either WADA or the UCI - that doesn't really narrow it down too much does it[...]

No, of course it doesn't! One is in charge of the testing protocols and the other sanctions the majority of the profesional cycling events... Merely circumstantial I'd say.

unless you are suggesting it was a conspiracy between them all....also, you do realise that whoever leaked the story actually told the truth! That Contador had failed a dope test - how can telling the truth about someone be 'character assassination'?

Because it is not WADA's job to make positive tests public. At the very least, the should let Alberto do the talking. Or the UCI. It's as if Obama's addresses all of a sudden are leaked to the National Enquirer.

No - I will ask you - as you were the one to suggest that "WADA get paid by the positive" - so again, how much?

I don't have any information on amounts. Like I said to you, if you want to know now much money exchanged hands all you have to do is call the German journalist who got the story and ask him how much he/she paid.

I have heard of the UCI getting paid to hide positives.

Precisely. It would be foolhardy to think that they do not manipulate postives to their benefit. Yes, in this case they kept news of Alberto's positive under wraps, and that's also wrong.

I didn't just insinuate it - I came right out and asked where was your outrage on Fuyu Li - which you have repeated you did not know his case.
So, that is actually truthful - you are suggesting that this was a lie.

For the umpteenth time, I didn't even know who Fuyu Li was! What is wrong with you?

I don't speak for the saving of the Amazon forest, stopping the slaughter of the humpback whale, saving Tibet, et cetera; that does not mean I oppose those things. It takes a certain type of individual to understand otherwise.

 

[Señor_Contador]

To be honest (IMO) it isn't a "serious accusation" - it is a very weak attempt to deflect from answering the allegation that he has brought up, that WADA is paid to get positives (which is remarkable as WADA don't do any testing!).

Leave the post there - and let them attempt to back up there comment, and if they can't it merely offers an accurate reflection of their posting style on this issue.

Let me ask you something: Do the labs get the samples with the person's name all over the container, or is it just a code?

 

[Señor_Contador]

And as far as the "characted assassination" claim goes... listen to Alberto's inverview in http://www.gazzetta.it and his answer to the question of him being treated fairly by the media, to which he said:"No, not at all. I've been a victim of a very intense campaign with no other goal but to calumny, vilify and slander Alberto Contador".

Straight from the mouth of the lion.

 

[Dallas_]

not agree, I think there is a confussion in this case between law and science. In fact this is the main problem in the politics of anti-Doping. I repeat "the politics of anti-doping".

Contador case is putting this relationship (in between law and science) under a new light (not to mention the rol of the media and public spheres -forums, etc- in this TRIAL)

And regarding the clen in his body: well, we can see a Hollywood film regarding proofs than made guilty innocent people, a Harrison Ford film?

in reply Aguirre, I will have to begin by replying in part to your paragraph 2.

The role of a forum is NOT, in my opinion going to influence the outcomes of this case.
However, some could argue the media can. At the moment I perceive that ac and his team have used the media very effectively and with their press releases have gained an advantage. This could possibly sway the RFEC to pass verdict of 6 months or in fact innocent.

As I stated in posting #317, I believe the UCI and/or WADA will appeal to CAS.
100 top class media releases by ac and team will not influence any part of this procedure.

Now in reply to paragraph 1: You can perceive a confusion between law and science.
I have tried, but cannot see any. The only paralell I can give is an example of law and science : Someone is on trial for robbery and the prosecution have 2 forensic exhibits.
The only difference between the 2 cases is one is sports law and the other is criminal law
In both cases protocols have to be adhered to. I cannot see a political problem.

Have only seen one Harrison Ford movie. What the hell is going on in this movie. Maybe
the person writing the storyline was on cocaine at the time

As you can see with my writing style, I did not get a university education

cheers dallas

 

[Señor_Contador]

Imagine, just imagine the laws of the country you live in have a lax tolerance of alcohol intake and set a blood alcohol concentration (BAC) limit of 0.08 for the entire country. Imagine your town decides to tackle fatal DWIs by lowering the BAC to 0.02, even though they know 0.02 does not affect driving.

What happens if you get stopped after you've had 3 beers, you get tested and you are shown a 0.06 result? Would it be fair to sanction that person even though the local authorities know that his 0.06 WILL NOT impede him being able to drive?

Most of all, would it be fair to penalize that person? Yes, he broke the local town's rules and regulations, but...

Let's just sit back and think for a second. What is the reason for the local authorities to lower the BAC level? To reduce the number of fatal DWIs. Ok. What is the precursor to DWIs? Well, studies show that 95% of fatal DWIs were caused by drivers with a BAC of at least 0.125. Thus one can deduce that the reason to lower the BAC on the part of the local authorities is not to lower the number of fatal DWIs but to make people's lives a living hell. You can then either take action against the rule (which many people would reject as they are very good at following the rules... that is, unless the problem comes to them) or not.

Now, just because you're taking action, or speaking, against the rule does not mean you're for fatal DWIs, it just means you're against an overreaching rule. By the by, the local authorities usually punish people because it is ALWAYS the easiest route: Most are obedient. The unruly ones are usually neutralized by the obedient ones and, let's face it, it's a lot easier and more profitable to raise more capital from DWIs thand to spend a lot more money on upgrading the road and lighting system.

 

[Benotti69]

In that case, who the heck is leaking these stories to the media? I mean, if you know (at the time) only people within WADA and the UCI have knowledge of the positive... how can you honestly say that it is a "serious accusation"?

lots of people had knowledge, Contador and his team, UCI, Wada, ASO and the lab in Cologne. Since the German media broke the story i imagine there is German link to the leak.

Who cares who leaked it. He tested positive. He hasn't denied the positive. He claims he ate meat with Clenbuterol. So what. He had an illegal substance in his test. He takes the ban unless he can prove without doubt how it got there. And I doubt that.

Now his defence is based on it could not have had any performance enhancement.

Well we could all claim that. Drink driving, taking cocaine etc....lets make the rules to suit ourselves as we go along.

 

[Der_Gestreifte]

Imagine, just imagine the laws of the country you live in have a lax tolerance of alcohol intake and set a blood alcohol concentration (BAC) limit of 0.08 for the entire country. Imagine your town decides to tackle DWIs by lowering the BAC to 0.02, even though they know 0.02 does not affect driving.

What happens if you get stopped after you've had 3 beers, you get tested and you are shown a 0.06 result? Would it be fair to sanction that person even though the local authorities know that his 0.06 WILL NOT impede him being able to drive?

Most of all, would it be fair to penalize that person?

This analogy doesn´t work at any level.

a) there is no lower limit for clen, so no one could have lowered it arbitrarily
b) no one has changed the rules, they merely used a better test
c) at least here in Germany (no punishment at 0.05, max limit at 0.08) you´re screwed when you cause an accident (i.e. do damage), even whith a BAC of 0.02

 

[Aguirre]

in reply Aguirre, I will have to begin by replying in part to your paragraph 2.

The role of a forum is NOT, in my opinion going to influence the outcomes of this case.
However, some could argue the media can. At the moment I perceive that ac and his team have used the media very effectively and with their press releases have gained an advantage. This could possibly sway the RFEC to pass verdict of 6 months or in fact innocent.



everybody knows in our days that forums are part of the global media, aren't?
Forums affect the media as well as media affects forums etc

 

[Bag_O_Wallet]

in reply Aguirre, I will have to begin by replying in part to your paragraph 2.

The role of a forum is NOT, in my opinion going to influence the outcomes of this case.
However, some could argue the media can. At the moment I perceive that ac and his team have used the media very effectively and with their press releases have gained an advantage. This could possibly sway the RFEC to pass verdict of 6 months or in fact innocent.



everybody knows in our days that forums are part of the global media, aren't?
Forums affect the media as well as media affects forums etc

In that case.... RFEC, please ban AC for 2 years.